Breda Fowl thread

[Sylvester017]

My flock is entirely mixed, and kept all together. Large fowl, a few bantams, silkies, Breda, even my peacock and turkey hen.
My Breda is a little bit of a loner, always has been, but I've never had any type of fighting.
My meanest one is a Golden Laced Wyandotte if anyone tries to eat at the same time as her, she will try to peck at them. Everyone else gets along fine.
But I have silkies, Ameraucana, Easter Egger, Olive Egger, Breda, Leghorn, Wyandotte, Barred Rock, Orpingtons, Marans, bantams, etc. all together.
My flock is bigger than yours, but still small. There are about 20 pullets/hens all together. I have a ton of chicks right now, but they are separate. I also have a meat pen, but that's in an entirely different part of the yard. Ducks have their own run as well since they dirty all the chicken's water.
I used to let them all free range, but my yard is small and the flies were getting ridiculous with them pooing wherever so they're in the run the rest of summer.
The coop is 6'x6'x6' and I leave the door open all the time. I have several nesting boxes, none are in the coop just roosts. Their run is 20 ft wide by 45ft long. 6 ft tall covered with netting to keep out hawks and the occasional possum looking to climb in.

Thank you for your kind reply. You always give me a glimmer of hope but then I wind up facing the reality of my flock's hen-pecking politics LOL!

You have a lot more room in your yard than I do. After 2 patios and 2 fenced off raised garden beds, our chickens only have about a 15' x 50' area to range and some of that is taken up by lean-to's, doghouse, canopy, and raised 4x4 dust bath bed for their use. You also have about 6 1/2 times more chickens than I do so that there's more chance for same breeds to break off into sub-groups. With 3 hens now my girls don't have the luxury to break off into little cliques to avoid each other. That may be my problem with the LF/Silkie mix in such a small yard and only zoned for 5 hens, no roos. I wish my LF would be like your GLW and only peck the others away from the feed but the Buff Leg went way too far pulling out the Ameraucana's beard down to skin and started pulling on the Silkies' crests next. I absolutely had to rehome her because there were no other birds for her to chase and scalp! And there were no equal challengers to put her in her place. She was relishing the power she wielded.

If I can get a breeder to ship Breda juveniles rather than hatching eggs in 2015 they will be my last LF experiment as I am running out of options for non-broody gentle-natured egg layers. Our Silkies are terrific egg layers when not broody and so is the Ameraucana. My Buff Leg just started laying again after a broody period and now she's gone. I want to hit my head against a beam or wall or something in frustration!

Brie is about 7 or 8 months old now? Have you weighed her recently? I have read that the Breda hens weigh anywhere from 4-lb to 5-lb. That's a wide range for a smallish breed and wonder what they really weigh?

 

[dutchbunny83]

Thank you for your kind reply. You always give me a glimmer of hope but then I wind up facing the reality of my flock's hen-pecking politics LOL!

You have a lot more room in your yard than I do. After 2 patios and 2 fenced off raised garden beds, our chickens only have about a 15' x 50' area to range and some of that is taken up by lean-to's, doghouse, canopy, and raised 4x4 dust bath bed for their use. You also have about 6 1/2 times more chickens than I do so that there's more chance for same breeds to break off into sub-groups. With 3 hens now my girls don't have the luxury to break off into little cliques to avoid each other. That may be my problem with the LF/Silkie mix in such a small yard and only zoned for 5 hens, no roos. I wish my LF would be like your GLW and only peck the others away from the feed but the Buff Leg went way too far pulling out the Ameraucana's beard down to skin and started pulling on the Silkies' crests next. I absolutely had to rehome her because there were no other birds for her to chase and scalp! And there were no equal challengers to put her in her place. She was relishing the power she wielded.

If I can get a breeder to ship Breda juveniles rather than hatching eggs in 2015 they will be my last LF experiment as I am running out of options for non-broody gentle-natured egg layers. Our Silkies are terrific egg layers when not broody and so is the Ameraucana. My Buff Leg just started laying again after a broody period and now she's gone. I want to hit my head against a beam or wall or something in frustration!

Brie is about 7 or 8 months old now? Have you weighed her recently? I have read that the Breda hens weigh anywhere from 4-lb to 5-lb. That's a wide range for a smallish breed and wonder what they really weigh?

