Serama Indoor Pet - Managing Smell?

[KentuckyRooster]

Due to the birds extremely small size, by comparison to it's little feet, the gauge is pretty thick, it isn't pictured because it hasn't been implemented yet. The droppings from this bird are roughly the same size as that of my pigeons, sometimes smaller. Pigeons range in size tremendously, some as large as a fully grown macaw (Old German Cropper) to that of a ringneck dove (Portuguese tumbler) so dropping size of a pigeon can be drastically different from breed to breed. I also personally own a pair of Old German Croppers and a Portuguese tumbler so I am fully aware of what that looks like firsthand . I disagree on the shoe analogy. When I was young I walked bare-foot everywhere I went and because of this I was able to walk on concrete, cement and any number of uncomfortable surfaces without damaging my feet or causing discomfort. I would imagine like pigeons, chickens have sturdy feet that are well adapted to the challenges of a rough terrain. His perch is a smooth wood so if for any reason he wants to get off the mesh he has an option. I will also be letting him out more frequently so the soft carpet will be a nice refreshing stroll for him. If he was a broiler I can understand his immense weight causing damage to his feet but since he's roughly 10 oz I imagine he'll be alright. I will be sure to inspect his feet daily in case I am wrong. I will also likely add a wood square in the corner of the cage for a soft foot rest and he can scratch to his hearts content when roaming freely.




Excellent, I look forward to it




Thank you for the information, I sincerely appreciate it.



lol I appreciate your concern, I have long known that roosters crow whenever they feel like it, I used to feed one of my friends chickens and was obsessed with owning a few when I was a kid. I was very certain before purchasing this bird to make the seller perfectly clear that I have no tolerance for loud or relentless noise. He assured me the bird is very quiet and not comparable to a full sized rooster. Fortunately he wasn't lying, the bird does crow continuously in the morning and if you're not near the basement you can't even hear it. It's very muted. It could be annoying if the bird was in my bedroom in the morning but in the basement you can't hear it unless you really look for it and you're fairly close to the door. I have also been informed that Seramas are perfectly good mothers and will go broody year round if provided the correct environment. I am very familiar with frustrating birds to breed, my primary pigeon breed is the Short Faced Budapest. They are EXTREMELY difficult to breed due to their tiny beaks and infrequent laying habits. Many of the babies can't even get out of the eggs due to their giant eyes and tiny beaks preventing them from chipping their way out. Here's a picture of one so you can understand what I'm referring to. The first picture required me to hand raise it at roughly that age using a curved syringe down it's crop. The second picture was taken in someone else's backyard for a pigeon club BBQ, if I had a backyard like that I'd probably keep most of them outside .

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I do not intend to raise any chicks until I have found people who are interested in adopting them first. Many of my friends who keep pigeons also keep chickens. I never really discussed chickens with any of them before because I never really had a reason to ask. I know I mentioned only having one "chicken friend" but what I meant to say is that I only really have one friend whom I speak to on a regular basis who's primary birds are chickens. My other friends whom I see on a regular basis at club meetings and pigeon auctions may be interested in getting one or two of these guys. If you think chickens can end up meeting gruesome ends then you should look into live pigeon shoots in PA. I assure you I am not naive to the realities of what happens to people's re-homed birds, guinea pigs, rabbits and dogs. There are people who go to pigeon auctions to buy birds for shooting practice, some buy them to eat, others buy them to train their dogs. Some people buy birds and the bird has the wrong color or is sick and they kill the bird on the spot without a second thought. It is a horrific reality and I do my best to avoid giving birds to people such as these. Although I do not keep chickens I am fully aware that many master breeders will sooner kill their birds then sell them to someone else and the same sort of mentality is found in the pigeon hobby as well.

I picked up a 50 lb bag at Agway very recently, It's a hen laying mix with 16% protein. Hopefully that'll be sufficient. I can also mix in the gamebird crumbles if necessary to boost the protein up higher. I also bought grit.



This breed seems fairly mild mannered, I would imagine he wouldn't mate his hen companion to death. If the hens are small enough I might consider keeping two in there with him. I might also move them to a larger cage. We shall see.


Thank you for the reply.

Eric

you could get another roo, if you wanted but if you want to breed that isn't an option of course. I like having the two boys although they do crow a lot they don't start super early or anything. They are used to the routine.

