INDIANA BYC'ers HERE!

[gunchief25]

Morning all cockadoodledooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!

 

[Minminme]

I've bn up for hours your doodliedoos didn't wake me this mornin! Lmbo

 

[gunchief25]

 

[RedRidge]

LGD advice:
I suspect many people don't understand what it takes to get a fully dependable lgd on all forms of stock against a variety of predators. Many new puppy people make two assumptions that are frequently incorrect... A) that just because it's and lgd breed it has the natural instinct to guard, and B) that with that instinct comes instantaneous dependability. Because many do not have instinct the new owners get discouraged and switch to "training mode". If you have to train an lgd to guard then you have no instinct. If they have that instinct then some guidance should be all they need. However, none of that matters of the dog is not started correctly - and this is where most breeders fail miserably. They don't understand the necessity of the bond.
So... What do you look for? A dog with instinct (watch the parents work - and keep in mind that "they don't kill my chickens" is NOT an indication of instinct), who was started correctly (meaning never been in the house and been with livestock 24/7 since birth regardless of weather or excuses), and has been permitted to succeed for their age. What this last point means is that bad habits are easy to develop when owners think they bought a puppy with adult intuitiveness and experience.
Number 1 rule of raising an lgd... Never put babies with babies. Why? Because you are setting them up with an unfair stimulus. You want to develop confidence, so set them up to be successful. And... set them up to fail "under your control" with the help ofa good breeder.
What does this mean? It means an 18 month old lgd should be "next to" poultry but not with them. They should be "next to lambs" but not in with them. Unless you are there and have the timing and experience to efficiently prevent disaster. IF someone says they have an lgd who has been with poultry since day 1 and never played with one or killed one, then they don't have an lgd, they have a deterrent.
Now... Good thing to note... a deterrent is all many people really need. And many different dogs can be deterrents. But i assure you that if you have heavy predation pressure from turkey vultures, fox, hawks, coyotes and big cats, a deterrent will not be adequate long term. But many folks who feel the need for an lgd really need only a deterrent.
For those who need an lgd, they usually buy puppies and expect them to work immediately. Bad scenario. But... "I lost 8 chickens in the last 5 nights, I need protection now!" Well, easy to find, but you better be prepared to fork over some bucks. So, best advice? Find a good breeder and buy a finished dog, or buy a started teenager or even a pup from a breeder WHO WILL GUIDE YOU and be there for you for the life of the dog.
Ok... That's my lecture for the day. Lol
To give folks an idea about what to expect if they have a need for an lgd. A puppy well started at 12 weeks old well go for at least $650, a teenager $1000, and I have seen finished dogs for as much as $4000.
Now, you can find lgd pups on CL for $300... 83% end up in rescue. Who knows, you might get lucky and end up with one of the 17%. But if you do I assure you in 3 or 4 years you will begin to understands the value of what you received without knowing the time commitment involved. The biggest problem new owners gave is their inability to monitor a new pup 24/7. Most folks have a job "off the farm". Hard to have good timing with teenage lgd's if you aren't there and can't trust them with the livestock when you aren't.
So... Many things to think about.
I specifically raised 2 doz cockerels this year just to have poultry to live with the teenagers over the winter. By spring, the teenager here who spends the winter with them will be much more valuable to any poultry owner. Same goes for the dog who is going through lambing for the first time this year.

 

[MnMPoultry]

Wow, what sweet compliments. Gee... Not sure what to say.
Sally is right, I don't breed very often and have no litters planned for several years but... We just sold an entire flock of sheep who are leaving for Indiana in 10 days. So... I have 2 Maremma for sale. But... Neither one has been with poultry since they were pups. They are young themselves so they have only been with sheep so far. They are great with sheep but would need monitoring with poultry until they are more mature.
There are pics on the Red Ridge Farm Web page and fb page if anyone is interested.
Sorry I have no dogs available right now who have been with poultry.

