The big bully and my 15 week old chicks

[Rockergirl]

I have 2 flocks. One I call the "bigs" - they are close to 1.5 year old and the "little" are 15 weeks old. Three in each flock. The Bigs are 2 easter eggers and 1 ISA Brown and the Littles are all blue ameracauna.

I slowly merged them at around 6-7 weeks, keeping the Littles inside the "indoor run" inside a protected section. After about a week or so, I blended them (let them roam together) because no one seemed to pay attention or care about the other. It worked out great, way better than expected. They just kind of kept to their own flocks. The Bigs did show the Littles things like "you wait to eat until they are done" but they weren't rude about it and the Littles listened.

Fast forward: My favorite Big, Callie, has turned into a jerk over about the past month and it's getting worse. Callie used to be the kindest sweetest chicken, never cared about pecking order etc. LOVED me, always ran up to me and would squat every time she saw me so I could pet her. Now she isn't talking to me (except when I have treats) and she is bullying the Littles. They are deathly afraid of her.....yesterday I did keep her separated for a little bit in the "outdoor run" and she was so mad, she would look into the "indoor run" and flap her feathers, bow up and start acting angry. I did that so the Littles could feel a little relaxed and eat, etc.

I thought it would start to ease up but it's gotten worse. When I go out each day to open up the "outdoor run" (which sometimes isn't until after lunch) - the Littles just stand and walk around on the poop board underneath the roost in the bedroom (the coop) because they are scared to death to go to the "indoor run" with Callie in there. They will leave the poop board once I open the "outdoor run" where the Bigs like to hang out, making them feel safer to go to the "indoor run".

To explain what happens - in short, Callie will corner them and peck at them for whatever reason....even when they are minding their own business. I haven't seen blood yet, thankfully. Callie doesn't go after them if they are in another area or if Callie doesn't feel like it....I honestly can't figure out what triggers Callie....

Anyway - any suggestions? I thought about locking up Callie in a dog crate inside the indoor run (which would break my heart) because I heard that is how you fix bullying and pecking order issues..... But, I'm scared that will only make her more mad when I let her out....The chicks are still not at full size, so I don't think that will solve any sort of pecking order issues. Note, the Littles have always respected the Bigs....

To add to this....I have to go out of town for business in a week.....I have a neighbor coming over to feed them and let them out, etc but I'm really stressed leaving in the middle of this issue..

Any thoughts, guidance, suggestions? Would you try to separate the 2 flocks somehow, which would be tricky....and then you have to go through the entire re-intro period again....no one seems to mind living together except for Callie.....

 

[sourland]

I would separate the two flocks or at least Callie at least for the time that you are going to be gone to assure the smaller birds are not injured.

 

[Mrs. K]

Order pin-less peepers for Callie.

Add a bunch of junk to your indoor run, make it hard for a person to walk in there. Things that block the line of sight. Things that birds can jump up on, duck behind and get out of sight. Chairs, ladders, platforms, totes on their sides, pallets leaned against a wall, up on blocks.

Mrs K

 

[rosemarythyme]

Really need to see photos of your set up, especially as you mention 2 runs (which I assume is 1 run and 1 extended coop space, but your photos may prove otherwise). Measurements would help too, for each space. The fact that you restrict them from using the full run the entire time might indicate that space constraints are part of the issue, but again I don't know without more details.

You don't mention any clutter: https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/a-cluttered-run.1323792/page-6#post-25037140 nor multiple feeders, which would be the first steps to help provide protective cover and to reduce the risk of a bully guarding resources.

 

[Rockergirl]

Really need to see photos of your set up, especially as you mention 2 runs (which I assume is 1 run and 1 extended coop space, but your photos may prove otherwise). Measurements would help too, for each space. The fact that you restrict them from using the full run the entire time might indicate that space constraints are part of the issue, but again I don't know without more details.

You don't mention any clutter: https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/a-cluttered-run.1323792/page-6#post-25037140 nor multiple feeders, which would be the first steps to help provide protective cover and to reduce the risk of a bully guarding resources.

I can get pictures posted (need to take some since we are working on a rebuild). I don't think the size is the problem. We have a new nice sized coop we are almost done building with full sized windows etc, it's totally useable now and very roomy for 6 hens (we just opened it up to them about a week ago, they aren't using it yet though, they still use their old one). This new coop opens up direct to the "indoor run" which is a cover protected run with hard wire. It meets the requirements for 6 hens. It's not a mansion but it has roost bars and plenty of floor space - especially since they can also use the coop whenever they want too since it opens up. Then, through a pop door (that we keep open right now) the old shed we were using as the coop is attached and they can walk into there (it's where the Littles hide). it isn't very big but where they sleep and lay (we built the new coop because we added the 3 chicks). We plan to remove this shed soon, once we have harmony and everyone uses the new coop. There is then an "outside" run that is not predator proof except for netting around the sides and top. We let them out there during the day. So they can walk between all spaces during the day (as long as not raining). They prefer hanging out in the "outside" run, which is bigger then the other spaces but Callie doesn't really let the Littles go out there so much anymore. So the Littles now hang out in the "indoor run" and the Bigs in the "outdoor run" during the day. In the mornings and evenings the Littles hide on the poop board, when everyone is closed up from the "outdoor run".

We do not have a lot of clutter. We have a table, tree stump and old small like play house looking thing, ladder and roosts. So maybe we should add more junk....The Littles used to go hang in the "outdoor run" behind the old shed coop (because that is sitting in the "outdoor run" while we are building the new coop (you walk through the old shed coop to get to the outside run). But now Callie even circles that area and attacks if they go over there (Callie could care less about hanging out over there, she is just being mean).