Your Budapest pigeons are so cool!

 

[Chickassan]

You and i both know it is what it is,if chickens want to fight then chickens are going to fight. Be it roos or hens it's just part of having more than one of absolutely anything. I am however glad that since this is op's first taste of chickens that if problems do occur it is between a couple cans of beans. Glad you like my signature, it's absolutely true.

It's not the size of the chicken in the fight but the size of the fight in the chicken. Even a can of beans could *probably* fight to the death if not at least good injuries. I have bantams too, they don't seem to know they aren't pit bulls. Maybe Serama's are easier going than Silkies??? One can only institute a time out if you are home and if there is nowhere to escape to for the bird on the receiving end of the beating before you discover them, then what? Hormones are a bit unpredictable, and you just never know when one day somebody snaps and decides they've had enough. Again, I'm not saying it can't be done. But being aware that a chicken is still a chicken regardless of size can allow you to be better prepared if the situation does arise. I keep my Silkies and my French Black Copper Marans together. An alleged docile breed with a know fighting background breed. I have a lead Silkie and a lead Marans. Yes, the Silkie puts everyone else (there used to be more) except the other head guy... on the run! If it came down to it, just guessing the Marans on the run would tear the Silkie boy a new one. But it's about personalities and ALL birds are individuals. So many people try to tout their 6 month old "roo" as friendly or good with kids... They DON'T know yet what the truth will be once hormones kick in. I've raised 2 teenagers in addition to being one myself once, and many animals that go through that hormonal phase. It's a difficult time in life for everyone. I've had boys NOT raised together get along fine and live happily ever after. And I've had boys raised together one day finally decide one or the other had to go. My head Marans (actual) rooster is still around because he allows integration into the stag pen. He breaks up fights, calls boys to treats, and only looked cross eyed at me ONCE! He let's the ladies groom his comb and waddles through the fence, even picking at scabs he got from scuffles... because scuffles DO happen. Yes, I agree that time outs CAN be effective.. though not always. Even use them on hens or chicks sometimes if needed.

Yes a single male and female CAN still result in over mating. Maturity may have an impact on that in addition to personality.

I personally would NOT pre wet the the pellets being discussed. We use the same type thing for our fireplace. Many people have said they work well as litter, though I haven't tried them YET. Seems like they will moisten and break up pretty fast from the birds defecating and pre-moistening would simply diminish their longevity. Again, no personal experience so they might be right about pre-wetting working best. I do love that this is a natural product that is a byproduct of something already being done. So it's not like extra trees are being cut down but rather the waste material is being re-purposed. I'm not sure how true that is for regular shavings.

Let me end by saying, I really enjoy your signature line @Chickassan . It's both pretty accurate and amusing!

 

[KentuckyRooster]

You and i both know it is what it is,if chickens want to fight then chickens are going to fight. Be it roos or hens it's just part of having more than one of absolutely anything. I am however glad that since this is op's first taste of chickens that if problems do occur it is between a couple cans of beans. Glad you like my signature, it's absolutely true.

My two cans of beans get along well.

I have found Serama to be a docile breed tolerant of eachother, even with multiple roos. My sebright can be a pill (he ran the outdoor bird show) but he and Spook get on ok, partly because Spook the serama is so agreeable. I know that Boss went for him at first but Spook stood up to him then turned away and immediately went back to being neutral. He is a smart bird- he takes no bullying but also starts no fights. Very sweet with humans and chickens alike. He enjoys sitting on humans and getting scratched in his hackle frizz.

Neither have hit their maturing spring yet I expect they will spar then. But they groom each other and snuggle and being that they are eachothers social circle I don't think they will be a problem. If they do disagree I know how to handle em.

Overall as far as roosters go though serama tend to be a very nice breed.

 

[Szulptist]

Hello everyone, I don't have time to read the posts I've received since my last response because I'm about to head out but I just wanted to add a fast update.

I went back to the store after contacting my chicken friend / skimming a few posts and traded the egg layer for a starter/grower bag. I don't want too much calcium to be a problem for my birds.

