Color genetics thread.

[redrooster99]

Hello everyone.  I have a black bantam cochin hen and a calico bantam cochin rooster.  I am assuming I will get black chicks.  Any hope for any other colors.  The black came from black parents and the calico from calico parents.

I believe it would probably be black chicks with maybe some leakage, but I am by no means a genetic expert. I am just going by the different things I have learned on BYC.

 

[redrooster99]

I believe calico is mottled, so if you breed the black chicks from your above cross back to calico you could get some mottling. It may even be calico, but I am not sure.

 

[chickengr]

this is my brahma boy (bought as a pullet!). I am thinking to get some girls for him.

I do not know where mille fleur comes from. but I would like to get:

1. mille fleur easter eggers
2. mille fleur egg layers (at least 4 eggs/week).

what breed and colour should I mate to him?

 

[redrooster99]

this is my brahma boy (bought as a pullet!). I am thinking to get some girls for him. I do not know where mille fleur comes from. but I would like to get: 1. mille fleur easter eggers 2. mille fleur egg layers (at least 4 eggs/week). what breed and colour should I mate to him?

Well I am no expert but, as far as egg layers there are mille fleur leghorns, and there are swedish flower hens which I believe both lay atleast 4 eggs per week. The swedes are bigger so I would probably go with them. They also lay brown eggs like a brahma, but if you are trying to make more brahmas you have a long way to go. But u should get mille fleur or some sort of mottling ( depends on the swedes color.) That lay brown eggs, with lightly feathered feet. I am unsure on what comb you would get. Hope this helps.

 

[redrooster99]

And this hen is the closest thing I have seen to mille fleur easter eggers, but I am sure they have them.

 

[chickengr]

Well I am no expert but, as far as egg layers there are mille fleur leghorns, and there are swedish flower hens which I believe both lay atleast 4 eggs per week. The swedes are bigger so I would probably go with them. They also lay brown eggs like a brahma, but if you are trying to make more brahmas you have a long way to go. But u should get mille fleur or some sort of mottling ( depends on the swedes color.) That lay brown eggs, with lightly feathered feet. I am unsure on what comb you would get. Hope this helps.

thank you. I am not trying to get any new breed, just want lots of eggs, a colourful basket and pretty birds. even prefer different looking. any idea where mille fleur comes from? I wish I could find another mille fleur brahma, but that is almost impossible. I live in greece and I cannot find many breeds here. it seems I will have to look for some mottling chicken, that is maximum I can find here. never heard of mille fleur leghorn, thanks for information. I will definitively look for it.

 

[Adorkable]

Hi, sorry about all the questions, but I don't know much about this stuff

#1 - would she be considered partridge?



the next 2 pics show her color a little better. It's kind of a pale gold-ish color I guess. Is it just leakage or partridge?





# 2 - I know it's not an approved variety, but is this boy salmon color or Silver Wheaten or just a mess of colors? Also if I mate the same parents that made this one could I possibly get some pullets that are similar in color?



this is what he looks like from the front


#3 - could he be considered partridge? If so could I put him over the pullet in the first pic and possibly get similarly colored offspring?









The cockerels look kinda bad cause they've been sparring all morning. Hormones are starting to kick in. I have 5 young cockerels together. Separated them from mom and their sis just in time!

 

[CanuckBock]

Thank you for your help and the nice pictures CanuckBock! The sire is the only bird that is not from my line. I just purchased him last month and for his genetics I am going off what I was told. With that said, there is always a chance of something like a copy or two of Bl hiding under that recessive white! The breeder I purchased the sire from does keep blue Langshans as well and this is the first time this bird has bred.

Several Langshan breeders have reported in the last few years barring showing up in crosses of white males to black females. It is incredibly rare, but I have seen stranger things. I doubt there is any barring since both me and the breeder I got the sire from routinely breed our recessive white and blacks together and if the barring was there I would have expected it to show up before.

You are right on your thoughts on leg color. Yes, the darker pigments on the legs develop as the bird ages. I have always thought that was so neat! It is especially interesting in the white birds. As you noted, the white chicks legs and feet are mostly or completely lacking pigment, but as they mature over the first few months the legs and tops of the feet turn to a grayish blue color. If it wasn't below zero and show drifts everywhere, I would take a picture of the sire's feet right now to . I think they are beautiful as far as chicken feet go. They are a deep grayish blue on top contrasted by a bright pink skin on the webbing and bottom of the feet. Tomorrow, when it is a little warmer, I will try to get a picture.

