Buckeye Breed Thread

[Pathfinders]

Right, the individuals showing their birds don't get to choose the judge at all. However, that's not to say that a breed club can't request one or two judges in particular who are familiar with their breed to be involved in judging their class. It's not "fixing" so much as trying to ensure that the judges who will be evaluating the birds are familiar with the breeds they are judging. Some judges will try to evaluate Buckeyes as though they are just pea combed Rhode Island Reds, for example, even though the type of the two breeds is distinctly different. If the breed club members know that a judge with a history of doing such a thing is on the list of judges they can request a judge that is more familiar with their breed standard to judge their class. It doesn't mean that the show committee will put that judge on the panel for that class, but there's nothing against the rules to request a judge that is more familiar with certain breeds. And it only increases the odds of any particular bird winning best in show if they are as good or better than the other breeds represented that day.

Exactly correct.

A breed club can only request a judge, not choose it. As I said in my original post, the ABPC will make a request to the show committee. They may choose to honor it, or ignore it. All we can do is ask. And we do so for precisely the reasons Aina mentions above, to try to ensure that the judge working with the Buckeyes will have a thorough knowledge of them, that's all.

There is no ulterior motive, nor attempt to "fix" anything.

The only goal is to make sure whoever is judging the birds is well versed in them.

 

[taylynnp]

My 9 week olds have been enjoying their grow out pen and free ranging most of the day. If I'm going to be gone they stay secured until I'm back home. One is starting to crow. It's so cute to see him flap his wings in effort to crow! lol

I've noticed their feet color has greatly improved in the 3 weeks that they moved outside. I wonder if it was the yellow and orange flowers in my flower bed?

At what age do you stop free choice feeding if they are free ranging? I would like to feed them once or twice a day. But I know they are still growing so maybe they need constant easy food still.

And can I wean them off providing grit in their feeder now? I still think of them as babies!



This is their grow out hoop house. It's shady most of the day but we have since added a tarp on top for more rain protection. There's a wooden coop connected at the back with a salvaged metal roof.

 

[Minniechickmama]

taylynnp- I LOVE YOUR SET UP!!!
As for feeding. I never keep feed in front of my birds. I give them what they require for a day and that is it. This is for a couple of reasons: 1.)chickens are notorious food wasters! and 2.) it allows me to gauge more of what their intake is to detect if any are not eating and if something is effecting my birds to cause them to eat less. Aside from getting really hot out, the other thing that would cause them to eat less is illness. Plus, overfeeding will allow those who are not in need of it a chance to put on unnecessary weight which in turn effects not just their health, but their efficiency as an egg producer.

As for leg color, if they are getting at some grass and little critters from the ground, that will help with their color.

Great job you are doing!

 

[Pathfinders]

My 9 week olds have been enjoying their grow out pen and free ranging most of the day. If I'm going to be gone they stay secured until I'm back home. One is starting to crow. It's so cute to see him flap his wings in effort to crow! lol

I've noticed their feet color has greatly improved in the 3 weeks that they moved outside. I wonder if it was the yellow and orange flowers in my flower bed?

At what age do you stop free choice feeding if they are free ranging? I would like to feed them once or twice a day. But I know they are still growing so maybe they need constant easy food still.

And can I wean them off providing grit in their feeder now? I still think of them as babies!



This is their grow out hoop house. It's shady most of the day but we have since added a tarp on top for more rain protection. There's a wooden coop connected at the back with a salvaged metal roof.

Nice! I use hoop houses for young birds and breeding pens too, love that they're easy to make, but the downside for us here in windy KY is that we have to tie them to trees or stake them down, otherwise they make big kites!

I do think it's a good idea to continue to provide food to birds, even those who day range. If you ask a chicken to get all its nutrition just from ranging, you may find you will have lower egg production and smaller birds when butchering for meat.

So continuing to use feed to supplement range is pretty essential, IMO.

 

[taylynnp]

Thanks! Our hoop house is over built to the point of it being pretty heavy to keep it predator proof. There are coyotes and foxes around. So hopefully it doesn't sail away!

Oh, yes Laura, I absolutely plan to still feed them even though they are free ranging.

I just feel like I'm over feeding them right now by keeping the feeder mostly full as if they were chicks and so much food is getting wasted. I want to reduce the amount that I'm feeding them and maybe get to just 1-2 meals a day if they are old enough for that. At 9 weeks old, I just don't want to cut them down too much.