I received a phone call earlier today from the guy who sold me the rooster. He had just received a few hens and had some available for me. I drove over and 20 minutes later I picked up George's (the rooster) new wife Penelope "Penny". Since it was mentioned that you can't just throw two chickens together and hope they don't kill each other and it's the same for pigeons (and other birds). I introduced the two of them in my living room where neither of them have any territorial claim. Initially he chased her a little and then he flew up to the highest point and crowed continuously and flapped his wings. I picked her up from the other side of the room and put her on the couch with him. A few minutes later they were hanging out side by side. Within a half hour she was fully fluffed up and preening his feathers while he stood there very content looking. They seem to have really hit it off and they are now in the cage (with the new mesh floor & new starter feed w/ 18% protein) roosting side by side.

I will give more updates and pictures soon and will address all the posts I've received since my last reply.

George is 1.5 years old, Penny is 6 months old. Both similar colors.

Eric

 

[KentuckyRooster]

The crowing and flapping is showing off behavior for the lady, he's showing her he is a big man. Sounds like they're friends.

 

[Chickassan]

Maybe some little bean babies are in the works now?

 

[Szulptist]

Thank you for opening my eyes to some other bird things. I knew people do buy for hunting and training purposes, but guess I had never really considered the fate being quite so traumatic since it isn't *usually* that bad with chickens. That might be a hard pill to swallow. I just know so many people on here are are very broken hearted when they do have to let go of a cockerel. Try to help them avoid that pain if possible. As harsh as that story you tell abut buying a wrong color bird and killing on the spot seems... I also get it, as a breeder I just hate to see people doing grave injustices to certain breeds. I'm not that hard core yet, though. I usually try to get birds I really don't want breeding into homes where I know that won't be a possibility.

There are no limits the cruelty of mankind, it is certainly more prevalent when those actions aren't illegal and the victims can't call for help. To clarify, no one purchases a wrong colored bird intentionally and then kills it for being the wrong color. They purchase birds that they find have the correct qualities and then any offspring those birds have that don't meet the standard are then killed. Whether the beak is too long, the color is off, the stance is off, the bird has two different color eyes, the toe-nails aren't all the same color. Each person has their own line that they draw between acceptable and unacceptable characteristics that a bird they own can have. Ethically I believe any person who has a healthy bird that they don't want should sell it or give it away. To me it's murder to kill a healthy animal because something about it doesn't please you. Even if you feel that the "inferior specimen" could further pass along undesirable traits to the breed as a whole, you can always use it for other purposes. People who raise exotic breeds like mine use pumpers. Pumpers are any breed you purchase or use for the sole purpose of raising other bird's young. Most short faced guys use flights, tipplers or homers to raise their birds. You just swap the eggs (assuming they're laid within a close proximity of one another) and the parents do all the work. Unlike poultry, pigeons are born bald, naked and helpless and a pair of pumpers can go a long way. So to me, killing a pigeon that doesn't look right when it could be used to raise other birds is wrong even if you remove the ethical implications. I suppose a short faced mismark bird can't be a pumper but it can still go to someone who isn't as concerned about appearances. Often mismarked can also throw non-mismarked babies as some genetic traits skip a generation. In any event, I'm strongly against killing healthy animals especially for superficial reasons.

Oh gosh your pigeon is hilarious! And the pic of that boy in you hand definitely makes me want one of my own. My Silkies seem much larger than that. So did other previous bantams. But now I remember reading that Serama are supposed to be the world's smallest chicken?

They are the smallest breed, yes.

Biggest issue with laying mix for your boy is... excess calcium CAN (doesn't mean will) cause kidney issues in non laying birds. However, excess protein COULD also cause the same thing (gout then kidney failure), but a different type. Some people feed ALL their birds layer and "never see a problem". Maybe they just don't notice what it does cause (guaranteed diminished growth in chicks). Since you got a bag of it already, I would mix it with the game bird feed to get a lower calcium content. A little more protein won't/shouldn't hurt him. Sometimes those things are about genetic predisposition and some birds will be more prone than others to different factors. You seem like you understand how to mix proportionately, I would aim for not more than 2% calcium or 22% protein. But just do you best somewhere there in the middle and you will be doing so much better than many others. To me it isn't about perfection, but balance. If your game birds won't be harmed by slight reduction in protein maybe mix some of the layer into their feed so you can go through it faster. Use your judgement of course, I know nothing about pigeons.