Aww I'm sorry you've had them do that.
I guess I've just gotten lucky with ones that don't fight too much?
I have a mean turkey, but he's in the meat pen. His name is Tiny Tim & he's Christmas dinner.
All the ones in the pet pen are pretty docile.
Your ranging area is about the same size as mine with far less birds so I'm surprised they fight so much

I have not weighed Brie (we don't own a scale), but she's definitely light. She weighs less than my leghorn. She was also the smallest of the hatch, which was why I also favored her. While she stands tall she is very lanky and the feathers seem to make her larger than she is. I would think she was more around 3lbs. She doesn't feel any heavier than a silkie in my hands, even though they are much shorter they are wider.
I got the eggs in September, but I don't remember the actual hatch date, so she is coming up on 9 months here pretty soon.
I seem to have the broody bug going around here, I feel like everyone is trying to go broody on me and I don't have roosters!!! Both Olive Eggers, both Marans, and both Orpingtons. And the turkey! Hopefully out of the 6 hens someone will hatch some Breda for me, I'm expecting them this weekend...
Best of luck to you Sylvestor, I really hope you can get some Breda! I wish you were closer to me, I could bring some to you.

 

[RhodeRunner]

Reading the limited info out there on bredas, I found something about how the Dutch bred them to Cochins. What is the consensus on outbreeding bredas to a line of Cochins? If all American bredas are related to a handful imported by green fire, the gene pool must be shallow. Breeding in some Cochin blood might help vitality. But it's clearly important to keep them as pure as possible. Any and all opinions welcome. Please post ur thoughts. Thanks!

The healthiest bloodline of birds I have worked with, where inbred for three generations. On the same note, some of the unhealthiest stock I produced came from unrelated pairs. Everyone has their views on inbreeding. Mine is as follows… a bird's heath is a reflection of genetics, care, feed, and stress. Birds with healthy genetics can be inbred or bred to unrelated pairs with success. If your birds have unhealthy genetics, breeding is going to be very difficult, and inbreeding can be disastrous. Here is an excellent document on inbreeding vs. crossbreeding. http://www.dominiquechicken.com/Inbreeding_Considerations.html

I prefer to inbred a healthy line of birds. With crossbreeding you don't know what you are introducing into your flock. This is the same for health, as well as type, color, and so forth. With an inbred line it is easier to know what exactly you are working with.

Do you mind sharing your source, that said they used Cochins? I have only heard of the bantams being crossed to Dutch Booted bantams and Owl Beards. If I was considering outcrossing another breed into Bredas, an Asiatic bird wouldn't be my choice. You would be fighting with type for generations to come. I would breed in a fellow Dutch breed like the Brabanter or Owlbeard.

 

[GaryDean26]

Nice article with great examples.

 

[PhoredaBurds]

The healthiest bloodline of birds I have worked with, where inbred for three generations.  On the same note, some of the unhealthiest stock I produced came from unrelated pairs.  Everyone has their views on inbreeding.  Mine is as follows… a bird's heath is a reflection of genetics, care, feed, and stress.  Birds with healthy genetics can be inbred or bred to unrelated pairs with success.  If your birds have unhealthy genetics, breeding is going to be very difficult, and inbreeding can be disastrous.  Here is an excellent document on inbreeding vs. crossbreeding. http://www.dominiquechicken.com/Inbreeding_Considerations.html

I prefer to inbred a healthy line of birds.  With crossbreeding you don't know what you are introducing into your flock.  This is the same for health, as well as type, color, and so forth.  With an inbred line it is easier to know what exactly you are working with.

Do you mind sharing your source, that said they used Cochins?  I have only heard of the bantams being crossed to Dutch Booted bantams and Owl Beards.  If I was considering outcrossing another breed into Bredas, an Asiatic bird wouldn't be my choice. You would be fighting with type for generations to come.  I would breed in a fellow Dutch breed like the Brabanter or Owlbeard.

That's a great article. Thank you for posting it. It is interesting to read the methods he used with line breeding.

The reference to breeding Cochins to Bredas is from feathersite, http://www.feathersite.com/Poultry/CGA/Breda/BRKBreda.html. Looking closer at the article, Cochin crossing referenced occurred in the 19th century, so Cochins probably we're not as big and fluffy back then. Certainly very different birds, but it had me wondering.