 

[buffalogal]

"At what age do you stop free choice feeding if they are free ranging? I would like to feed them once or twice a day. But I know they are still growing so maybe they need constant easy food still.

And can I wean them off providing grit in their feeder now? I still think of them as babies!"

With the exception of the birds locked up for brief periods in a breeder pen to produce hatching eggs, my entire flock is free ranging 24/7/365. Nevertheless, I like to keep oyster shell and a mixture of corn/oat/BOSS in feeders out for them full time in part because it keeps them 'anchored' to my house (as opposed to wandering farther and farther afield and out into the woods until they disappear) and partly because it gives even the lowest ranking birds in the flock a chance to eat. I've found that throwing out feed once or even twice a day only teaches the birds to curb their foraging because they don't want to miss the dinner bell. But by keeping feed out all the time, they eat in the morning, spend the majority of the day foraging and finally eat a bit before they roost at night. I've not had any issues with wasted feed, since all my feeders are elevated, and the lower ranking birds will be underneath picking up anything that falls. For your young birds, once they're on the ground foraging during the day, they'll find their own grit. If the land around you doesn't have much natural grit or gravel, you can toss out a coffee can's worth every now and then. It doesn't have to be in a feeder, the birds will find it out in the grass, and they'll have more fun doing it.

 

[PA Farmer24]

Now for my soap box. two topics. Color and demeanor.

Very disappointed in hearing about an article that came out in the Poultry press recently regarding the coloring of the Buckeyes. It seems that many people are trying to keep the coloring lighter than what Nettie truely intended. In my understanding of reading all the historical content available that the Buckeye. Dark mahogany was what was in her vision. Color was very important to her and should still be an important part of a good breeding system. Although Color should not override the other traits of a good buckeye as required by the SoP, it still needs to be in the top of the breeding qualities to produce a Buckeye meeting the SoP requirements.

When someone new comes around and is trying to learn about this breed to figure out if they are for them or not it really hard for that person. Meaning there seems to be many BAD representations of the breed out there and are being passed off to newbies as good breeding stock. Just a shame. Although one of the first things anyone sees is color but it's whats beneath the color that is even more important. But color will always stick out first especially for a newbie who knows no difference.

Another thing that I have heard from many people is the demeanor of the breed, Buckeyes are docile and are very sweet. Yes that is true. However, the birds that are being obtained from hatcheries seem to be on the wild side and are not as docile as ones that are being breed by Good breeders. I feel that this is attributed to the lines/strains used to start the recovery of the breed over at the ALBC. They were just thrown together and bam we now have a bird that someone wanted to call a Buckeye. Flood the market to people who wanted to help bring the numbers up and become what some call so called "breeders" when truely they are not "breeders" they are just people who think they are and are just a money pit with false impressions. I think this happens in every breed of animal and it is just sad.

I hope that if there are newbies out there reading this that they do their home work and really read and understand the breed of their choice before just jumping in and going with the first bird they see. Go to shows, fairs, breeders adn really dig and understand the breed whether it be a Buckeye or another breed. If you can't do some of those things then get lots of picutres and videos to review to help you see and understand what you are looking at. Buy the SoP and read it. Do't be fooled by what some claim to be as "internet Experts" Everyday there are more of these popping up. Search Facebook for the breeds you want to learn about. Search the APA, ABA websites get contact info and start your research. If it takes you a year or more so be it. It will be well worth the time as you are investing in a breed of Poultry for the betterment of the breed.

Now off my soap box and let the discussions begin.

 

[Pathfinders]

Dear Dave,

Here is the article for you, once you read it I am sure it will be clear what I was saying. Here it is, in its entirety:

Poultry Press Article 6/10/13​

The American Buckeye Poultry Club’s President and Vice President are up to their ears in alligators this month, so the task of writing our monthly column has fallen to me, Laura Haggarty. I’ve been busy this year hatching chicks and raising birds, as always. I was able to get a few more hatches out than I’d counted on because we’ve had a lovely cool spring this year, and that’s been a good thing.

One question that seems to come up around this time of year from folks is, “How do I tell if it’s a pullet or a cockerel?”

Here’s how I reply:

I generally find I can start to determine gender at or around 12 weeks or so, sometimes earlier. A good way to try to determine males from females is to look for saddle feathers.