Yes, I think you are correct about the silver creating the beetle green scheen on the black birds. The absence of silver (s+/s+ or s+/-) creates the purple sheen if I remember right. I have some black birds that have green sheen, but it is not as brilliant as the green sheen in other birds. Someone was telling me it is because I have some gold lurking in there, but I really don't know. There must be something else playing a part that I am unaware of. The main reason I am suspecting I have some gold allels hanging around is because I am seeing what I think is gold leakage in the hackles and saddles of my blue males. I have been told by several other breeders that it is gold leakage and that having a silver bird will eliminate it. The leakage is minimal, but seems to become more pronounced as the bird ages. I often don't see the "gold leakage" until the bird is over a year old.

I had no idea that the darker egg color was an indicator of more eumelanin. One observation I have made is that as the egg color begins to lighten, the ear lobes begin to get white in them.

I see from the bottom of your post you have Australian Cattle Dogs too? I have one of those too! He is my constant companion.....except when he is off eating all the chicken poop out of the compost bin. I think he is finally starting to slow down now that he is 10 years old : )

Thanks for sharing the useful info.

Always sorta nice to know there is a possibility of other colours (what else the breeder has in their yards) when you get surprises in the progeny. Makes the sleuthing a bit quicker...like in the case of this could be blue dilution...er not!

Whew...OK...the leg colour in your chicks may get darker...I suggested Barring (mottling too) as it might be the culprit of less than ideal leg colour (diluted) for your breed. Good...you know the young one's legs/toes darken up later. I find it interesting having to have multicoloured feet...I would not know where to begin! LOL So barring is unlikely...good. Glad I mentioned it tho.

​

Over time, this MDF Booted with the half/half feets (he sure freaked my beak when he hatched July 14!), kinda figured out this male has multi-colourations in his feets/toes because of mottling. He's being mottled in the feet, shanks and toes too, not just his feathers.

July 14, 2014 - as day old



Aug 4 2014
​

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In this variety in the Brahma, Buff (Buff Columbian), we want a contrast to the buff colour and the black in the feathers. The widest "contrast" in colour that is achievable is white and black...sorta the photo negative opposites!

​

I have found the dark eyed ones also are the ones with the richest eumelanin (black pigment) expressed in the plumage.

The ground colour is too "gold" in this hen, but it is a start towards Partridge pattern. ​

If I want to make a new variety, like Partridge in the Brahmas...I chose the dark eyes to make sure I would have enough black pigment in the future birds to be distributed in the black beetle greened markings.

Dec 2011​

This Booted Bantam hen pictured above here in 2011...had the most wicked dark eyes...as said, I wanted white feathers with dark skin to put one dose rec white in the MDF's for breeding purposes. These are NOT SOP compliant...skin colour should be light on White feathered Booted Bantams.

Mar 16 2014​

She produce progeny with the dark eyes, maybe a bit less dark than hers but still dark...

Dark skinned young Booteds - note eyes are dark​

The black pigment has to come from some place...so like yeller in the egg yolks, a heavy producing hen has to take the pigment from some place (and replenish and store it too). I have seen some very intense contrasts in another breed of ours, Bantam Buff Brahmas (posted above). The eye colour again was blood red...deep, deep colouration. It may not be always the case but something to observe I suppose.

The birds are like vessels with pigments dumped into them...then other genetics extend or dilute or leave it as is, push it all around to make markings...kinda like finger painting, without the need to wash yer fingees--so often, eh!

This photo of young Booteds; a good example of light skinned male (note eye colour) and dark skinned female (note eye colour!)​

Yes, we have had an interest in ACDogs fer quite some time (early 80's)...bin all sorts of involvement...from Canadian Club Historian, Secretary, Breeders' Code of Ethics & Elections chair--helped to get their distant cousin the Stumpy Tail CKC recognized. Love the breed, but not exactly poultry, eh? I can admit the colour genetic in the canines was where I began studying though. So we got herded into that aspect ... by the dawgs no less! Since the breed use to hold the world record on longevity at 29+ years young...yeh, ten is just the beginning...beginning when the Optional Brain Module (OBM) arrives...er not!

Red girls...giving each other the stinky EYE...

We have a 13+ year old female and a mixed rescue...was alot more active here dog-wise when we had all FIVE...