LGD advice:
I suspect many people don't understand what it takes to get a fully dependable lgd on all forms of stock against a variety of predators. Many new puppy people make two assumptions that are frequently incorrect... A) that just because it's and lgd breed it has the natural instinct to guard, and B) that with that instinct comes instantaneous dependability. Because many do not have instinct the new owners get discouraged and switch to "training mode". If you have to train an lgd to guard then you have no instinct. If they have that instinct then some guidance should be all they need. However, none of that matters of the dog is not started correctly - and this is where most breeders fail miserably. They don't understand the necessity of the bond.
So... What do you look for? A dog with instinct (watch the parents work - and keep in mind that "they don't kill my chickens" is NOT an indication of instinct), who was started correctly (meaning never been in the house and been with livestock 24/7 since birth regardless of weather or excuses), and has been permitted to succeed for their age. What this last point means is that bad habits are easy to develop when owners think they bought a puppy with adult intuitiveness and experience.
Number 1 rule of raising an lgd... Never put babies with babies. Why? Because you are setting them up with an unfair stimulus. You want to develop confidence, so set them up to be successful. And... set them up to fail "under your control" with the help ofa good breeder.
What does this mean? It means an 18 month old lgd should be "next to" poultry but not with them. They should be "next to lambs" but not in with them. Unless you are there and have the timing and experience to efficiently prevent disaster. IF someone says they have an lgd who has been with poultry since day 1 and never played with one or killed one, then they don't have an lgd, they have a deterrent.
Now... Good thing to note... a deterrent is all many people really need. And many different dogs can be deterrents. But i assure you that if you have heavy predation pressure from turkey vultures, fox, hawks, coyotes and big cats, a deterrent will not be adequate long term. But many folks who feel the need for an lgd really need only a deterrent.
For those who need an lgd, they usually buy puppies and expect them to work immediately. Bad scenario. But... "I lost 8 chickens in the last 5 nights, I need protection now!" Well, easy to find, but you better be prepared to fork over some bucks. So, best advice? Find a good breeder and buy a finished dog, or buy a started teenager or even a pup from a breeder WHO WILL GUIDE YOU and be there for you for the life of the dog.
Ok... That's my lecture for the day. Lol
To give folks an idea about what to expect if they have a need for an lgd. A puppy well started at 12 weeks old well go for at least $650, a teenager $1000, and I have seen finished dogs for as much as $4000.
Now, you can find lgd pups on CL for $300... 83% end up in rescue. Who knows, you might get lucky and end up with one of the 17%. But if you do I assure you in 3 or 4 years you will begin to understands the value of what you received without knowing the time commitment involved. The biggest problem new owners gave is their inability to monitor a new pup 24/7. Most folks have a job "off the farm". Hard to have good timing with teenage lgd's if you aren't there and can't trust them with the livestock when you aren't.
So... Many things to think about.
I specifically raised 2 doz cockerels this year just to have poultry to live with the teenagers over the winter. By spring, the teenager here who spends the winter with them will be much more valuable to any poultry owner. Same goes for the dog who is going through lambing for the first time this year.

Very very helpful and informative post! Now, with all that info, maybe I'm not specifically looking for an LGD. I want my poultry guarded, but the dogs will be outside of the chicken areas. There will be a large fenced buffer zone which I'be been referring to as a doggie moat... Basically a gigantic pen around the chicken pens/coop and another around the breeding pens.

I need, and am willing to spend the time working with, a dog that will not try to enter the chicken area to play with or eat the chickens. One that will not bother a chicken if it gets into the buffer zone. One that is alert to all other animals not belonging in their area.

Does this sound like a job for a good LGD or just any protective breed dog?

 

[Leahs Mom]

Very very helpful and informative post! Now, with all that info, maybe I'm not specifically looking for an LGD. I want my poultry guarded, but the dogs will be outside of the chicken areas. There will be a large fenced buffer zone which I'be been referring to as a doggie moat... Basically a gigantic pen around the chicken pens/coop and another around the breeding pens.

I need, and am willing to spend the time working with, a dog that will not try to enter the chicken area to play with or eat the chickens. One that will not bother a chicken if it gets into the buffer zone. One that is alert to all other animals not belonging in their area.

Does this sound like a job for a good LGD or just any protective breed dog?

@RedRidge

 

[atrueb00]

Weekly Chicken Event Post!

Two poultry auctions/swap meets this weekend, check out the details on the Indiana BYC'ers Events Calendar and check for the locations on the Indiana BYC'ers Map!

Saturday, September 13- Sandcut Trader's Fair-Terre Haute, IN
Sunday, September 14- Sandcut Trader's Fair-Terre Haute, IN
Sunday, September 14- Golden Horseshoe Saddle Club-Knox Swap Meet

If you do go, try wearing your official Indiana BYC T-shirt and see if you spot anyone else there! Also, please take pictures to share!




