How much pecking is too much pecking?

[NestingMillenial]

I just picked up my 6 pullets and most of them have pretty short tail feathers, one is even butt naked on the whole pointy rump area (see pic).

The henhouse we picked them up from has good reputation around here, as far as I can judge. They explained that they are wrapping up their current cohort and won't start a new one till December, which is why we got our pullets on sale and a bit older (I guess technically they are not pullets anymore at around 36 weeks).

They said that because of that, the flock is now relatively small and since pullets keep being sold as we go, the flock constantly goes through re-establishing the pecking order and so they have been pecking each other way more in the last month, hence those short butts. They explained the naked butt one was on the mend (showing possibly new feather growth) and that nothing else needed to be done for now, apart from keeping an eye on the group.

We have had them since yesterday evening, just before sunset, and they are now in the run: everything seems mostly ok, but they do peck a bit at each other at times. Most do it very little but one seems a bit more intent on going after her flockmates' butts...

Do you think all we have been told makes sense, that it's normal and that we shouldn't worry much about those short to naked butts?

For that one hen that's a bit more aggressive, when is pecking others too much and when should we do something about it? (usually I wouldn't worry until feathers start to disappear but since those are already missing, I am not sure what should be my cue to worry anymore!)

Finally, for our butt naked one, how long before she regrows at least some dawn feathers around that area? (asking so if I don't see regrowth timely I can take that as my cue that pecking is ongoing more than I think)

Thanks for your help, guys!!

 

[U_Stormcrow]

1st. I am NOT an expert on chicken behaviors. My chickens don't have behavioral problems, largely. There's reason for that, and those reasons may help you figure out what's going on.


Chicken feather plucking (as opposed to pecking order establishment, about which I do have experience, because I've integrated once a month a times) is associated with a couple things:

A) Inadequate protein in the diet.

B) Boredom

C) Insufficent space

D) Isolation of an injured or ill bird.

A, B, and C are unfortunately all common with many (certainly not all - I am one myself) Breeders. You can address all those things by ensuring you offer a good quantity and quality feed, most of us on BYC recommend an "All Flock" style formulation (regardless of how its labeled) for use in the US, the EU numbers are a little different. You can ensure they have plenty of space - the typical thumb rules are 4 sq ft/bird in the house, 10sq ft/bird in the run, and 1 linear foot of perch for each - but like all thumb rules they are generic guidelines, your situation and condition may influence those. Squares and circles are better than long and narrow - its harder for a doiminant bird to control the space when there are no "choke points". You can also ensure that there are numerous objects in the run to keep them entertained, block sight lines, provide differing vertical layers/surfaces, etc - this will also help with integration. Now, that said, those kinds of behaviors *generally* result in much less specific feather plucking in terms of location, and it tends to be spread over most of the flock (in accordance with dominance).

What you have there looks more consistent with D). The bird has (or had) some weakness the flock detected, and was attacked. In nature, the flock is establishing a sacrifice to divert attention of predators away from the strengest and healthiest members. I am NOT SAYING that's what's going on, just that it fits the typical pattern. Treat the hind end to prevent secondary infection, monitor behaviors, ensure you are using a high protein feed to encourage feqather growth, and consider isolating the bird for its protection and the flock's. ANytime you add brds, you should have an effective quarantine plan.

 

[NestingMillenial]

That's very informative, thank you!

I actually didn't know those were going to be fully adults before I picked them up, so I had bought a grower feed for them, which is at 18% protein, and to which I am adding oyster shells to complement calcium-wise, so hopefully that should help with A) and feather regrowth.

The coop is closer to 3sq.ft of floor per bird than 4, but their roost space is in line with the rule of thumb you mentioned and they are free ranging the whole backyard all day, sunrise to sunset, which is way bigger than any run. So if space was the problem at their previous location, hopefully it will no longer be.

I got them all at once, and they are my first flock, so I don't thing they should be struggling with integration per se, though there were probably part of bigger flock at the grower's place and might have to sort out their new dynamic anew... I'll make sure to add a bunch of obstacles, branches and such, like you said, at least around their coop and feeding area, just to be on the safe side!

To address your last part, they are actually all somewhat plucked up on the butt, and it seems to feat the pattern you describe where the extent of it follows the chain of dominance... but it is still only on the butt for all of them, which you said seems surprising. I wonder what's happening then...

For the most butt naked one, when you to treat, do you mean spraying disinfectant on the regular or would you recommend something like neosporin? I suppose maybe some vaseline to coat the bare skin could be good?

