Need help fine tuning our feeding method

[little20project]

I have been getting some corrugated eggs recently and I think the cause is how we are soaking the feed. Would love some fine tuning suggestions on our routine.
Here are some flock & region stats:
-9 Hens: 5 over 4yrs old & 4 2yr old rescue battery hens (with clipped beaks)
-Integrated for over a month now
-We are in Utah. So the summer heat is in the mid 90’s to 100 during the day
-Large run area using 150’ of premier1 electric netting
-Large 7gallon pan with daily fresh water
-5 gallon gravity water jug with tray
-Lots of shade with grass areas & gravel areas to scratch
-free feed to oyster shells & grit

Now onto the feeding stats:
I mix into a bucket 4 cups of IFA 20% mash with 4 cups of a feed called Hippie hen.
Hippie hen has non-gmo whole grains/seeds mix & 16% crumble.
I fill the bucket up with water so it soupy but not too watery.
I come back later and it’s all absorbed into the feed. I call it goopidy glop oatmeal.
This 8 cup mix lasts 2-2.5 days.
As I get to the bottom of the bucket it does start to smell sour which I’ve read FERMENTED feed should start to smell.
My main question is: am I hovering between soaked feed and fermented feed?
For the health of my hens do i need to soak a smaller (1 day) amount or go for the full 3 day ferment?
I really feel the couragated eggs shells is from the nutrient absorption.
Thanks in advance!

 

[azygous]

Is it more than one hen producing the corrugated eggs? Are the whites in these eggs very watery? If there are more than one hen with this egg quality issue and the whites are watery, it could be from infectious bronchitis especially if any chickens are showing signs of watery eyes and nares.

Since you are soaking the feed, why not just ferment? The "smell" you describe should be a pleasant yeasty odor, not a spoiled smell. The first fermentation may take as long as 48 hours at 75-80F if started with a little ACV but just 24 hours using a spoon full from the previous batch to start the next one.

I keep two buckets going, and start the next one as I finish one bucket. If you feed out the FF within two days of fermentation, it will be at optimal nutrition, but more than that, nutrients degrade as the mixture goes "flat". You can tell a batch is prime if it is light and fluffy.

 

[Percheron chick]

I wouldn't worry about it. Not uncommon with aged hens. The heat wave we are going through is also adding additional stress which will cause odd eggs. I think your feeding routine if fine.

 

[Kiki]

I have been getting some corrugated eggs recently and I think the cause is how we are soaking the feed. Would love some fine tuning suggestions on our routine.
Here are some flock & region stats:
-9 Hens: 5 over 4yrs old & 4 2yr old rescue battery hens (with clipped beaks)
-Integrated for over a month now
-We are in Utah. So the summer heat is in the mid 90’s to 100 during the day
-Large run area using 150’ of premier1 electric netting
-Large 7gallon pan with daily fresh water
-5 gallon gravity water jug with tray
-Lots of shade with grass areas & gravel areas to scratch
-free feed to oyster shells & grit

Now onto the feeding stats:
I mix into a bucket 4 cups of IFA 20% mash with 4 cups of a feed called Hippie hen.
Hippie hen has non-gmo whole grains/seeds mix & 16% crumble.
I fill the bucket up with water so it soupy but not too watery.
I come back later and it’s all absorbed into the feed. I call it goopidy glop oatmeal.
This 8 cup mix lasts 2-2.5 days.
As I get to the bottom of the bucket it does start to smell sour which I’ve read FERMENTED feed should start to smell.
My main question is: am I hovering between soaked feed and fermented feed?
For the health of my hens do i need to soak a smaller (1 day) amount or go for the full 3 day ferment?
I really feel the couragated eggs shells is from the nutrient absorption.
Thanks in advance!View attachment 2267508

Is this the hippie stuff you are talking about?

https://www.hippiehensfeed.com/
Stop mixing the feeds. This is not good enough for laying hens.
There is not enough calcium in it.
By mixing the three different things you're mixing you are not giving them a balanced diet.

Can you post direct links to both of the other things you mentioned mixing?

 

[U_Stormcrow]

Found this thread, coming back to it later. Though i can't touch the experience of either Azygous or Kiki, I'm already suspecting a combination of issues. Hippie Hen Label, note "Not a Complete Feed" AND a mix of whole grains and pellets. *smacks head*

IFA20 Mash

 

[U_Stormcrow]

Coming back to this now. I was hoping to find some answers to the important questions Azygous asked above, to help identify whether disease might be either a cause or a contributing factor. Are those eggs from a single bird, both battery rescues, the whole flock, just the oldest hens??

Percheron Chic has correctly aluded to the fact that reproductive problems are increasingly incident among older hens, and while "2 yr old battery hens" don't sound old, production layers are NOT bred for longevity, they are bred for early onset, frequent production of eggs of unsuaully large size, relative to body mass - they are famed for reproductive problems, typically noted beginning around the third year of life, but sooner isn't unheard of.

and as Kiki has correctly pointed out, you are feeding half what appears to be a high protein layer mash of good quality (though I'd like to see a complete guaranteed nutrition label and ingredients list) and half overpriced "scratch" (admittedly, better overall profile than mostr scratch), and one mixing nuttritiuonal suppliments as a meal/pellet and whole grains the birds can pick out in accordance with flock dominance, allowing them to contribute to their own dietary imbalances.

Feeding that whole mess as a wet mash, or better, fermented feed, helps mitigate against favored seed/grain selection by the birds. The "scratch" is about 1.6% calcium +/-, and I don't see a calcium disclosure on the IFA mash. Are you offering free choice oyster shell or similar? Even with a (spit) layer feed, free choice oyster is cheap insurance against calcium deficiencies w/o risking toxicity by mixing it into the feed.

So... in conclusion. I don't know what's causing your problem. Or even if its only one problem. Or if it can be fixed (age related reproductive problems - likely not). But you've recieved good advice, best to address those issues now, eliminate any potential causes already identified, before contemplating adding another variable in the form of garden soil kelp amendment, because you saw someone somewhere recommending dried seaweed in poultry feed (which *may* be appropriate, in some circumstances, after doing far more research into the feed situation than has occured thus far - also, its a different kind of seaweed.)

 

[Chicalina]

Can I ask, why don't you just feed a complete chicken feed? Pellets or mash (soaked or dry)?

You seem to be potentially creating deficiencies and more work for yourself and I don't understand why.

I don't know anything about fermenting feed, but your method just seems to be letting it go bad rather than deliberately fermenting using a method. Unless I've got that wrong. Why don't you make a fresh batch each day?