Chickens in Permaculture

[lazy gardener]

I was getting ready to go look that up and see what I can find out; I have heard of it, but haven't investigated it yet, lol I keep getting sidetracked!

Lol I know what you mean with the leaves... Only AFTER I had raked almost an acre of trees to get a nice batch of leaves for my pile, I read Bees trick of driving around snagging everyone's already raked and bagged leaves... Lol needless to say, I hung up the rake in shame that day ha-ha

Between that and chucking frozen pumpkins around and chasing the rogue 3 musketeer BRs for the last few days, I'm thinking if having people pay ME to come workout in my yard lol

What kind of plants are you considering for the orchard? Sounds like you're getting ready to do something BIG

The orchard is already planted, and it's a mini! We took down all of the trees between the house and the property line. The house sits close to that property line, so, it created a narrow strip that is about 50' wide and 200' long. It gets good sun, but when the excavator got done with it, any good soil had been buried, and all that was left on top was heavy clay subsoil and a lot of rocks. So, I spent the first fall and a lot of last summer pulling rocks and tree roots/stumps, filling in some of the low spots, and last summer planted the trees in a straight line: 2 apple, 2 plum, 3 apricot, 2 high bush cranberry, 2 hazelbert, 2 juneberry, 2 Siberian pea. I have also planted 1 seedling pear (to be grafted when it gets some size), 2 elderberry, an other Siberian pea, and some lilacs along the front of the property. Interspersed between the trees are some Bocking #14 Comfrey, rhubarb, and I will get around to planting some strawberries. Have garlic and daffodils planted at the base of most of the orchard trees. Along with the BTE approach in the orchard, I plan to "clump plant" benneficials to attract the good bugs, and discourage the bad guys. The area is too wet, but I'm hoping that the BTE approach will correct that problem. I'm pulling enough rocks to get a decent rock wall started along the property line for the entire 200' orchard, and culling the dead wood off the neighbor's property to build up my HK mound at the NW edge of the cleared land.

 

[Leahs Mom]

Quote: I am in Northern Indiana so not a mild climate in winter. I'm almost at the border of Michigan and Indiana.

I do think the soil is good on most of the property. It's just that acre or so of sandy that is frustrating. I do think I could build up the soil.

This is the kind of plantain I'm referring to:

Broad leaf:

My grandma used to refer to these as "rat tails". She'd pick the rat tails when they were at the seed stage and put them in her canary's cage (Dickie-Bird). He loved them!

Narrow leaf:
We call these "buckthorns". We would use them to shoot at each other when we were kids by bending the stem over itself and sliding it up to pop the head at each other

The leaves can be used medicinally (supposed to be great for bee or wasp sting if used as a poultice. Has to be mashed or "chewed" then put onto the sting. Also edible in several ways.

http://www.eattheweeds.com/white-mans-little-foot-dwarf-plantain-2/

There are many different varieties but the ones pictured above are the ones we have here.

 

[lazy gardener]

I have a recipe tucked away somewhere for a salve made of Plantain and Jewel weed to treat poison ivy and other skin issues. Hoping to make some next year.

 

[mlowen]

I have a recipe tucked away somewhere for a salve made of Plantain and Jewel weed to treat poison ivy and other skin issues. Hoping to make some next year.

I made a plantain salve, last year, and it really worked on mosquito bites to stop the itching.

 

[shortgrass]

The orchard is already planted, and it's a mini!  We took down all of the trees between the house and the property line.  The house sits close to that property line, so, it created a narrow strip that is about 50' wide and 200' long.  It gets good sun, but when the excavator got done with it, any good soil had been buried, and all that was left on top was heavy clay subsoil and a lot of rocks.  So, I spent the first fall and a lot of last summer pulling rocks and tree roots/stumps, filling in some of the low spots, and last summer planted the trees in a straight line:  2 apple, 2 plum, 3 apricot, 2 high bush cranberry, 2 hazelbert, 2 juneberry, 2 Siberian pea.  I have also planted 1 seedling pear (to be grafted when it gets some size), 2 elderberry, an other Siberian pea, and some lilacs along the front of the property.  Interspersed between the trees are some Bocking #14 Comfrey, rhubarb, and I will get around to planting some strawberries.  Have garlic and daffodils planted at the base of most of the orchard trees.  Along with the BTE approach in the orchard, I plan to "clump plant" benneficials to attract the good bugs, and discourage the bad guys.  The area is too wet, but I'm hoping that the BTE approach will correct that problem.  I'm pulling enough rocks to get a decent rock wall started along the property line for the entire 200' orchard, and culling the dead wood off the neighbor's property to build up my HK mound at the NW edge of the cleared land.