 

[Tonyroo]

If you know who is pecking the other hens separate her from the flock and don't allow her to see the flock for 2 weeks or get rid of her.

It's hard to break a chicken pecking at others because it became what she knows.

Provide high protein feed during the winter months for all the hens.

 

[rosemarythyme]

For the most butt naked one, when you to treat, do you mean spraying disinfectant on the regular or would you recommend something like neosporin? I suppose maybe some vaseline to coat the bare skin could be good?

I wouldn't add anything if there's no open wounds. Vaseline is not suitable. IF there are open wounds or the other birds seem overly interested in her bare skin, then Blu-Kote would probably be the best bet as it would dye the bare skin + is an antiseptic.

 

[aart]

I guess technically they are not pullets anymore at around 36 weeks

No pullet until 12 months old, then called hens.
They are probably getting ready to molt.

 

[NestingMillenial]

Ok, so some updates!

I know one is supposed to keep a new flock in the coop or run for few days and up to few weeks, depending on people you ask, so we made a small temporary run - the coop is too small for them to stay in, it's just for nights or laying, and we planned on them free ranging all day, so we didn't have anything to lock them in.

Turns out, one managed to get on the other side almost immediately, but stayed around anyway.

Seeing this, I ejected the meanie pecking one too, to get some peace and quiet in the temporary run.

But then I saw that they kept returning to the coop when spooked about anything, which made me think they had already associated it to their safe home. So by the end of the day, I had done away with the temporary run and let everyone out. They didn't explore very far the first day but have since been around the backyard.

Which brings me back to the butt pecking: I believe it has stopped! So it must have been a lack of room issue (during the time we kept them in smaller quarters for transport and setting them up) and the consequences of what the grower said maybe, which was that the now smaller flock perpetually went through the pecking order due to sales and that was the result? I dunno.

In any case, now there's the occasional peck but nothing very sustained as far as I can tell. They could be spending all night plucking each other, sure, but there's no trace left inside the coop, apart from the occasional dawny little feather, so I think we're good. I picked up naked butt and checked her: her skin had no lesions or anything, just bare. The upper "lip" of her vent was redder, but again the skin was perfectly fine and healthy looking. I also have the impression her butt is redder after laying, so I'm assuming it's just a blood flow thing and she's fine... I'll keep an eye on this though.

Given I see no sign of further feather loss, I suppose they are probably not molting, so should I just assume that she's going to stay butt naked for the time being, maybe the whole year, until next time she feels like molting? Ahaha, keeping a fresh end, I guess ^^

 

[NestingMillenial]

Actually, after posting the above I thought I'd show you guys, in case I'd be dismissing the redness of her butt too fast.

As you can see on the first pic, her feathers might be regrowing, which maybe could explain the redness?

Still, shown on picture 2, the upper half of her vent is redder. Her feathers might have a bit of a deposit on them too (see picture 3)? I originally thought this was normal, but then I just read that vent gleet might cause feather loss on their rear end and now I'm worried again that maybe it's discharge from an infection?

Last pic is of her vent (she's very patient and docile and let me hold her between my legs whil I was taking this picture, the sweetie) - does that look like a possibly sick vent to you guys, or are we good?

 

[onwingandhoof]

Actually, after posting the above I thought I'd show you guys, in case I'd be dismissing the redness of her butt too fast.

As you can see on the first pic, her feathers might be regrowing, which maybe could explain the redness?

Still, shown on picture 2, the upper half of her vent is redder. Her feathers might have a bit of a deposit on them too (see picture 3)? I originally thought this was normal, but then I just read that vent gleet might cause feather loss on their rear end and now I'm worried again that maybe it's discharge from an infection?

Last pic is of her vent (she's very patient and docile and let me hold her between my legs whil I was taking this picture, the sweetie) - does that look like a possibly sick vent to you guys, or are we good?

If she has vent gleet, you'd see discharge and it'd be leaking and she'd be a mess. However each case is different. Worms also cause feather loss there. If you have a way to separate her, I would and monitor her and worm the flock since it's the easiest way to start. If it's pecking, she'll heal fast, if it's worms and they get wormed she'll heal fast. If not, you'll have eliminated two cause and then go from there.

 

[NestingMillenial]

That sounds like a good plan, thank you!
How fast is "fast" in that case? I never had a case of feather loss until know so I am at a complete loss as to how much time I should give this before worrying that it is not working!