Cochin Bantams and Frizzle Cochin Bantams!!

[Laurel Meadows]

That's pretty much my understanding also.  Certain breeds usually call it lavender, and other breeds call it self-blue, but basically the same.  I had a self-blue Slate turkey.  I'm planning to get self-blue OEGB's, but I have lavender orpingtons!  LOL    I have blue cochins, but I think just blue, not self-blue. 

There is a genetic difference between the blue that comes from blue/black/splash genes and lavender genes, but I can't explain it enough to make sense.  Lavenders and self-blues carry 2 copies of the lavender gene.  I know nothing on the Isabell side.

Lol everytime I see your Lav Orps hatch I keep telling myself I need to get some of those!
Yes, you're exactly right- the Blue gene color is totally different than self-blue. The easiest way I can explain it, is that Blue doesn't breed true. It dilutes black to different degrees. For example:
Blue x Blue = 50% blue, 25% black, 25% splash offspring
Blue x Black= 50% blue, 50% black
Blue x splash= 50% blue, 50% splash
Black x splash= 100% blue

Self-blue(Lav) x Self-blue(Lav) = 100% Self-blue (Lav) offspring
If you cross a self blue with a solid bird of a different color- say, a solid black, you get:
Self blue(Lav) x Black= 100% black "split" offspring (split for lavender). Birds carry the lavender gene but appear solid black.

Along with the self blues, I really like the Blue color too. I have BBS Copper Marans, large fowl blue and black Cochins, and my month old bantam BBS mottled Cochins.

Ive been thinking about starting a self-blue mottled bantam cochin project down the road. I haven't seen that combination yet but I bet it would be really pretty!

 

[shahtir101]

I have a bantam Cochin cockeral that I am offering free to a good home. I have to many roosters and can't keep him. He is 5 weeks old and is really friendly. I am in the Sacramento,CA area. Let me know if you are interested!

 

[Puddin Fluff]

Lol everytime I see your Lav Orps hatch I keep telling myself I need to get some of those!
Yes, you're exactly right- the Blue gene color is totally different than self-blue. The easiest way I can explain it, is that Blue doesn't breed true. It dilutes black to different degrees. For example:
Blue x Blue = 50% blue, 25% black, 25% splash offspring
Blue x Black= 50% blue, 50% black
Blue x splash= 50% blue, 50% splash
Black x splash= 100% blue

Self-blue(Lav) x Self-blue(Lav) = 100% Self-blue (Lav) offspring
If you cross a self blue with a solid bird of a different color- say, a solid black, you get:
Self blue(Lav) x Black= 100% black "split" offspring (split for lavender). Birds carry the lavender gene but appear solid black.

Along with the self blues, I really like the Blue color too. I have BBS Copper Marans, large fowl blue and black Cochins, and my month old bantam BBS mottled Cochins.

Ive been thinking about starting a self-blue mottled bantam cochin project down the road. I haven't seen that combination yet but I bet it would be really pretty!

That is a really good description. How far along will they have to be so that you know if they are blue or black? Can the blue be a dark color or is it always the lavender color? I have a chick that is a blue/black (so the egg was marked by the breeder) but I don't know exactly what I am expecting with the color.

This is the chick at 4 weeks. She looks more dark gray than a deep black in person.

All this color genetics still throws me. I would love to hear what you think.

 

[Laurel Meadows]

That is a really good description. How far along will they have to be so that you know if they are blue or black? Can the blue be a dark color or is it always the lavender color? I have a chick that is a blue/black (so the egg was marked by the breeder) but I don't know exactly what I am expecting with the color. This is the chick at 4 weeks. She looks more dark gray than a deep black in person. All this color genetics still throws me. I would love to hear what you think.

With most of my chicks, I can tell right after they hatch whether they will be blue or black. Your blues usually have light to medium gray coloring from day one. Blacks at hatch often are very dark gray to soft black. Then when they start feathering in, your blues can definitely have very dark (almost black) looking wing feathers, but the rest of the down fluff is still lighter gray. Here's a pic of some of my 2 week old Blue Copper Marans where you can see that:

And here is a pic of my Cochins where you'll see it can be very close between black and blue wing color but looking at the head and neck fluff you can tell for sure.

