Marek's vs. perosis - please help

[newchickiemom48]

I have a 3 month old pullet who has had weakness of her legs for the past two weeks. I started noticing her limping a little while she was out during the day, then I noticed her sitting down frequently. Then she started having trouble perching, and then I noticed her right foot curled. I tried splinting the foot but she kept getting it off. Then she was not able to walk at all and the other leg started having the same symptoms. Now she is able to sit with assistance and push with her legs, but when she tries to get up, her legs go out behind her. I have her propped up in a cage inside with food and water within reach. I started giving her feed with Rooster Booster and water with Sav a Chick electrolytes & vitamins. She is taking aspirin a couple of times a day. She never progressed to neck and wing paralysis and never got respiratory distress. Not sure what this is or how to treat. Thinking of euthanizing if she does not turn around. Any help would be appreciated.

 

[Leihamarie]

This is all encouraging. She did see the avian vet almost two weeks ago when it started. She felt it was Marek's and took some blood and gave her Meloxicam to reduce spinal cord inflammation. It helped a little. She tried to find someone who could test for Marek's but found that necropsy was the only way to test. She was already treated for coccidiosis. She is going in at 2:30 today. I will mention the worm possibility because we did have one hen with round worms that was just treated.

I am so sorry for your troubles. I just lost 2/3 of my original flock from Marek's (confirmed w/ Necropsy) I was encouraged by my family to euthanize my single remaining pullet since she clearly had bile in her stool and she seemed to be losing weight at an alarming rate. I chose to wait until I saw Marek's symptoms and give her a chance to recover from the stress of losing her flockmates and build her immune system back up. 5 weeks later and she's still here, is a healthy weight and seems to be a normal pullet. I keep her under close observation and will take action if I see her succumb to the virus, but since she is my favorite I felt compelled to give her every chance to survive. My point is, being that your flock has become pets for you, try everything you can and if it IS Marek's, there's very, VERY little to be done except know that you did your best and let her go humanely when it's time. If she passes or you choose to euthanize, I would HIGHLY recommend sending her off for necropsy so you know precisely what you're dealing with. Also, while it's true that Marek's is most commonly diagnosed by necropsy, you CAN send for a PCR blood test for it while the bird lives. I really hope what's going on is not Marek's. Please keep us posted.

 

[Leihamarie]

Hi all,

I took her to the vet yesterday. I mentioned the riboflavin theory because of the legs being extended and the worm theory too. She examined her and told me there was too much spinal cord damage to reverse and recommended euthanasia. She chirped to me as they carrier her away. Very, very sad day. We did send to USDA for testing so I will update when I get the results. Right now watching my flock anxiously.

Oh, I am sooo, soooo sorry for your loss! I am sure you are heartbroken for your lost girl and scared about what may lie ahead for your flock. As little comfort as it is now, the best thing is that you were there for her and a superb caretaker that gave her every chance and did the humane thing in the end. As a friend said to me when I went through the same sort of day not too long ago, "cry, grieve, spend time with the chickens you have and get as much rest as you can"

My thoughts and heartfelt condolences are with you. It'll probably take a few weeks for the final results, but please let us know what the necropsy says. If it IS Marek's you are NOT ALONE!!!! There are many of us here that have had, and STILL live with Marek's in our flocks. It is not the end of your chicken keeping success, may not be a death sentence for all your babies, and you have the support of the many, many members here who have dealt with it.

 

[Wickedchicken6]

Hi! I'm so sorry to hear about the issues you're having.

I'm having a few issues myself. In my case I had my first ever bout with coocidiosis, my chicks responded well and I thought all would be fine. Unfortunately this has not been the end of it. I had a couple of young birds show up with the leg issues and the thought of Mareks crossed my mind. But then I started noticing what I believe to be other deficiencies; there's a beak issue and toe issues.

I've been raising chicks from the same birds for a year now and this is the first time I've had issues. I consulted my vet and put them through another course of Amprol in case they're still having issues. The vet agreed that they appeared to be showing signs of deficiencies. I've have them on a vitamin premix that goes in the water. I just realized that I started feed from a new place at the time the times these chicks hatched because the branch of stores I purchased the previous feed closed. I plan to get starter from a different company as soon as I can get there and I'll be using that for my chicks to see if it's better. Both feeds are comparable as far as vitamins. But so was the first feed and I didn't have issues at that point in time.

I did buy human B2 for the fellow with the leg issues but today is the first day I'll be giving it to him. I'm wondering if I will have to put him down eventually. I feel so badly for him. I have him beside the others, but separated.


Here's another link from about Perosis. On the left side follow the list to deficiencies.
It lists others there and has a few more pictures.

http://www.thepoultrysite.com/publications/6/diseases-of-poultry/220/slipped-tendon-perosis/

 

[casportpony]

Thank you everyone. I'm off to look for some more vitamins. Her legs are definitely stronger from the exercises and she pushes against my hand. I am hoping there is some miracle because she is so sweet. Of note the symptoms started shortly after she was allowed to free range so the wild bird theory might be the case if it is Marek's. They all swoop down to eat the goodies in the pasture.

Here is a good link to read:
http://www.merckvetmanual.com/mvm/p..._poultry/vitamin_deficiencies_in_poultry.html

When I get one that looks neurological like your pullet does, I treat for all the easily treatable stuff, like coccidiosis, worms, and vitamin deficiencies. Both coccidiosis and/or worms can cause similar symptoms, so that's why I treat for those.

