The Genetics of Fibromelanosis in the Sikie and Ayam Cemani

[KazJaps]

Yes, when writing alleles:

Fm = FM*FM = EDN3Fm
fm+ = FM*N = EDN3+

From the mouse genetics website:
Quote:
Although with chicken genetics & ASCII nomenclature, they decided to not include definition of inheritance mode, therefore annoyingly put everything in capital letters.
http://web.archive.org/web/20120329110834/http://poultry.mph.msu.edu/about/NOME1195.html

Going by the dwarfism locus example, you might be able to shorten FM*FM to FM*F . And then hets. to FM*F/*N

Hopefully they'll give up on this ASCII nomenclature and progress through to the structural gene & nomenclature style of mouse genetics. That was the original idea, uniform genetics nomenclature across all species. And this chicken ASCII style is completely impractical for mouse genetics (the top lab genetics research species).

 

[urjtobreed]

Yes, when writing alleles:

Fm = FM*FM = [COLOR=333333]EDN3[/COLOR][COLOR=333333][SUP]Fm[/SUP][/COLOR] 
 fm+ = FM*N = [COLOR=333333]EDN3[/COLOR][COLOR=333333][SUP]+[/SUP][/COLOR] 

So even in research circles, there is disagreement on nomenclature. Thanks for your explanation.

I would think since it is the convention on this forum, and to cause the least confusion, it would be best to stick with Fm and fm+. Unless I am missing something.

 

[KazJaps]

Yes, agree Fm & fm+ is the easiest inheritance mode & allele nomenclature.

---------------------------------

I get what you are saying Henk.

The structural gene EDN3 itself is not modified, but duplicated. Never was Fm allele
duplicated, but the wild-type gene duplicated.

From the mouse genetics website, part definition of an allele:
Quote:
A single chromosome can only carry a single allele and, except in cases of duplication, deletion or trisomy, an animal carries two autosomal alleles. In particular, a transgene inserted randomly in the genome is not an allele of the endogenous locus; the condition is termed hemizygous if the transgene is present only in one of the two parental chromosome sets. By contrast, a gene modified by targeting at the endogenous locus is an allele and should be named as such.

Going back to that definition of a locus, & why it doesn't have to be specific to a gene, or coding region, etc. Obvious why they had to tweak the definition, as not only are there deletions, duplications etc of a gene, but also mutations in non-coding DNA regions, partial modification of multiple genes (eg K mutation) & even just deletions upstream to the structural gene, not on the gene itself (eg ASIP - agouti yellow in Jap Quails, SOX10 - Db in chickens, etc) .

--------------------------------
Forgot to mention that this hen is an Australian Pit Game (muff black), no Sth American blue-egger or Araucana in her (muff/beard coming from Game fowl):




----------------------------------
This 2014 paper is on the effects of melanin on internal organs:

Dubey, S. and Roulin, A. (2014), Evolutionary and biomedical consequences of internal melanins. Pigment Cell & Melanoma Research. doi: 10.1111/pcmr.12231
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/pcmr.12231/pdf

 

[nicalandia]

Quote:
The Average Person really does Not need to know all of these genetic Jargon to understand the mode of inheritance of the Fibromelanotic Trait, as far as they are concern this Research has only shed light as what the Trait looks like, just like how recessive white or the blue egg shell were caused by a RetroVirus, Most people here, must average people just want to understand how the gene is inherited and as far as I am concerned its inherited as a simple autosomal gene..

 

[nicalandia]

Quote:
Wow its so nice to have you here Mrs. Kaz, I appreciate it

 

[urjtobreed]

This is an excellent review of the current state of knowledge (as of 2013) and is put in terms that are easy to understand:

http://tru.uni-sz.bg/ascitech/3_2013/001-Fibromelanosis in domestic chickens.pdf

It also discusses the effects of interacting genes as well such as extended black and recessive white.

 

[urjtobreed]

Quote:
Wow its so nice to have you here Mrs. Kaz, I appreciate it

I agree!

 

[Kev]

Quote:
I strongly agree with this! I'm always amazed at Kaz's knowledge..! The last few posts are Awesome and just what we needed in this discussion.

I'd agree for the average genetics discussion, Fm/fm+ is more than adequate.

My other question: are there known modifiers or anything that helps with Fm expression?

I still don't know if the darkness of Cemani skin is greater than the typical Fm chicken or not but pictures and comments seem to point that way. So I am curious, if the difference is real- what is it?

E is well known as probable base for helping with dark skin. But I still have some trouble with my Fm naked neck presumed E/? appearing that dark...?

 

[nicalandia]

My other question: are there known modifiers or anything that helps with Fm expression?

I still don't know if the darkness of Cemani skin is greater than the typical Fm chicken or not but pictures and comments seem to point that way. So I am curious, if the difference is real- what is it?

E is well known as probable base for helping with dark skin. But I still have some trouble with my Fm naked neck presumed E/? appearing that dark...?

There are other genes that will boost melanin expression, not so much boost Fm, I would guess breeding to Sumatras would bring those dermal/epidermal enhancers,




Also Birchen seem to enhance Facial melanin expression...







Belgian gamefowl: https://www.google.com.ni/search?q=...4oCgAQ&ved=0CAcQ_AUoAA&biw=1366&bih=643&dpr=1




As per Dr. Ron Okimoto and Tim Adkerson advise that by their research, sex linked gold is associated with more dermal melanosis,
source: http://www.the-coop.org/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=26650&page=2

 

[Kev]

Is it because of the gypsy face? or do they have other dermal/epi enchancers also? btw, what's the genetics for gypsy face?

Also thanks for rest of comment, I needed that reminder to myself of melanin expression, dermal/epidermal enchancers.