Sounds like a wonderful area! You'll have some nice fruit to choose from
I want some apple trees added, and somebody actually ran over one if our peach trees, dintcask, we think someone was drunk and missed their turnoff lol, so now we have a big hole to fill

Have you considered hives at all?

 

[shortgrass]

I am in Northern Indiana so not a mild climate in winter. I'm almost at the border of Michigan and Indiana. I do think the soil is good on most of the property. It's just that acre or so of sandy that is frustrating. I do think I could build up the soil. This is the kind of plantain I'm referring to: Broad leaf: My grandma used to refer to these as "rat tails". She'd pick the rat tails when they were at the seed stage and put them in her canary's cage (Dickie-Bird). He loved them!

Narrow leaf: We call these "buckthorns". We would use them to shoot at each other when we were kids by bending the stem over itself and sliding it up to pop the head at each other

The leaves can be used medicinally (supposed to be great for bee or wasp sting if used as a poultice. Has to be mashed or "chewed" then put onto the sting. Also edible in several ways. http://www.eattheweeds.com/white-mans-little-foot-dwarf-plantain-2/ There are many different varieties but the ones pictured above are the ones we have here.

Oh ok! Lol I looked up plantain and got "bananas" hahaha We have those too! We call them "duck plants" lol, because the ducks go nuts for them, now I know why! It's beautiful looking soil, though. It's holding ALOT of nitrogen, I would say.. Your area is very fertile, BITH from the lakes and from runoff of phosphates and nitrogen from area farms... I've looked at maps of ground fertility and around the great lakes is one if the most fertile ground in the US... Take advantage of that plantain lol, its a great example of permaculture; ie looking at what seems to grow in abundance naturally, and instead if eradicate it, use it to your benefit! If I recall, those have some big thick taproots, so they are excellent for breaking up heavy soil.. I would try some companion planting by them; try a tomato in the spring next to a few of them, and test the soil that way. Tomatoes are great at dying to tell you what's in the soil lol And making salve! Hey I didn't know that.. You have a medicine cabinet in your yard!

 

[lazy gardener]

The plantain that I'm familiar with has a fairly shallow root system.

SG: Yes, I have considered hives. I'd love to have some. But at this time, and point in our lives, I'm not ready to take on the learning curve, or the work/expense involved in set up and maintenance. Something to look forward to when I can retire.

 

[aart]

The plantain that I'm familiar with has a fairly shallow root system.

SG: Yes, I have considered hives. I'd love to have some. But at this time, and point in our lives, I'm not ready to take on the learning curve, or the work/expense involved in set up and maintenance. Something to look forward to when I can retire.

I'm seriously considering bees right now, had a little windfall that would cover setup.....
....doing a lot of research and have an excellent mentor lined up.
But am still hesitant, mostly due to the weight lifting involved as I want the Langstroth style and even the 8 frame mediums are 30 pounds when full.
Have a month or so to decide whether to pull the trigger and go for it.

 

[centrarchid]

I do honey bees and prefer the 8 frame hives even though I am a big boy. The supers and brood chambers themselves not a problem. Moving entire hives across county more problematic.

Learning curve is evident and you will need to learn more biology that beekeepers of old had to know.

 

[aart]

I do honey bees and prefer the 8 frame hives even though I am a big boy. The supers and brood chambers themselves not a problem. Moving entire hives across county more problematic.

Learning curve is evident and you will need to learn more biology that beekeepers of old had to know.

Very well aware of the huge learning curve, am pretty well versed in biology and insects in particular.....
....and have a retired science teacher with 6 years hive experience as my local hands on mentor.

Thinking about lifting 30+ pounds without using my body as a fulcrum, in a bee suit with gloves,
without jiggling it and pissing off a bunch of stinging insects gives me the heebiejeebies.