Farming and Homesteading Heritage Poultry

[WallTenters]

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Very good point, while it is important to retain a wide pool gene, focus should be on promoting utilitarian breeds which for various reasons become unpopular like Delawares (replaced by modern meat hybrids), or RIR originals replaced by lame "production reds" and other "sexlinks" by hatcheries pushing egg production over true dual purpose bird idea.

I remember real RIR,s from my mother's flock, they laid dark brown eggs for several years and their meat was more like Cornish meat in quantity and quality.

Todays " brown egg dual purpose breeds including RIR's (Production Reds) lay pale eggs and their meat resembles more of a Leghorn meat that a "dual purpose" bird.

For heaven's sake if I want record breaking egg producer, I get Leghorns, nothing beats them in quantity of eggs and efficiency.

If I want dual purpose breed" I want a bird which lays well AND produces carcass containing some meat not mostly bones like most current hatcheries "dual purpose breeds".

This is very important, but we must not stray from the boundaries of that breed - otherwise we're not breeding that breed at all but are creating our own version of production reds, etc.

 

[jhudson]

After over an hour I have finally read all the posts. I have been raising chickens for years, and until recently have only had sex-links for egg production. I had 1 flock of cornish X last year and am in the middle of processing a flock now. I grew up with a dad who worked for Perdue so I really have nothing against the cornish X. As some have said here, it gives me 6lbs of meat in 6 weeks. With the economy what it is now, if it doesn't produce, it doesn't stay around long. I raised a few delawares a few years ago and enjoyed them. After reading all of this, my concern is that GOOD heritage birds are very hard to find and when you do, they tend to be pricey. I think I saw an auction for barred rock eggs (10 of them) sell for over $200. I don't know about you guys, but I just can't justify $20 an egg, and still don't know if it will hatch. Having to live on a budget limits me as to where I get my chicks..hatcheries, feed stores. As was stated earlier, if the heritage breeds are going to survive, I think a better network needs to be in place to help those who want to raise them be able to obtain them. Is there a breeder list anywhere? This forum is so big now, I may have missed it.

 

[WallTenters]

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I agree. I have a hard time paying that much for eggs as well. I could do it, but the hatchability is what gets me - it seems like in the end you could be throwing good money after a dozen empty eggs after shipping takes its toll. I guess it would depend on the birds.

On the upside, my experience with Dominiques is that most breeders are actually cheaper shipping chicks than the hatcheries, and for much higher quality. By the time we factor in the shipping, which many breeders include in their per chick price, we've paid more for hatchery birds both short and long term. When we got a shipment of chicks from Bob Berry, his were 1/5 the cost of the hatchery birds, and we've had WAY more eggs from his pullets. His line has its faults - very dark on some of the birds and a few funky combs, but all in all the quality is much better and they have been a big step above the hatchery birds for much less money.

I think it's breeders like Mr Berry that we need more of. He may not show his birds and many of his birds aren't coming close to the standard, but the genetics are there for nice birds (we've kept several pullets and one cockerel that all seem really nice - first show in April will tell!) and he does a good job with keeping to what the birds were meant for, as far as I can tell. If everyone on this thread could take birds like that, and cross them in with true SQ lines that have been shown and refined, we'd all have much better birds that were productive, tasty and beautiful as well.

I know there are breeder lists for the individual breeds, but perhaps a true breeder list for heritage birds is in order? I know that most breed clubs have their own breeder's list as well, which is really a good resource as many of the best breeders of birds out there aren't spending as much time on BYC as we all do

.

