Favorite Tomato

[MeepBeep]

Plants also grow in 100% lime and 100% sand.  The nitrogen seems to come from the air.

Nitrogen fixing bacteria and nitrogen fixing archaea in the soil convert airborne nitrogen into a form usable by the plants aka 'the nitrogen cycle' as plants themselves are unable to use the airborne (N2) nitrogen directly as it's too strongly bonded to itself...

 

[SittinDuck]

Nitrogen fixing bacteria and nitrogen fixing archaea in the soil convert airborne nitrogen into a form usable by the plants aka 'the nitrogen cycle' as plants themselves are unable to use the airborne (N2) nitrogen directly as it's too strongly bonded to itself...

Sounds good, but there is no "soil" in lime or sand.

 

[MeepBeep]

Nitrogen fixing bacteria and nitrogen fixing archaea in the soil convert airborne nitrogen into a form usable by the plants aka 'the nitrogen cycle' as plants themselves are unable to use the airborne (N2) nitrogen directly as it's too strongly bonded to itself...

Sounds good, but there is no "soil" in lime or sand.

Soil is the median the plants are growing in that will support life, the actual composition varies drastically... In your case the lime, sand and whatever bacteria or archaea happened to have found their way into it would be the soil, even though it's not a tradition compost type soil...

It takes more energy to break N2 apart then plants get from re-combining the nitrogen, they (with few exceptions) simply can't and don't use airborne nitrogen directly...

 

[SittinDuck]

Soil is the median the plants are growing in that will support life, the actual composition varies drastically... In your case the lime, sand and whatever bacteria or archaea happened to have found their way into it would be the soil, even though it's not a tradition compost type soil...

So, they find their way in the same way the fermenting bacteria find their way into pickle brine?

 

[MeepBeep]

Soil is the median the plants are growing in that will support life, the actual composition varies drastically... In your case the lime, sand and whatever bacteria or archaea happened to have found their way into it would be the soil, even though it's not a tradition compost type soil...

So, they find their way in the same way the fermenting bacteria find their way into pickle brine?

Yep, they find their way from cross contamination due to touch, water, through the air or by whatever other means... Some plants like legumes that have a symbiotic relationship with their own brand of nitrogen fixing bacteria generally have the bacteria on the seeds already... This is why legumes are considered a nitrogen replacing crop, as they bring their own brand of bacteria over and above the stuff already in the soil, their bacteria lives on their roots instead of just in the soil and produces far in excess of the nitrogen the plant itself uses thus returning nitrogen to the soil...

 

[texpat]

Wood chips are big, so I can't see it being a big problem.



From left to right: potting soil, 100% wood chips, 100% crushed limestone, 100% play sand, dirt/compost mix, compost.

All planted at the same time.

If wood chips were that big of a problem, a plant shouldn't be able to grow in 100% wood chips. They would surely suck up all nitrogen, but they don't.

Plants also grow in 100% lime and 100% sand. The nitrogen seems to come from the air.

(The wood chips look black because they've been wet for a few weeks.)

It's important to note that I am not adding wood chips to my garden, I am adding the lignin in the wood chips and accepting the undesirable effects of the wood as a consequence to a greater good in the end. I expect those undesirable effects to be minimal, and so far, that has been my impression.

Try different methods, and ways of doing things, figure out what works for you. I love it, that's the ticket.

 

[SittinDuck]

Try different methods, and ways of doing things, figure out what works for you. I love it, that's the ticket.

The compost works really well, but broken up black leaves and stringy bits don't stay in the soil that long and making compost is hard work. I used to have piles so big I would have to stir it with an excavator, then I realized that giant pile is mostly air. The ash content couldn't be more than a wheelbarrow load. Wood seems like a much denser source, it just takes longer to break down into super good stuff.

Yep, they find their way from cross contamination due to touch, water, through the air or by whatever other means... Some plants like legumes that have a symbiotic relationship with their own brand of nitrogen fixing bacteria generally have the bacteria on the seeds already... This is why legumes are considered a nitrogen replacing crop, as they bring their own brand of bacteria over and above the stuff already in the soil, their bacteria lives on their roots instead of just in the soil and produces far in excess of the nitrogen the plant itself uses thus returning nitrogen to the soil...