The little guy on the right is a blue. The pullet next to him is a black mottled. Your pic is throwing me off a little (I'm looking at it on my phone) but it almost looks like a red-brown tint to the down, and it could just be my phone or the lighting in the pic but maybe another view from a different angle might help. She sure is cute! I see what looks like blue on the legs & outer toe and if you're definitely seeing gray wing feathers its most likely a blue. With Blue, you can definitely get lighter or darker shades in adult plumage. I've seen pics of blues that are really light, washed-out blue. They almost look like self-blues but they aren't. Definitely very pretty but are not what most breeders go for when breeding to SOP. For that purpose, you want to see the nice deep blue-gray with lacing. Here is one of my hens with some lacing:

It can be tricky to tell sometimes, though. I would say if yours turns out to be Blue, it looks like it should have the nice deep coloring But if it does have the red tint, I've not seen a blue start out like that.

 

[Puddin Fluff]

With most of my chicks, I can tell right after they hatch whether they will be blue or black. Your blues usually have light to medium gray coloring from day one. Blacks at hatch often are very dark gray to soft black. Then when they start feathering in, your blues can definitely have very dark (almost black) looking wing feathers, but the rest of the down fluff is still lighter gray.

Here's a pic of some of my 2 week old Blue Copper Marans where you can see that:



And here is a pic of my Cochins where you'll see it can be very close between black and blue wing color but looking at the head and neck fluff you can tell for sure.

The little guy on the right is a blue. The pullet next to him is a black mottled.

Your pic is throwing me off a little (I'm looking at it on my phone) but it almost looks like a red-brown tint to the down, and it could just be my phone or the lighting in the pic but maybe another view from a different angle might help. She sure is cute! I see what looks like blue on the legs & outer toe and if you're definitely seeing gray wing feathers its most likely a blue.
With Blue, you can definitely get lighter or darker shades in adult plumage. I've seen pics of blues that are really light, washed-out blue. They almost look like self-blues but they aren't. Definitely very pretty but are not what most breeders go for when breeding to SOP. For that purpose, you want to see the nice deep blue-gray with lacing.
Here is one of my hens with some lacing:


It can be tricky to tell sometimes, though. I would say if yours turns out to be Blue, it looks like it should have the nice deep coloring But if it does have the red tint, I've not seen a blue start out like that.

Thanks. I am excited to see how they all feather out. I have a variety pack! I have 4 LF Lemon Blues and each one is looking different, two look like lemon splash one is definatly LB and the third is a red/brown black I don't know what color. Then I have 4 bantams - one each silver laced. Mil Flur, blue mottled and blue/black. So - I understand enough about genetics to know that you don't always get something that looks like the parents but I am just excited to see what I do end up with!

 

[Laurel Meadows]

Thanks.  I am excited to see how they all feather out.  I have a variety pack! I have 4 LF Lemon Blues and each one is looking different, two look like lemon splash one is definatly LB and the third is a red/brown black I don't know what color.  Then I have 4 bantams - one each silver laced. Mil Flur, blue mottled and blue/black.  So - I understand enough about genetics to know that you don't always get something that looks like the parents but I am just excited to see what I do end up with!

Wow what a great variety! Sounds like you're going to have a very pretty flock! Hope you'll post some pics when everyone feathers in

 

[spazy67]

They grow so fast

 

[Puddin Fluff]

Wow what a great variety! Sounds like you're going to have a very pretty flock! Hope you'll post some pics when everyone feathers in

This was at about 4 weeks. They are coming up on 5 now. Only one is hiding in this pic.

 

[BirdsNRabbits]

Thanks for all the information on the color genetics! Chicken color genetics confuse me so much, and the only good website I can find is the kippenjungle website with the genetic calculator but it confuses me. I'm used to dealing with rabbit genetics which are considerably a lot easier than chicken genetics. In rabbits you have a core 5 gene groups with the most complicated group only having 5 different genes so its pretty easy.

 

[Laurel Meadows]

Thanks for all the information on the color genetics! Chicken color genetics confuse me so much, and the only good website I can find is the kippenjungle website with the genetic calculator but it confuses me. I'm used to dealing with rabbit genetics which are considerably a lot easier than chicken genetics. In rabbits you have a core 5 gene groups with the most complicated group only having 5 different genes so its pretty easy.

Glad it was helpful! I'm still learning a lot myself! Chicken genetics kind of brings out my inner-nerd

I have all kinds of papers with notes with different crosses and my gene cheat sheets...lol

I'd love to get some rabbits at some point. I have to wait until we can get some more coops built before we get to bunny housing, though.