HEADS UP AVIAN INFLUENZA ALERT

[TherryChicken]

TherryChicken, you are correct in the statement that many infected birds show no symptoms, that is because most of them just drop dead or drop dead in mid-flight.

What Speckledhen was trying to caution you about are recent cases, within the last 2 weeks, of healthy flocks being destroyed because State Vets and the USDA did not want to test them or worse even though they tested negative, they wanted to be cautious.  Feel free to google the following information...as I have been monitoring the situation closely because of a recent ban here in Kentucky because 2 wild waterfowl dropped from the sky on the Mississippi Flyway while migrating and happened to fall in Kentucky.  No other cases have appeared in our State and no poultry have been affected to date.

3 cases in Georgia...Hatching eggs were ordered from a farm in Iowa that tested Negative...after shipping the eggs, that farm tested positive.  The three folks in Georgia that ordered the eggs got a visit from the State vet and USDA...who took pics and videos and asked for paperwork.  Without testing the existing flocks, they came and de-populated (fancy word for "killed") their existing flocks, destroyed the eggs and handed them a pathetic check to cover their costs. 

17 cases in Iowa...flocks were destroyed with no testing or with negative results because they were within a certain radius of a farm who did test positive.

5 cases in Indiana .... flocks were destroyed because of suspicion of being exposed due to being within a certain radius of flocks that tested positive

7 cases in Arizona.... hatching eggs sent from a farm testing positive in Iowa, hatched chicks positive for the new strain becoming the first link to transmission through the egg/embryo.  The existing flocks were destroyed, the infected chicks and unhatched eggs as well.  The other 6 cases again were destroyed because of proximity without any testing results.

So what Speckledhen was trying to say is that the attitude of the State Vets and the USDA is kill first and test later.  If you desire to take that chance by placing yourself on their radar with an AI test out of the blue....go for it.   Should you elect to test now and draw undue attention to yourself with the usual results that have been occurring; please don't whine and complain should you get a nice phone call or letter telling you that you are in quarantine and officials will be arriving at an appointed time with a gas chamber to de-populate your flock, which the odds are in favor of.  Try a private lab first.

As for the snarkiness directed at Speckledhen, she is a kind lady who was just offer suggestions and help and did not warrant the snarkiness.  I on the other hand am not that kind and am much more direct.  I do not appreciate my friend being slammed with snarky BS for no reason under the psuedo "Have a Blessed Day" crap.  So feel free to bring the USDA to your door, piss off and Have Nice Day!

LadyHawk

Edited to add:  PS you do realize there are many other illnesses that can cause sudden deaths that are NOT AI.  There are many causes as well and it may behoove you to start at the beginning and start eliminating the possibilities with a clear head, logic and common sense.

I know what she was saying Thank you! I m sure she is, but I still do not appreciate when someone mentions me drawing attention to myself for checking birds. I'm sorry, I have no more to say about that situation.

 

[TalkALittle]

I don't think she was implying you were drawing attention to yourself in an "attention mongering" kind of way but, rather, warning you that you might be inadvertently raising the attention of the USDA inspectors.

 

[TherryChicken]

Like I said, I have no more to say about the situation.. Sorry

 

[Folly's place]

Therry, I hope the tests come back negative for AI, and I think having them checked was the right thing to do. We're worried up here in Michigan too, and also had a West Nile case nearby recently. Bug repellant and watching out for birds this year for sure. And see what's in my farm pond this spring! Mary

 

[TherryChicken]

Therry, I hope the tests come back negative for AI, and I think having them checked was the right thing to do. We're worried up here in Michigan too, and also had a West Nile case nearby recently. Bug repellant and watching out for birds this year for sure. And see what's in my farm pond this spring! Mary

Beautiful geese! Thank you, so do I. If it comes back as something that is nothing to worry about then that will be great! However with my ducks quail and chicken. After finding 12 birds, it's pretty worriesom. However I rather have them checked and it be nothing then not have them check and it's what we are fearing it is atm.

 

[Chickerdoodle13]

I'm sad to see there is so much hate for the state poultry vets and the USDA. When we respond to possible AI cases, we are not falsifying test results, nor are we marking a flock positive for no reason. Depopulation zones have been shown to be an effective method of controlling AI in other countries. I believe the study was done in the Netherlands, but I'll have to see if I can find those papers again. When I get a chance to research it, I will be sure to post the published papers.

I agree that depopulation is very very sad when it happens to farmers. I have not spoken to a vet or USDA representative who enjoys making those calls, but when that is the law, it means the vet's license is on the line. I did ask my advisor about penalties for those who resist the USDA in the face of a depopulation, and she said it is a federal offense, so we are talking serious stuff here.

I do think the media is making this a bigger deal than it actually is. Biosecurity is definitely a good idea, but that should be a constant thing, not just during times of outbreaks.

If people have more questions and I can't answer them myself, I would be more than happy to ask my advisor. Her primary field of expertise is AI and I pick her brain often with questions. I learn a lot that way and I think education is the best way to kept the paranoia under a bit of control!

 

[WalnutHill]

I'm sad to see there is so much hate for the state poultry vets and the USDA. When we respond to possible AI cases, we are not falsifying test results, nor are we marking a flock positive for no reason. Depopulation zones have been shown to be an effective method of controlling AI in other countries. I believe the study was done in the Netherlands, but I'll have to see if I can find those papers again. When I get a chance to research it, I will be sure to post the published papers.

I agree that depopulation is very very sad when it happens to farmers. I have not spoken to a vet or USDA representative who enjoys making those calls, but when that is the law, it means the vet's license is on the line. I did ask my advisor about penalties for those who resist the USDA in the face of a depopulation, and she said it is a federal offense, so we are talking serious stuff here.