Hi, sorry about all the questions, but I don't know much about this stuff

#1 - would she be considered partridge?



the next 2 pics show her color a little better. It's kind of a pale gold-ish color I guess. Is it just leakage or partridge?





...


#3 - could he be considered partridge? If so could I put him over the pullet in the first pic and possibly get similarly colored offspring?









The cockerels look kinda bad cause they've been sparring all morning. Hormones are starting to kick in. I have 5 young cockerels together. Separated them from mom and their sis just in time!

From my understanding of Silkies (very little), they are based on eb Brown in the e-series (explains the grey down). Because the feather texture is VERY soft and not firm (firm feathers express colour patterns WAY crisper), the expression of a pattern like Partridge looks way different, than say in my Chantecler chicken breed (firmer feathers).

There seems to be a parti thread here on Silkies...450+ pages...maybe you may ask them there??

https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/526271/partridge-silkies-nothing-else


I will give you some things to consider in regards to your questions #1 and #3.

Here is an example of a lighter than desirable ground coloured Partridge Chantecler hen...

Dec 5, 2014​

So do you figure this is like your female you ask if she is Partridge but has a softer feather texture...do you see the pencillings but all fuzzy...if not, I don't figure your female is a representation of Partridge in the Silkie breed. Parti girls are a RED with a black marked colour pattern. An exhibition Partridge female is a deep reddish bay (her hackles are laced with reddish bay) with black markings.

This Partridge Chantecler cockerel is still growing in his feathers but is starting to exhibit his colourations​

He is a young male that is a pullet-breeder (note the red miscolours in his chest--for exhibition males, he needs a clean black chest), he is NOT an exhibition male but an male that makes exhibition females. I am grasping at straws on how a Partridge male Silkie might look if he was a pullet-breeder...more reds in his colour...not the black chested with reddish highlights I would expect to see in a Partridge male Silkie for exhibition. I would surmise a clean black chest and clean black tail in a male Partridge Silkie if for exhibition would be at the minimum of your expectations.

​

Does your male in question express pencillings like this in his saddle and hackle, but not crisp but fuzzy wuzzy? Parti boys are BLACK and red marked colour pattern. An exhibition Partridge male is rich brilliant red with beetle green black.

One of the reasons many of us double mate the Partridge pattern is because the girls look to be a completely different colour combination than the boys do. Basically in a super summarized nutshell, girls are RED and boys are BLACK and red.

Doggone & Chicken UP!

Tara Lee Higgins
Higgins Rat Ranch Conservation Farm, Alberta, Canada

 

[Bama1]

This looks like a thread where I might be able to get an answer. I want to know what color this little bantam Orpington rooster is. His parents are American black bantam Orpington and English chocolate/black bantam Orpington. His wings are the iridescent blue/black like the hackles at his tail.

 

[CanuckBock]

This looks like a thread where I might be able to get an answer. I want to know what color this little bantam Orpington rooster is. His parents are American black bantam Orpington and English chocolate/black bantam Orpington. His wings are the iridescent blue/black like the hackles at his tail.

A chocolate orp is...well uh chocolate. Woman DO like their chocolates...

http://poultrykeeper.com/chicken-breeds/the-chocolate-orpington

Tim Daniels gives a nice summary on breeding outcomes for chocolates which are gender linked in chickens and ducks.

What genders were the colours for this male's parents?

A Black male is the only bird that may be BLACK but carry chocolate...and therefore produce chocolate offspring when he himself is not a chocolate. in the union.

I find your term:​

confusing if this is not the Father.

Your male, to me, does not look particularly chocolate in the respect of what I have seen as chocolate in chickens...they are, well for the most part...just chocolate with maybe a touch of beetle green sheen perhaps.

Maybe someone else may assist and say what your male appears to be.

http://www.feathersite.com/Poultry/CGK/Orps/BRKOrps.html

I just scrolled thru FS and did not see anything that really looks like your male.

I am going to go crack open my Grant 21st Century colour book...he had Clive's choco genetics to play with and maybe I can find a match to yours...

Your bird IS pretty, kinda a sunset burst type colouration on the hackle and saddle...very nice. His tail feathers and hackles, to me in the photo, look more beetle green than blue...but could be the configurations on my monitor or me looking at the top of his hackles...the sides look to be a different colour than black in any shade.

Doggone & Chicken UP!

Tara Lee Higgins
Higgins Rat Ranch Conservation Farm, Alberta, Canada