Hold a bird with the head facing you, looking down on it so you can see its back. When you look at the feathers just in front of the tail, which are called the saddle feathers, are they pointy, or rounded?

Pointy saddle feathers mean it's a male bird, or cockerel. Rounded saddle feathers mean it's a female bird, or pullet. Same thing with hackle feathers.

As well, hackle and saddle feathers of males will be glossier than females, whose feathers will be duller and less shiny.

Cockerels generally have thicker shanks; bigger, redder combs; and are generally larger and heavier than pullets of the same age.

I find it very advantageous to separate out the sexes as early on as I can, because the larger cockerels do tend to be pushier when it comes to food and water, and I like to give the pullets an equal chance to get at the feed.

As well, I find that by removing any gender issues, it keeps the cockerels from getting too randy, and keeps them calmer as they are growing out. I try to move the pens of males farther away from the females as they grow, so they eventually cannot even see or hear the young females. Out of sight is out of mind, as the saying goes.

One other thing I realized this month, after I wrote a blog post about it, was that it seems many people are unaware that Buckeyes, like any other breed of chicken, will fade in color if exposed to direct sunlight. Because many people who breed Buckeyes do like to let them day range (myself included), we have to deal with the damage sun does to the feathers, which tend to bleach out somewhat.

Interestingly, some lines/strains of Buckeyes have a tendency to fade much more than others, so as always it is important to know what lines/strains are in the birds you purchase from a breeder. Some folks have suggested that using paprika as a feed supplement will ward off the effects of sunlight on the feathers, as this is commonly used in the horse world for this purpose. While feathers and hair are both made of keratin, I don’t know for sure if this would work, and will need to experiment with it before I can pass judgment on its effectiveness. And if you show your birds, you can always keep them inside if you’re worried about them fading in the sunlight. It’s just that easy.

One other thing to note about color in your Buckeyes, about which I’ve seen incorrect information being posted online, is that the presence or lack of slate bar does NOT predict the overall color of the bird. Some folks insist that you have to have really strong slate bar to have correctly colored birds. Nonsense! I’ve had light birds with more than adequate slate bar, and correctly colored birds who were totally lacking it, so when folks make that sort of claim I always shake my head, because it’s simply not true.

And above all folks, I’ll also reiterate, make sure you’ve got your type down first before worrying overmuch about color. Make sure you have read the current Standard of Perfection for Buckeyes (not some old version from 1918 or something), which can be found here, at the website for the American Buckeye Poultry Club: http://www.americanbuckeyepoultryclub.com/Standard.html
and get your birds correct with type: correct wing carriage; tight combs; rather long, broad, sloping backs, etc. Then you can worry about color.

And in the meantime, keep hatching if you can, and grow those youngsters out to be healthy, happy Buckeyes!"

Now. Nowhere in that article do I suggest or imply or even say that I am "trying to keep the coloring lighter than what Nettie truely (sic) intended. "

Far from it. Just read the article and you will see that what I am saying is, and which all experienced breeders of colored poultry know is, that sunlight fades the color from feathers.

It's just that simple. Of course I strongly encourage people to choose and breed birds that have color that matches the Standard of Perfection, that's what everyone who works with Buckeyes should do. As the SOP says, the base color should be an "even shade of rich mahogany bay."

But any bird, red, black, yellow, even white, will have color that will suffer if exposed to the sun, that's just a given. That was all I was saying in the article.

And I agree completely, that those new to the breed should do their homework and find source birds that are purebred Buckeyes, not those that have recently had an infusion of blood from other breeds (like Dark Cornish, or Partridge Chantecler, for example), as adding such other breeds in to the Buckeye breed carries with it a ton of problems that can take years to breed back out again.

Doing your homework is always a good idea, on that we totally agree.

 

[fowlman01]

There are very few real breeders of any breed of chickens. There are a lot of propagators though. Reproducing poor specimens of chickens is very easy and the internet is a great place for wanna be's to become "experts" or worse yet..."breeders". If they have done it for over 10 years they might be a breeder....if they haven't....don't trust them.

Walt

 

[buffalogal]

"Very disappointed in hearing about an article..."

Seriously? You logged on here to complain about an article you hadn't even read yet?

Lucky for you Pathfinders is willing to share.