 

[biomistake]

Just a little information on the NH and BR auctions... the wonderful owner of those birds was asked by several people on BYC to place the auctions. They finally convinced her to do it... Now How much of that was just pure greed to drive the auction up that for those eggs? Reminds me of the Marans bubble the last few years ya know???? I am positive if you will contact Ms Kathy she will be happy to add you to the list and even mail you HATCHED CHICKS!!!! yes believe it or not she will... She obtained those birds to help spread, maintain, and improve those heritage breeds, not make a mint off of them. * I do not blame her at all if she does make a bit off of them because HIGH QUALITY POINT OF LAY BIRDS ARE NOT CHEAP!!!!* I am on that list and happy to be on it even though it may be the end of the year before she even gets around to me or even next year. Dedicated breeders are hard to come by so be aware of all the facts... Not all of the people that bid on the eggs could pay anywhere that much either. I bet most of them will be on her list for eggs / chicks *their choice*. I will have to add though, if you got to an auction take plenty of money and be ready to spend it ya know? I do not go to the cattle auction with $100 in my pocket. There have been plenty of individuals posted who have eggs and chicks for sale at very reasonable prices for the work they have put into the stock... There is an old saying you get what you pay for and you cant make a silk purse out of a pig's ear. No excuses get on someone's List for your favorite bird or quit whining and making excuses. Not trying to be rude or mean but I just see way too much whining and trying to reinvent the wheel on these very very educational and informative forums. I personally thank the individuals who take the time to share their knowledge and insight which we would otherwise have to struggle along for years to get where they are... Learn from them, take what parts work for your situation. People rant against ideals because of ignorance... Ignorance is merely a lack of knowing yet stupidity is knowing and continuing to do the wrong thing. Be adaptable and quit looking through blinders as that only makes for more problems... I see people ranting about the SOP *its all about looks* well go find one borrow one buy an old used one they have skeleton layouts of good and bad for comparison. Pages and pages of things to look for positive and negative. As you use the SOP your objectives will be achieved on the meat and the egg section... Like all other breeding issues a mans product is only as good as the work invested by the husband of of the flock i.e. why its called Animal Husbandry eh???

Chickens cost a lot to feed these days and we are having to get creative to keep them so please do not scream and cry over the prices of high quality chicks as if you have chickens you know exactly how much it cost just to get a pullet to the point of lay much less maintaining her for the next 3-4 years.

Rant ended

P.S. I did not bid on either one of the auctions as I did not care to spend a tremendous amount of money either... but I am still on the list to get some of those wonderful birds.... Patience grasshopper Rome was not built in a day!!!!

 

[punky rooster]

 

[kathyinmo]

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I agree. I have a hard time paying that much for eggs as well. I could do it, but the hatchability is what gets me - it seems like in the end you could be throwing good money after a dozen empty eggs after shipping takes its toll. I guess it would depend on the birds.

That was my auction. I hope you noted that I started that auction at $20. With the high amount my auction went for, I could not just send out 10 eggs. I would have been sick at heart to hear of a bad hatch after spending that much money. I offered to hatch them, and am doing that. The auction winner will be getting well over 10 eggs worth of chicks, I can assure you.

I want these heritage birds out to as many people that want them, too. I am NOT in this for money. I want to preserve this strain. It is also in my best interest to get them out there too, so that someday I can get get back "new blood," from the same strain, if needed.

 

[biomistake]

JHudson, I am fully aware of the budget issue as I am going through a personal issue right now. I bet if you contact Ms Kathy or Jeremy or someone on the boards with good birds they would surely work with you. Keep chuggin along and it will wind op being all good in the end

 

[WallTenters]

Kathy, I wasn't meaning that I thought the auction was unfair or badly priced - your birds are beautiful. I was just trying to agree in saying I can't spend that much on eggs (in reality)... but if I saw Dominiques as nice as your BRs up for auction, I'd be bidding along side everyone else even though realistically it's out of my price range. My DH always supports my addiction

.

I live in Oregon, so it's hard for us to buy eggs because by the time they make it through the several elevation changes and the long haul, most if not all breeders live all the way across the country from us... but, we're going to try. We are really hoping to get our hands on good genetics and you do get what you pay for (or at least you hope) as one of the previous poster's commented.

ETA: How awesome that you're able to hatch the chicks for the auction winner. We need to see more heritage birds like yours - true to form and function - spread across the country!

 

[jhudson]

biomistake....I won't dignify your "rant" with a response. You totally missed my point.

 

[HaikuHeritageFarm]

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Try living in Alaska!

I think I'm finally ready to gamble and try some eggs up here. I'll let you all know how it works out!