It's funny you mention brabanters. It is because of a wacky brabanter pullet that I was thinking about shallow gene pools. I was considering pairing up brabanters & a spitzhauben to help the brabs. They are really different birds too. I think you're right though. The generations it would take to get back to standard might not make it worth it.

 

[Sylvester017]

The healthiest bloodline of birds I have worked with, where inbred for three generations. On the same note, some of the unhealthiest stock I produced came from unrelated pairs. Everyone has their views on inbreeding. Mine is as follows… a bird's heath is a reflection of genetics, care, feed, and stress. Birds with healthy genetics can be inbred or bred to unrelated pairs with success. If your birds have unhealthy genetics, breeding is going to be very difficult, and inbreeding can be disastrous. Here is an excellent document on inbreeding vs. crossbreeding. http://www.dominiquechicken.com/Inbreeding_Considerations.html

I prefer to inbred a healthy line of birds. With crossbreeding you don't know what you are introducing into your flock. This is the same for health, as well as type, color, and so forth. With an inbred line it is easier to know what exactly you are working with.

Do you mind sharing your source, that said they used Cochins? I have only heard of the bantams being crossed to Dutch Booted bantams and Owl Beards. If I was considering outcrossing another breed into Bredas, an Asiatic bird wouldn't be my choice. You would be fighting with type for generations to come. I would breed in a fellow Dutch breed like the Brabanter or Owlbeard.

I read an article/book by noted author/breeder Danne J. Honour on breeding Buff Leghorns and Buffs in general and he seems to feel about the same way as RhodeRunner about breeding. Unless the breeding flock is beginning to show problems or there is type or color that needs improving there is no need to introduce other stock.

 

[Sylvester017]

Aww I'm sorry you've had them do that.
I guess I've just gotten lucky with ones that don't fight too much?
I have a mean turkey, but he's in the meat pen. His name is Tiny Tim & he's Christmas dinner.
All the ones in the pet pen are pretty docile.
Your ranging area is about the same size as mine with far less birds so I'm surprised they fight so much

I have not weighed Brie (we don't own a scale), but she's definitely light. She weighs less than my leghorn. She was also the smallest of the hatch, which was why I also favored her. While she stands tall she is very lanky and the feathers seem to make her larger than she is. I would think she was more around 3lbs. She doesn't feel any heavier than a silkie in my hands, even though they are much shorter they are wider.
I got the eggs in September, but I don't remember the actual hatch date, so she is coming up on 9 months here pretty soon.
I seem to have the broody bug going around here, I feel like everyone is trying to go broody on me and I don't have roosters!!! Both Olive Eggers, both Marans, and both Orpingtons. And the turkey! Hopefully out of the 6 hens someone will hatch some Breda for me, I'm expecting them this weekend...
Best of luck to you Sylvestor, I really hope you can get some Breda! I wish you were closer to me, I could bring some to you.

* Love your new avatar!
* No chance Tiny Tim gets an Executive holiday pardon?
* My gentle birds don't fight. It's the LF egg-layers that get uppity when they reach maturity and start to bully in a hurtful way just because they can. My Silkies squabble between themselves but they don't do injury to each other or the LF. This is where I'm hoping the Breda is a non-combative personality at full maturity and not too terribly large. Our Ameraucana like your Brie looks larger/heavier than she really is. She has a lot of fluffy feathering and a statuesque stance that makes her taller and therefore appears bigger.
* Our hens' foraging area will be diminished by about 8 more feet as I add two bag bed raised garden beds that were gifted to me. On the plus side of having garden areas take away summer foraging space the hens get to forage the fallow beds in the late fall and winter months to glean crushed egg shells, worms, and dust-bathe in fresh soft garden dirt.
* Our Buff Leg layed us one last egg before she was re-homed. I get to visit all my re-homed hens but it's not the same as having them in my own yard.
* Very fortunate you have broodies for your Breda hatch. Real broodies are the best way to go. I was reading on a thread about people getting either all male hatches or all female hatches and someone came up with the explanation that if an incubator is just a tad set too warm only the males hatched and if a tad cooler more females and no males hatched (or maybe vice versa? can't remember). Don't know if that's true as I am not a hatcher but if it is so then having a broody will make the temperature just right for a 50/50 more even sex hatch rate.
* Thank you for the well wishes. I hope to get some Bredas too - funny because it would be the one breed I've never actually seen face to face before ordering.