Upcoming Events:

Friday, September 19- Dinky's Auction-Montgomery, Indiana
Saturday, September 20- Southern Indiana Poultry Show-Van Buren, Indiana
Saturday, September 20- Croy Creek Trader's Fair-Reelsville, Indiana
Sunday, September 21- Croy Creek Trader's Fair-Reelsville, Indiana
---
Friday, September 26- Veedersburg Sale Barn-Veedersburg, Indiana
Friday, September 26-Dinky's Auction-Montgomery, Indiana
Saturday, September 27- Newbury Square Swap Meet & Flea Market - Shipshewana, Indiana
Saturday, September 27- Sandcut Trader's Fair-Terre Haute, IN
Sunday, September 28- Sandcut Trader's Fair-Terre Haute, IN
---
Friday, October 3- Dinky's Auction-Montgomery, Indiana
Saturday, October 4- Croy Creek Trader's Fair-Reelsville, Indiana
Sunday, October 5- Croy Creek Trader's Fair-Reelsville, Indiana
Sunday, October 5- Northeast Indiana Poultry Swap Meet-Bluffton, Indiana
Sunday, October 5- Tri-K Pigeon & Bantam Club-Kankakee, Illinois

 

[browncow15]

[COLOR=006400] my DH doesn't get to complain. My stash USED to be in the garage. Now the garage is full of old cars and car parts. It's almost as if he thinks that's what belongs in the garage...and the living room (seriously. Ever tried to find a spot on your coffee table to put down a soda and realize there's not enough room because a carburetor is in the way?).[/COLOR]

Lol! Sounds like my BIL and his cousin. They pulled up the carpet in part of their apartment so they could work on a motor!

LGD advice:
I suspect many people don't understand what it takes to get a fully dependable lgd on all forms of stock against a variety of predators. Many new puppy people make two assumptions that are frequently incorrect... A) that just because it's and lgd breed it has the natural instinct to guard, and B) that with that instinct comes instantaneous dependability. Because many do not have instinct the new owners get discouraged and switch to "training mode". If you have to train an lgd to guard then you have no instinct. If they have that instinct then some guidance should be all they need. However, none of that matters of the dog is not started correctly - and this is where most breeders fail miserably. They don't understand the necessity of the bond.
So... What do you look for? A dog with instinct (watch the parents work - and keep in mind that "they don't kill my chickens" is NOT an indication of instinct), who was started correctly (meaning never been in the house and been with livestock 24/7 since birth regardless of weather or excuses), and has been permitted to succeed for their age. What this last point means is that bad habits are easy to develop when owners think they bought a puppy with adult intuitiveness and experience.
Number 1 rule of raising an lgd... Never put babies with babies. Why? Because you are setting them up with an unfair stimulus. You want to develop confidence, so set them up to be successful. And... set them up to fail "under your control" with the help ofa good breeder.
What does this mean? It means an 18 month old lgd should be "next to" poultry but not with them. They should be "next to lambs" but not in with them. Unless you are there and have the timing and experience to efficiently prevent disaster. IF someone says they have an lgd who has been with poultry since day 1 and never played with one or killed one, then they don't have an lgd, they have a deterrent.
Now... Good thing to note... a deterrent is all many people really need. And many different dogs can be deterrents. But i assure you that if you have heavy predation pressure from turkey vultures, fox, hawks, coyotes and big cats, a deterrent will not be adequate long term. But many folks who feel the need for an lgd really need only a deterrent.
For those who need an lgd, they usually buy puppies and expect them to work immediately. Bad scenario. But... "I lost 8 chickens in the last 5 nights, I need protection now!" Well, easy to find, but you better be prepared to fork over some bucks. So, best advice? Find a good breeder and buy a finished dog, or buy a started teenager or even a pup from a breeder WHO WILL GUIDE YOU and be there for you for the life of the dog.
Ok... That's my lecture for the day. Lol
To give folks an idea about what to expect if they have a need for an lgd. A puppy well started at 12 weeks old well go for at least $650, a teenager $1000, and I have seen finished dogs for as much as $4000.
Now, you can find lgd pups on CL for $300... 83% end up in rescue. Who knows, you might get lucky and end up with one of the 17%. But if you do I assure you in 3 or 4 years you will begin to understands the value of what you received without knowing the time commitment involved. The biggest problem new owners gave is their inability to monitor a new pup 24/7. Most folks have a job "off the farm". Hard to have good timing with teenage lgd's if you aren't there and can't trust them with the livestock when you aren't.
So... Many things to think about.
I specifically raised 2 doz cockerels this year just to have poultry to live with the teenagers over the winter. By spring, the teenager here who spends the winter with them will be much more valuable to any poultry owner. Same goes for the dog who is going through lambing for the first time this year.

Thanks for the info! Very interesting!

ETA: @jchny2000 did you find a source for calves? Mines still a bust I'm hauling in some beef breed weaned calves next month since I won't be able to do bottle babies until after my baby comes.

 

[Rhandi74]

Well Jewel is broody again. Wow I would think these broody hens would get tired of sitting. I am going to try to have her hatch some duck eggs this time since I need more hens.

 

[Mother2Hens]

Short video of cute fluffy butts learning how to find tasty morsels . . . Bonbon & five chicks