Molting in tropical or subtropocal environments

[Leo1]

Hi guys!
So, I'm in serious consideration of moving to Hawaii. Quite tired of freezing my ***** off! Anyway, I'm trying to figure out how all thing chicken work down there. So, does anyone know how the molt works when the temps and day lengths don't vary much. Right now I live in Maine, so I'm sure things are quite different in Hawaii Any other tips would be greatly appreciated as well. It seems like the chicken keeping would be much easier there. No cold, less heat, a LOT fewer preditors.
Thanks!

 

[chooks4life]

Hi guys!
So, I'm in serious consideration of moving to Hawaii. Quite tired of freezing my ***** off! Anyway, I'm trying to figure out how all thing chicken work down there. So, does anyone know how the molt works when the temps and day lengths don't vary much. Right now I live in Maine, so I'm sure things are quite different in Hawaii Any other tips would be greatly appreciated as well. It seems like the chicken keeping would be much easier there. No cold, less heat, a LOT fewer preditors.
Thanks!

Not sure what you're asking there.

It's mostly genetic, partly dietary, and partly environmental.

Chooks of more commercial, intensive production breeds or types like Isabrowns, Leghorns etc tend to moult terribly, losing them all in one go, becoming barebacked. A good diet can change that though.

Mongrels seem to moult very evenly, losing one feather at a time and replacing it, often you won't even know they moulted at all without watching closely; they often also continue to lay or brood while moulting instead of completely stopping and suffering like hard/fast-moulters.

Any chook on a poor diet will moult hard and harshly. Any chook on a better diet will do it far better.

Chooks from heat-source-supplying environments tend to feather slow and moult hard as well, whereas the stimulation of the temperature changes normally free-ranged chooks are exposed to prompts rapid feathering and staggered moulting that keeps the whole body covered at all times, I believe.

Best wishes.

 

[Leo1]

I guess I'm just wondering if it works differently there. Here they moult when the days start to shorten and it gets a bit cooler. Since that doesn't happen in tropical areas, do they still moult in the fall? Is it still a big to-do? Here it's a big thing for them. It varies bird to bird, but they drop a whole bunch, get really miserable and pouty for a few weeks and don't eat too much until they come back in. I would imagine that not having the cold and light cycles must effect things somehow. They other thing here is that they kay less in the short days. Do they have a laying break in tropical areas?

 

[chooks4life]

I guess I'm just wondering if it works differently there. Here they moult when the days start to shorten and it gets a bit cooler. Since that doesn't happen in tropical areas, do they still moult in the fall?

Temperatures can drop or rise steeply in subtropical areas, but I have no direct experience with the actual tropics; however in my experience, moulting time has far more to do with breed and hatch date. In the hottest places, extreme heat can put a stop to laying, so it's not unreasonable to expect them to lay more in 'winter'.

You will hear endless stories of them going into moult in the dead of winter in snowy places, where it's clearly life threatening to do so; that's not really natural at all. That's because they are either of breeds bred to not moult until their first or second birthday, or they're otherwise 'awol' systematically speaking, which is easy to cause with environmental stress, changing feeds, low protein, dietary deficiencies e.g. lack of iodine, etc.

Naturally, they should only moult when it won't risk their lives, but as with anything else you can develop strains that moult at the wrong time, and that's been done with a few chook breeds to suit commercial needs, ensuring hens that don't stop laying to moult until they're actually at the usual cull-by date.

If you have commercial high production layer types like Isabrowns there's no guarantee of when they will moult, offhand, but normally moults follow a pattern based on age. If you know what time the parents moulted, you'll have a good idea of when the offspring should go into moult, roughly.

If you bought all your hens already at point of lay in spring, they may well be due to moult in winter. A lot of that depends on breed/genetics though, and diet.

Is it still a big to-do? Here it's a big thing for them. It varies bird to bird, but they drop a whole bunch, get really miserable and pouty for a few weeks and don't eat too much until they come back in.

That'd be due to genetics and possibly feed. Some birds take moulting very hard. Living in warmer areas, the Isabrowns and hard-moulters I had never suffered like others describe their birds suffering, they remained happy and active; but after a year on a better diet they moulted gradually, no big drop of feathering, which really shows the impact diet has even over the power of breeding. But I also breed my birds and consider some pets, so I give them a richer diet than most chooks get. I'm also interested in nutrition overall so I also don't tolerate the crappy commercial diets for them. You really get what you pay for!

I would imagine that not having the cold and light cycles must effect things somehow.

Sounds to me like even the cold-adapted chook breeds don't do so well overall, needing artificial light sources to force laying... Chickens are pretty much a tropical species in the first place, designed for such regular temperatures, not the snow and deep winters they've been moved to in so many places. With a good diet, moulting should be a breeze for them, never an issue.

They other thing here is that they kay less in the short days. Do they have a laying break in tropical areas?

The importance of the light/dark cold/warm cycles are often overgeneralized as though they apply to all hens, everywhere. You can more or less throw those guidelines out of the window regarding chickens in subtropical to tropical areas. Diet and genetics have far more to do with it in these warmer regions.

Also, the european seasonal model applied almost globally is outdated, it simply does not apply to all countries. In Australia the Indigenous (and many immigrant-based citizens too) believe there are six seasons in some areas and five in other areas. In other places around the world there may be only two seasons.

It's natural enough for them to lay more during spring and summer because of course, for their species that's prime reproductive time; during fall and winter they should be moulting, regenerating, and finishing raising their clutches. But we've bred them to bypass the resting period almost entirely and so left them with less time to recoup.