It seems like all plants can do that to varying extents. Maybe it's the omnipresence of bacteria feeding on sugar that release nitrogen, and roots happen to exude sugar.

 

[MeepBeep]

Yep, they find their way from cross contamination due to touch, water, through the air or by whatever other means... Some plants like legumes that have a symbiotic relationship with their own brand of nitrogen fixing bacteria generally have the bacteria on the seeds already... This is why legumes are considered a nitrogen replacing crop, as they bring their own brand of bacteria over and above the stuff already in the soil, their bacteria lives on their roots instead of just in the soil and produces far in excess of the nitrogen the plant itself uses thus returning nitrogen to the soil...

It seems like all plants can do that to varying extents.  Maybe it's the omnipresence of bacteria feeding on sugar that release nitrogen, and roots happen to exude sugar.

I'm sure all plants do it to some extent, but the differences are drastic... The bacteria that has a symbiotic relationship with legumes actually infects the roots of the legumes, and forms clearly visible nodules, those nodules produces an excess of nitrogen thus enriching the soil, while most plants strip the nitrogen from the soil... This the reason many farmers rotate crops between nitrogen enriching crops like legumes and nitrogen stripping crops like corn...

 

[Chris09]

Most seedlings don't nee much light, a regular 2 tube florescent shop light with some 6500K bulbs is generally enough... Or multiple 6500K CFL bulbs will work as well...

I grow wild flowers indoors for my girls in the winter, and this is my on the budget light fixture... It's 6 cheap shop light fixtures, on a frame to create a 2 foot by 4 foot light... The shop lights have had a 2nd ballast installed so the tubes are now being driven at twice their normal wattage, this gets me about the equivalent of 9-10 shop light fixtures worth of light out of 6 this or pretty much HO output out of regular tubes... The regular tubes have no problem handling being over driven, it just slightly shortens their life, but I replace them every season anyway due to normal florescent degradation so I never see end of life...

One very important thing to remember with artificial light is the "Inverse Square Law" in short the energy in light diminishes rapidly with distance... A basic dumbed down rule is that when you double the light distance you cut the available light energy by 75%, but it actually gets worse then that in reality... So for example if your lights are 1 foot above the plant and you move to the light to 6 inches above the plant, you just increased the light energy by a factor of 4! While the reverse is true, if the lights are at 6" above the plant and you move them to 1 foot you now only have 1/4 of the light energy... As you can see this can result in a huge difference, in how much energy a plant can derive from a light being placed just a few inches further or closer away...

Although not a calibrated scientific example and not a direct measurement of PAR energy you can easily get a decent measurement of lumens with a smart phone to see the Inverse Square Law in action... Download a lux/lumen meter for your smart phone, turn on a single light in a dark room, hold the phone 1 foot away from the light and then slowly move it to 2 feet away and watch the lux/lumens drop like a rock...

I don't know what seeds your referring to that don't need much light but I will let you know that most vegetables need a good amount of light or they stretch and get lanky. A tomato needs right around 2000 Lumens per Sq Ft minimum. If I remember right a regular shop type light isn't going to put out that type of Lumens unless your sitting right on top of them and then if your using a 6500K (6500 Kelvin) bulb your most likely run the risk of burning the plants up...

 

[SittinDuck]

I'm sure all plants do it to some extent, but the differences are drastic... The bacteria that has a symbiotic relationship with legumes actually infects the roots of the legumes, and forms clearly visible nodules, those nodules produces an excess of nitrogen thus enriching the soil, while most plants strip the nitrogen from the soil... This the reason many farmers rotate crops between nitrogen enriching crops like legumes and nitrogen stripping crops like corn...

Yup, 4 years of soybeans followed by one year of corn. That's probably not the only reason though. Corn sucks up everything.

In a virgin field of grasses, how does nitrogen get into the soil if plants strip nitrogen from the soil? Somehow it all stays in balance even though the nitrogen in the leaf evaporates away instead of being tilled under.