 

[dutchbunny83]

Well, first, Thank you!!!
We're only on 1/3 acre in the city, but I went all gungho about raising our own food so I put a 20'x40' organic corn field right in my front yard. My almost 3 year old was in there helping me and I just adored that photo of her.

No, Tiny Tim doesn't get a pardon this year. Mostly because he's mean!!! Both my husband and I have are parents coming down here (13hrs & 8 hrs away) to stay with us Christmas so I want to give them a homegrown Christmas dinner (even though they probably would rather it came from a store not my backyard lol!) I'm thinking he's going to be BIG!

Brie is very gentle. Even the other 5 I had until about 6 months when they had to be rehomed were very docile as well. The roosters weren't old enough to crow or mate, but they were very calm as well. I've had a lot of roo's even chicks, showing aggression at a young age, but the Breda weren't.
Hopefully this is all of them, not just a fluke, but I tend to think the breed in general is pretty docile.
I would think a Breda would fit in perfect with your silkies (if anything, I think the silkie would be more likely to try and pick on the Breda!)

I really hope it works out for you, I just adore mine!


In sad news, one of my big fat hens decided she HAD to lay in the nesting box where my broody is sitting on Breda eggs (even though there are 6 others she could have used). They ended up fighting and 3 of the eggs broke! They're supposed to hatch this weekend, and were very developed, but not enough to survive being opened yet. There was still a lot of yolk and they just bled and died. Heartbreaking!

Also, loved the article on breeding and genetics. You all are so knowledgable about Breda, that's why I adore this thread!

 

[Sylvester017]

Well, first, Thank you!!!
We're only on 1/3 acre in the city, but I went all gungho about raising our own food so I put a 20'x40' organic corn field right in my front yard. My almost 3 year old was in there helping me and I just adored that photo of her.

No, Tiny Tim doesn't get a pardon this year. Mostly because he's mean!!! Both my husband and I have are parents coming down here (13hrs & 8 hrs away) to stay with us Christmas so I want to give them a homegrown Christmas dinner (even though they probably would rather it came from a store not my backyard lol!) I'm thinking he's going to be BIG!

Brie is very gentle. Even the other 5 I had until about 6 months when they had to be rehomed were very docile as well. The roosters weren't old enough to crow or mate, but they were very calm as well. I've had a lot of roo's even chicks, showing aggression at a young age, but the Breda weren't.
Hopefully this is all of them, not just a fluke, but I tend to think the breed in general is pretty docile.
I would think a Breda would fit in perfect with your silkies (if anything, I think the silkie would be more likely to try and pick on the Breda!)

I really hope it works out for you, I just adore mine!


In sad news, one of my big fat hens decided she HAD to lay in the nesting box where my broody is sitting on Breda eggs (even though there are 6 others she could have used). They ended up fighting and 3 of the eggs broke! They're supposed to hatch this weekend, and were very developed, but not enough to survive being opened yet. There was still a lot of yolk and they just bled and died. Heartbreaking!

Also, loved the article on breeding and genetics. You all are so knowledgable about Breda, that's why I adore this thread!

Darn pushy hens. I read a lot of people segregate the broodies for that very reason - because of other pushy hens. OMG I hope you get your pullets out of the remaining eggs. So sad!

 

[DutchChicky]

One of our black Breda's became broody a few days ago. So now all of the other girls have kinda stopped laying. She is sitting on 8 eggs and I guess they think that is enough and are taking a vacation! Last 2 days none have layed. It's weird , like they know not to disturb her, even though there are 2 extra boxed for them to lay in. Same is happening with my Barnevelders, have 2 broodies sharing a nest on 6 eggs, havent gotten any eggs out of my other eggs for a week now! Very different than my Welsummers and Ameraucana's, there the hens are very pushy and have broken eggs, trying to get in with a broody and lay their eggs.
Really bad timing for all those hens to get broody at the same time, especially with that I was done for the season with hatching, but believe every hen deserves to be a Mommy, so will let them sit Sigh