I realized after purchasing the layer that the calcium would be a mistake (after reading several replies and being guided in a different direction by my friend I took it back and switched for grower/starter. They didn't have any all-flock. Pigeons have entirely different dietary needs and are fed pigeon food. There are many brands but I would discourage anyone from feeding their pigeons a chicken food. Way too much protein. Pigeons are not carnivorous whatsoever. They do not eat bugs, only grains and seeds (and whatever garbage we leave out).

Remember, if you consider keeping two hens (and I probably would) they can be every bit as brutal as any rooster. But my top hen, a barred rock is pretty easy going. She makes her point but moves on quickly. One of my Silkie gals is close to the top and she is a relentless bee hive. I know my situation is ever changing and I roll with it essentially. So like you say.. who knows what kind of chicken math and bigger pen you might end up with! Sounds like you're up for an adventure though!!

ETA: I do get you calloused foot analogy. My sister goes everywhere barefoot but I won't walk across the room without my shoes. And when taking dogs hiking, we "break in" their feet, or start with shorter distances.

As you said or was mentioned by someone else. All birds are individuals. The relationship between the rooster and the hen will be determined with observation and time. I understand that breeds tend to have certain characteristics behavior-wise and that there are exceptions to the rule. It is the same with pigeons. Modenas are an extremely aggressive breed but a few people claim to have ones that are as tame as puppies. I can believe it but typically it's not the case. We shall see what happens. I am not new to birds nor am I new to pet ownership. I am aware of what one animal can do to another and I am also fully aware that sexual maturity plays a large role in behavior. As the male is 1.5 years old I suspect he is "mature" and the hen is 6 months old so we'll see what happens.

Thanks for the replies. To those who complimented my chickens' cuteness, thank you. And as said, hopefully more bag of beans to come .


Eric

 

[Brahma Chicken5000]

There are no limits the cruelty of mankind, it is certainly more prevalent when those actions aren't illegal and the victims can't call for help. To clarify, no one purchases a wrong colored bird intentionally and then kills it for being the wrong color. They purchase birds that they find have the correct qualities and then any offspring those birds have that don't meet the standard are then killed. Whether the beak is too long, the color is off, the stance is off, the bird has two different color eyes, the toe-nails aren't all the same color. Each person has their own line that they draw between acceptable and unacceptable characteristics that a bird they own can have. Ethically I believe any person who has a healthy bird that they don't want should sell it or give it away. To me it's murder to kill a healthy animal because something about it doesn't please you. Even if you feel that the "inferior specimen" could further pass along undesirable traits to the breed as a whole, you can always use it for other purposes. People who raise exotic breeds like mine use pumpers. Pumpers are any breed you purchase or use for the sole purpose of raising other bird's young. Most short faced guys use flights, tipplers or homers to raise their birds. You just swap the eggs (assuming they're laid within a close proximity of one another) and the parents do all the work. Unlike poultry, pigeons are born bald, naked and helpless and a pair of pumpers can go a long way. So to me, killing a pigeon that doesn't look right when it could be used to raise other birds is wrong even if you remove the ethical implications. I suppose a short faced mismark bird can't be a pumper but it can still go to someone who isn't as concerned about appearances. Often mismarked can also throw non-mismarked babies as some genetic traits skip a generation. In any event, I'm strongly against killing healthy animals especially for superficial reasons.

Birds that a breeder doesn’t want in their gene pool could be sold to people who aren’t concerned with the bird being show quality as pets.
In March I’ll be looking for Modern Game bantam pullets, as long as they are pure modern game bantam pullets and look like it color, show quality, or meeting the Standard of Perfection would be nice but they aren’t a must.

 

[Szulptist]

Oh and I forgot, I bought the PDZ Horse Stall Freshener powdered form, is the powdered form safe for all birds (pigeons too)? I was thinking of sprinkle a little on the trays.

Thanks,

Eric

 

[EggSighted4Life]

Oh and I forgot, I bought the PDZ Horse Stall Freshener powdered form, is the powdered form safe for all birds (pigeons too)? I was thinking of sprinkle a little on the trays.

Thanks,

Eric

I didn't know it came in something other than powdered.

I also don't know for sure that it is safe for pigeons or all birds, but the directions do indicate it as being used for all species.

Can't wait to see pics of your new hen! Glad to hear your boy is a little older as well. That should help a lot. Sounds like it went great and he won't be lonely at all now!