 

[Rockergirl]

Really need to see photos of your set up, especially as you mention 2 runs (which I assume is 1 run and 1 extended coop space, but your photos may prove otherwise). Measurements would help too, for each space. The fact that you restrict them from using the full run the entire time might indicate that space constraints are part of the issue, but again I don't know without more details.

You don't mention any clutter: https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/a-cluttered-run.1323792/page-6#post-25037140 nor multiple feeders, which would be the first steps to help provide protective cover and to reduce the risk of a bully guarding resources.

Actually, here is a pic of my old setup. The new setup is very similar. The section to the right of the shed/coop is the "indoor run" and the section to the right of the "indoor run" is the "outdoor run. The recent change is that we raised the roof, and replaced the shed/coop with a new coop we built that is double the size, with concrete slab and insulation, framing, windows, etc. For now, we moved the old shed/coop to the right of the "indoor run" and attached to pop door for access at all times. So, for temp purposes it is taking up some room from the "outdoor run". The Littles have been keeping to themselves in the "outdoor run" on the other side of that shed, out of Callie's vision.....but now Callie won't let them over there. Everyone sleeps in the old shed/coop for now, although they can sleep in the new one....we actually just put up a divider in the new coop last night and had the Littles sleep in there, closing them off from the Bigs. The Bigs seem to be happy about that....not sure about the Littles...and I hate for this to be a solution. To keep the Littles locked in the coop forever, separate from the others. Not much to do in there.....and I do need to get rid of the old shed at some point and all of them sleeping in the new coop.

Note - the new coop is built as part of the "indoor shed" - that's why we raised the roof - we made it one structure with a full doorway between the two. We plan to enlarge the outside run and make the sides and top netting better, after we fully complete the new coop project. That probably won't happen until spring.

 

[rosemarythyme]

If you can get photos of current set up from different angles, that would help. Like just going by the one provided photo, I can't tell if the box next to the gray coop allows birds to walk all the way around. The outside run looks to be a decent size but lacks clutter other than the red coop. And I can't tell if there's multiple feeders or where they're located.

This is typical layout of clutter in my run, done roughly to scale (photo of the run in the clutter thread from earlier). I move items around regularly. The smallish gaps behind clutter is deliberate, it allows birds run around almost everything in the set up if needed to get away from being chased. I rotate up to 4 outdoor feed bowls between the X locations.

Any measurements for the spaces? You said the inside run "meets the requirements for 6 hens" so I'm assuming it's 6x10 or thereabouts but my guessing isn't going to be helpful if I'm wrong. If the new coop is even larger then coop size should be fine, and it sounds like aggression outside right now is the concern anyhow.

 

[Rockergirl]

If you can get photos of current set up from different angles, that would help. Like just going by the one provided photo, I can't tell if the box next to the gray coop allows birds to walk all the way around. The outside run looks to be a decent size but lacks clutter other than the red coop. And I can't tell if there's multiple feeders or where they're located.

This is typical layout of clutter in my run, done roughly to scale (photo of the run in the clutter thread from earlier). I move items around regularly. The smallish gaps behind clutter is deliberate, it allows birds run around almost everything in the set up if needed to get away from being chased. I rotate up to 4 outdoor feed bowls between the X locations.View attachment 3677593
Any measurements for the spaces? You said the inside run "meets the requirements for 6 hens" so I'm assuming it's 6x10 or thereabouts but my guessing isn't going to be helpful if I'm wrong. If the new coop is even larger then coop size should be fine, and it sounds like aggression outside right now is the concern anyhow.

Sorry, it's been a crazy week so I haven't been able to take measurements....for now we have separated them and are keeping the littles in the new coop until we get back in town from my business trip.....I am kind of letting them out in the day in shifts to run around in the outdoor run. It's a bit of a chore but it's all I can do for peace right now. But, the clutter idea really sounds like a great idea. I need to do that!

Also - I think, maybe, I figured out what may have caused Callie to turn when she was totally fine with the Littles at first. She is starting to lose a bunch of feathers. I'm thinking she is going through her 1st molt (I'm surprised the other 2 Bigs aren't losing feathers), this is also my 1st molt too...so I need to read up on that. But...I did hear it's painful and stressful....so I wonder if that has turned her into a bully lady because she is just miserable from starting to lose feathers? I'm really hopeful that is it and maybe when she is done she will be my bestfriend again and nice to the Littles? Is that something that can happen when going through your 1st molt? Total mood/character change? Maybe she blames them....and totally unrelated, any tips for me on molts? Should they be treated differently?

 

[rosemarythyme]

I'm thinking she is going through her 1st molt (I'm surprised the other 2 Bigs aren't losing feathers), this is also my 1st molt too...so I need to read up on that. But...I did hear it's painful and stressful....so I wonder if that has turned her into a bully lady because she is just miserable from starting to lose feathers? I'm really hopeful that is it and maybe when she is done she will be my bestfriend again and nice to the Littles? Is that something that can happen when going through your 1st molt? Total mood/character change? Maybe she blames them....and totally unrelated, any tips for me on molts? Should they be treated differently?

Molt can make birds behave a bit differently - they could be more skittish, or lethargic, or not want to eat, or avoid roosting up against other birds. So maybe it has something to do with it, maybe not. I doubt she blames molt on the fact that the littles are around... she doesn't feel like herself is all.

I don't do anything for molts in particular other than being more hands off, as birds do not want to be touched while feathers are growing back in.

I wouldn't count on molt being the sole factor in her behavior. It might be part of it, but I would still make plans to clutter up the run space and add extra feeders/waterers. The birds will still appreciate it as enrichment even if they don't need to use it strictly to hide from being bullied.