Yes, they do take a break. They usually do it while brooding or moulting (or not infrequently, all three at the same time. I prefer this trait and select for it, since in a hen that has a staggered moult that never leaves her with any bare skin, it means she will be back to production in much less time, having taken her break, moulted, and reared a clutch all within the same time period instead of needing three separate periods for the three separate processes)... This, however, would not work with a hen that suffers while moulting, but I really haven't seen that in my birds and think it's based on diet more than moulting actually being innately so hard on them. Every single physiological process is hard when the body is not sufficiently nutritionally supported and the average commercial hens' diet is crap, to put it nicely. 'Complete' diets, they're labeled, but it should come with a disclaimer: 'complete enough survival rations to keep your hen alive until she reaches cull age, about 2 years old'.

A hen who never takes a break produces inferior quality eggs before burning out prematurely aged, whereas a hen that takes one or two short breaks a year, or even more, will often still be laying regularly even a decade or more down the track.

Less eggs in the short term equals more, and superior quality eggs, in the long run, and because she's not burning the candle at both ends, it's possible to support two hens who take breaks on the same diet that one hen that doesn't take a break requires.

In hens that don't cease until they're burned out, they are not receiving sufficient protein to lay nonstop and grow decent plumage and regenerate damaged cells; as it's very hard on them. They are prone to premature aging and burnout, premature permanent cessation of laying, disease, hard moulting, behavioral problems driven by deficiency, and on top of all that their eggs never taste as good as other hens'. I've been thoroughly disgusted with commercial breeds of hens, in case you couldn't tell. False economies. Poor quality at that. I'd bet though that some of the original 'commercial' hens, while being less feed efficient, were superior quality.

Anyway, what is true for one is not true for all. While you observe what happens with your flock, I'd bet it's guaranteed they will disobey the rules laid out by knowledgeable peoples and textbook authors; there is such a spectrum that nobody can be 100% right about 100% of cases.

Your own chooks will, no doubt, teach you what is true for your own flock, which may be directly in contradiction with accepted 'facts'. On this forum there's plenty that believe 'commercial hens are the pinnacle of feed efficiency' --- but all the commercial hens I've owned, of different breeds, hybrids, sources, etc, were terribly inefficient compared to my mongrels. So they're not 100% wrong, and neither are they 100% right. That's always how it goes with chooks, they're always in contravention of some golden rule or another.

I would recommend you experiment with different breeds and mixes and different sources of the same breed, if you have the time/resources/inclination, to find the type that performs best for your conditions. The breed reviews and textbooks often mislead due to generalizing in defiance of the sheer spectrum of differences present between even the family lines of the same breed, never mind different breeds in different locations or reared by different breeders.

Best wishes.

 

[Happy Chooks]

@ozexpat would be a great person to ask. He's in a tropical environment.

 

[ozexpat]

Hi guys!
So, I'm in serious consideration of moving to Hawaii. Quite tired of freezing my ***** off! Anyway, I'm trying to figure out how all thing chicken work down there. So, does anyone know how the molt works when the temps and day lengths don't vary much. Right now I live in Maine, so I'm sure things are quite different in Hawaii Any other tips would be greatly appreciated as well. It seems like the chicken keeping would be much easier there. No cold, less heat, a LOT fewer preditors.
Thanks!

Hi

Its the change in light that sends my birds into molt, not the temps

My place is equatorial - 9o north of the equator - and we have almost the same length days all year around.

Almost but not the same. the days are 40 minutes longer at the summer solstice than winter one. hawaii is around 20o so maybe 80 mins.

By late October molt starts. Some hard others take a while. November is my lowesrt egg month. December I am ramping back up.

Hawaii is the perfect location to have chooks. Every island except Kauii has mongoose though so you need to predator proof your coops

good luck

 

[centrarchid]

Based on what I observed on the Hawaiian island Kauai, the molt begins and ends at the same time it does in the mid-western U.S. Photoperiod is the environmental que that initiates molt.

 

[chooks4life]

That's the textbook answer, that photoperiod is the environmental cue that initiates moult, but there's quite a few other cues as well... Like chickens moulting suddenly after stress, illness, injury, diet change, and during random times throughout the season regardless of light exposure levels.

I think all things being equal, photoperiod should be the sole initiator, but it's quite common for moult to initiate due to other cues, simply because all other things are rarely equal, lol.

 

[centrarchid]

Molting event of adults outside the normal seasonal form are indicative of need for doing a better job of controlling stress and likely outside the OP's realm of concern.

 

[chooks4life]

Molting event of adults outside the normal seasonal form are indicative of need for doing a better job of controlling stress and likely outside the OP's realm of concern.

If you own chickens, no relevant bit of info is outside your realm of concern; one would argue that your very signature supports this: 'Make every effort to understand your chicken's biology and the environment that supports it'.

I certainly agree with that. Cherrypicking facts to share or not share, based on guesswork about what's relevant or irrelevant to their situation (of which we know very little) could be a disservice.

This forum has many threads about people asking why chickens are ceasing laying or beginning moulting at strange times, or after illness or injury, etc. The OP asked about moulting and laying breaks in a generalized way, so I provided all the info I thought may be relevant to them in future.

Moving to a new region, adapting to new local diseases, changing diet, all of that can trigger moults, and I don't know if they're traveling their chooks, but if so that's hardly outside their realm of concern to know these things.

Best wishes.