I do think the media is making this a bigger deal than it actually is. Biosecurity is definitely a good idea, but that should be a constant thing, not just during times of outbreaks.

If people have more questions and I can't answer them myself, I would be more than happy to ask my advisor. Her primary field of expertise is AI and I pick her brain often with questions. I learn a lot that way and I think education is the best way to kept the paranoia under a bit of control!

I don't think that anyone "hates" the vets or the USDA. However, the states have not always done "the right thing" according to USDA guidelines as far as executing the plans where an affected flock is found.

If my birds were to be quarantined for a few months because HPAI was found nearby, I'd be fine with that, as long as sales of table eggs and taking birds to the processor wasn't affected. I completely understand that moving live stock or hatching eggs is a greater risk, Here in Michigan, even though the state has banned poultry swaps, auctions, and fairs until further notice, person to person sales of live poultry are not prohibited. Now to me that seems contradictory, as moving live birds is the most obvious way to transport the virus.

If my flock was diagnosed positive in the confirmatory test, by all means they should be depopulated. But if the farm a few miles down the road with a mixed population of ducks, geese and chickens sharing a mudhole in a small fenced pen get sick and die or are depopulated, I don't see any sense in depopulating my flock if they test negative. This is where the distrust and dislike come from...there have been drastic breaches of faith.

Keeping backyard flocks alive and well is enough of a challenge as it is. We should not have to fear a visit from a state vet or a local vet working on the state's behalf.

 

[Chickerdoodle13]

Depopulation zones are typically within 3 km of a confirmed case of AI. Quarantine zones are traditionally 7km around that.

This is not an easy virus to quarantine and generally back yard poultry owners are not capable of quarantine necessary on their own. This virus can spread on the wheels of cars, shoes, etc. Practically anything can be a fomite. Due to rapid spread and mutation of the virus, it has been found that depopulation is most effective, however, the U.S. has traditionally been a test and quarantine country, with the decision to depopulate in the hands of the USDA veterinarians. For the most part, quarantine has been effective, but the virus is spreading faster this time around and from what I understand, cutting it off early in the game is more effective.

 

[WthrLady]

If my flock was diagnosed positive in the confirmatory test, by all means they should be depopulated. But if the farm a few miles down the road with a mixed population of ducks, geese and chickens sharing a mudhole in a small fenced pen get sick and die or are depopulated, I don't see any sense in depopulating my flock if they test negative. This is where the distrust and dislike come from...there have been drastic breaches of faith.

Keeping backyard flocks alive and well is enough of a challenge as it is. We should not have to fear a visit from a state vet or a local vet working on the state's behalf.

AMEN!

I'm in Nebraska.

I don't trust the news outlets or media as far as I can spit at them. Somewhere along the line, they stopped being sources of trusted, full, information, and became glory hungry entertainers. They latch on to a high profile story and run only the exciting, knee jerk, bits, and only tell half the story. I've seen the real story more times than I can count, and then have seen what a news channel has done with it. Only to abandon it the second a bigger, fresher story comes across the wire. (Ever notice that?) Heck I LIVE here and that farm that had its quarantine lifted was on in the last 30 seconds of the newscast. When it went INTO quarantine it was the #1 story.

The population mass has no other choice than to believe what is on the glowing box in front of them. The media makes it sound like birds all over the country are dropping like flies, like we will run out of eggs, or all birds are deadly. I have YET to see them do an actual detailed story on HOW this is spreading in factory farms (but not backyard farms). They rarely mention that while wild birds are carriers, but not active cases. They don't mention what is being done to find a cure or vaccine, which you KNOW is being worked on. They only mention the number of birds on a production farm being culled, not all of which HAVE AI, but may have been exposed. NOR, do they explain how some of the most bio-secure factories in this country CONTINUE to have these outbreaks year after year.

This is NOT to say that I believe that AI isn't very, very serious. The economic impact it is having on the mass production egg and meat farms is great, as they have a few birds go down and need to slaughter and entire production run. And the risk to backyard flocks is real as well, but I wonder if the more genetically diverse backyard flocks and free rangers have a higher natural immunity than those that never see the light of day. Kind of like letting your kid go to daycare, where they pick up all the kiddie cooties and build up an immunity for life to some of the more common ailments out there.

I DO KNOW, we need not panic, nor should we be attacking each other over differences of opinion or our personal farm management styles. We are all we have, and we all get our love and devotion, and financial expense and dependence on our birds.

Love, hugs, and cackleberries.

 

[chiques chicks]

I'm sad to see there is so much hate for the state poultry vets and the USDA. When we respond to possible AI cases, we are not falsifying test results, nor are we marking a flock positive for no reason. Depopulation zones have been shown to be an effective method of controlling AI in other countries. I believe the study was done in the Netherlands, but I'll have to see if I can find those papers again. When I get a chance to research it, I will be sure to post the published papers.

I agree that depopulation is very very sad when it happens to farmers. I have not spoken to a vet or USDA representative who enjoys making those calls, but when that is the law, it means the vet's license is on the line. I did ask my advisor about penalties for those who resist the USDA in the face of a depopulation, and she said it is a federal offense, so we are talking serious stuff here.

I do think the media is making this a bigger deal than it actually is. Biosecurity is definitely a good idea, but that should be a constant thing, not just during times of outbreaks.

If people have more questions and I can't answer them myself, I would be more than happy to ask my advisor. Her primary field of expertise is AI and I pick her brain often with questions. I learn a lot that way and I think education is the best way to kept the paranoia under a bit of control!

Question concerning the depopulation being federal law:

When was this law passed by both houses of congress and signed by the President? Otherwise it is merely an agency regulation.


There is a little thing called the constitution. It has not been set aside for this outbreak.