-Kathy

 

[Wickedchicken6]

Quote: That's excellent info Kathy posted. The Merck breaks it down into individual deficiencies for each vitamin...and it's surprising to read how some deficiencies mimic some of the serious diseases. Everything is in such a delicate balance in the body and it can be easy to take that for granted sometimes. Sometimes with chickens...it doesn't seem to take much.

Even with humans...I've been having trouble healing injuries like cuts or scratches and my fingernails have ridges and aren't growing as fast. Saw my doctor about it and one of the causes is being older

(that makes MY day)

I've figured out that more sleep = better healing...for me anyway. I've also come across human oriented information searching chicken stuff where I need more protein, protein helps heal tissues apparently. So I've been eating more protein with good results.

It doesn't take 2-3 weeks to heal a scratch now...back to under a week or so.
Just food for thought.

A sad update, I discovered one of those feather follicle tumors when I was cleaning her. I guess it's time to do the right thing for her. Thanks for all your support. I will vaccinate any new chicks in the future.

Unless a knowledgeable vet can confirm what you've found, I also wouldn't jump to conclusions.

I once had two registered purebred ewes begin to waste away, one right after another and I thought "oh no...Johne's disease!" I hadn't brought anything in and chances were slim...but it still presented EXACTLY like Johne's. Vet did autopsies...wasn't Johne's...wasn't even the same thing with both or them. One ewe had liver issues and the other...I can't even remember now (it was about 15 years ago)

That was a HUGE lesson for me. Probably the reason I'm questioning my flock issues right now and weeding through things just like Kathy mentioned above.

I would think a lump could mean many things, not just cancer. I do realize how hopeless it seems when your chicken is down like it shows in your pictures.

 

[newchickiemom48]

Hi all,

I took her to the vet yesterday. I mentioned the riboflavin theory because of the legs being extended and the worm theory too. She examined her and told me there was too much spinal cord damage to reverse and recommended euthanasia. She chirped to me as they carrier her away. Very, very sad day. We did send to USDA for testing so I will update when I get the results. Right now watching my flock anxiously.

 

[Wickedchicken6]

Quote: I could not have said this any better. I'm a misty reading all this, that must have been so hard.

I'm SO sorry for your loss.

Please know we are here regardless.
I'm hoping for the best outcome, but I agree that it's not the end of the world if it turns out to be Mareks.

Thank you on behalf of all of us for getting her tested, as hard as that must of been.
Every bit of information one owner finds out and shares helps everyone here.

 

[ChicKat]

Thank you everyone. What I don't get is why there isn't a treatment for it since it's been around for so long. We have Valtrex for humans and Lysine for cats. Even antivirals for HIV. Results should be in by next week and I will post them.

Thanks for posting -- (in advance)

Why no cure for Marek's?

• One reason is that chickens were only cheap livestock, until the BYC movement brought them closer to more people -- and they became pets. -- No bottom-ine driven entity cares for the life of a chicken. Most vets here in the USA don't even treat chickens - and chicken owners in general don't want to pay a lot of chicken care at the vet's. Most folks don't want to pay the $80.00 for a necropsy - And they are only available to insure that any disease that would affect agricultural chickens - and spreads quickly -- like maybe newcastles? -- would be caught and contained. Remember the Avian Influenza strain last year (or was it year before) where even private flocks were destroyed - along with a lot of commercial operations chickens?

• In the profit-driven world -- it is more cost-effective to let commercial chickens die, or euthanize - sanitize, collect the insurance, and replace them with zillions of new chicks -- than to care for a sick chicken.

• Huge demands are put on commercial chicken producers for profit-margin, and by getting our own eggs from our own backyards, we are adding to that pressure on their bottom line.

• Cost of developing a cure would be astronomical and they wouldn't get their money back, plus a chicken that had recovered from Marek's may not lay quite as many eggs as a chicken who had never been sick. Therefore their feed conversion ratio would go down, and they don't want that.
• Big business does drive the chicken industry for the most part - and our paltry populations don't compete.

o.k. -- knowing it is just my opinions based on some viewpoints based on facts that I know, but many people think our devotion to chickens (individually) is purely insane....just sayin' . Sorry if it sounds a bit cynical -- I'm old enough to have lived in the era before the pursuit of wealth was quite so pervasive. I remember in my business career, when I would do a cost/benefit analysis for a project, and if the benefit didn't kind of vastly exceed what the current interest rate was in the bank (some how 6% compounded annually sticks in my mind ) then the project couldn't be funded......period.

 

[Barbiejenkins]

I'm havi

I have a 3 month old pullet who has had weakness of her legs for the past two weeks. I started noticing her limping a little while she was out during the day, then I noticed her sitting down frequently. Then she started having trouble perching, and then I noticed her right foot curled. I tried splinting the foot but she kept getting it off. Then she was not able to walk at all and the other leg started having the same symptoms. Now she is able to sit with assistance and push with her legs, but when she tries to get up, her legs go out behind her. I have her propped up in a cage inside with food and water within reach. I started giving her feed with Rooster Booster and water with Sav a Chick electrolytes & vitamins. She is taking aspirin a couple of times a day. She never progressed to neck and wing paralysis and never got respiratory distress. Not sure what this is or how to treat. Thinking of euthanizing if she does not turn around. Any help would be appreciated.

I'm having the same problem with my roo idk what to do been doing everything that you are I hope someone helps us I'm thinking if he does it get better soon I'm going to have to euthanize him to