Cream Legbar Hybrid Thread

[HaplessRunner]

This thread has been started for discussion of purposeful and inadvertent crosses of cream legbars.

While many of us are working to improve the cream legbar for application for an APA SOP, there are many opportunities to explore the genetics and characteristics of this fabulous breed. So let your imagination take hold and lets discuss some of our discoveries, disappointments, and plans for various projects. Please feel to post your pictures and thoughts.

 

[nicalandia]

@Mama Bay I forgot to tell you that the hen was a Double Blue Laced Red Barnevelder, so according to the chicken color calculator, this is what you should possibly get. Since there are no pics for the girls available, I request that the experts be kind enough to explain what that genetic jargon means:

e+eb co+co+ db+db+ Pgpg+ Mlml+ Cha+Cha+ Mhmh+ di+di+ Ig+ig cb+cb+ i+i+ Blbl+ Lav+Lav+ C+C+ Mo+Mo+ B- s+- Choc+-
Gender = Female, Ratio = 1/4 = 25%, minimum of animals to breed: 4
blue patterned red incomplete quail?•Q(wildfarbig) barred Split: lemon/cream
Continue with this Female | Select for later crossings
e+eb co+co+ db+db+ Pgpg+ Mlml+ Cha+Cha+ Mhmh+ di+di+ Ig+ig cb+cb+ i+i+ Blbl+ Lav+Lav+ C+C+ Mo+Mo+ Bb+ s+s+ Choc+Choc+
Gender = Male, Ratio = 1/4 = 25%, minimum of animals to breed: 4
extended blue patterned red duckwing barred Split: lemon/cream
Continue with this Male | Select for later crossings
e+eb co+co+ db+db+ Pgpg+ Mlml+ Cha+Cha+ Mhmh+ di+di+ Ig+ig cb+cb+ i+i+ bl+bl+ Lav+Lav+ C+C+ Mo+Mo+ B- s+- Choc+-
Gender = Female, Ratio = 1/4 = 25%, minimum of animals to breed: 4
black patterned red incomplete quail?•Q(wildfarbig) barred Split: lemon/cream
Continue with this Female | Select for later crossings
e+eb co+co+ db+db+ Pgpg+ Mlml+ Cha+Cha+ Mhmh+ di+di+ Ig+ig cb+cb+ i+i+ bl+bl+ Lav+Lav+ C+C+ Mo+Mo+ Bb+ s+s+ Choc+Choc+
Gender = Male, Ratio = 1/4 = 25%, minimum of animals to breed: 4
extended black patterned red duckwing barred Split: lemon/cream
Continue with this Male | Select for later crossings

All I can understand is half of them will have blue and other half, splash. Certainly looks like they would be double laced or at least it will be "incomplete quail" lacing on the girls. I have no idea what that means either. The boys definitely will be barred, so the boys should start looking very different as soon as they feather out (idk if the correct word is feather in or out) at 3-4 weeks of age.

I was giving you guys some time to see if someone could answer it as I am not really good teacher and can get very technical so I will be as nice as possible..


in the "NO IMAGE AVAILABLE" : which are Females

e+/eb : e+ is wildtype from Legbar and eb from Barnevelders

co+/co+: co+ is the wildtype counterpart of Columbian(Think about columbian wyandotte) while Co creates a columbian pattern co+ does not so the bird is left normal(duckwing pattern in this case)

db+/db+ : db+ is the wildtype counterpart of Db(dark brown) which is a powerful columbian like restrictor. while Db creates a Black Tailed Red pattern, db+ does nothing

Pg/pg+ : Pg is the Pattern gene(found on laced, double laced, spangled patterned birds) this gene comes from the Barnevelder parent, pg+ does nothing except that in this case is countering Pg, Pg/Pg birds have better pattern than Pg/pg+ birds because Pg its incompletely dominant.



Ml/ml+ : Ml stands for Melanotic, its a melanizer need it for lacing/spangled patterns, ml+ its the wild recessive counterpart and its also countering the Ml gene

Cha+/Cha+: its the wildtype counterpart of cha which stands for charcoil a recessive melanizer, none of these brids have cha

Mh/mh+: Mahogany is a very powerful red enhancer found on Barnevelder(also on RIR) and thats where this cross gets it from, mh+ its the wildtype counterpart and comes from the Legbar parent

di+/di+: stands for Dominant Dilute of gold di+ its the wildtype counterpart, neither of these birds have Di

Ig+/ig : ig its the autosomal recessive cream which is a gold diluter, thise cross will not be diluted because Ig+ its completely dominant over ig, ig from legbar and Ig+ from Barnevelder

cb+/cb+: cb+ its the wildtype counterpart of Cb dominant autosomal Champagne Blond gold diluter, none of these birds carry Cb

i+/i+: i+ is the wildtype counterpart of dominant white I/I(think about white leghorn) none of these birds carry dominant white

Bl/bl+: Bl is Blue(from barnevelder) bl+ is black, Bl/Bl birds are called splash blue

Lav+/Lav+: Lav+ is the dominant wildtype counterpart of lavender, none of these birds are lavender

C+/C+: C+ is the dominant wildtype counterpart of recessive white c/c, some lines of legbars carry recessive white, yours may or may not carry it

Mo+/Mo+: is the dominant wildtype counterpart of recessive mottling mo/mo, none of these birds(legbar or barnevelder) carry mottling

B: B stands for Dominant sexlinked Barring since you use a CL rooster on this cross your pullets are going to be B/- and roosters are going to be B/b+ males get one copy of B from Cl Sire and one copy of b+ from Barnevelder mother, pullets of this cross can only get one copy of B from father

s+/s+: s+ is the wildtype recessive sexlinked gold gene, since both parents are s+/s+ females are s+/- and males are s+/s+


How does this Translate to looks?

Males will look like a darker than usual(thanks to Melanotic and Pg) single Barred red Crele(thanks to mahogany for enhancing gold and single copy of Barring making the barring very dark) 50% will be Blue and 50% Black as in blue crele or black crele

Show Quality Barnevelder males can be very very dark making the hackle almost entirely black, but you can still see its ducking(gold/red wing triangle or secondaries)


but the males from this cross will be less dark due to melanotic not being completely dominant,

the females will also be darker than usual, this is a e+/eb based banevelder cross hen, you may see same pattern but with barring, some CL females already show some form of melanzing



another double laced wiltype pullet

 

[CemaniLegbar]

Hello, long time reader, first time poster....anyway, here is my legbar hybrid. Ayam Cemani (green fire farms) over Cream Legbar (Ree's line) hens.They turned out beautiful (to me anyhow). As far as I can tell there should be some sexlink action with this combo, right? My pullets are all black like their dad but are crested like mom. Black skin, combs, eyes, tounge, etc. The cockrels are barred and crested with neat penciling and black\white coloration (very formal lol). The boys had a dot on their heads and black down at hatch with a chipmunk pattern. The girls were all black at hatch.

 

[HaplessRunner]

Since I opened this thread, I will repost an item that I posted on the cream legbar thread. Enjoy & Comment!

Apparent Confirmation of Transmission of Cream Legbar Autosexing Traits

Earlier, I had posted some pictures of the results of crossing cream legbars with an EE hen and RIR hens. This came about initially to keep three males who had reached sexual maturity prior to the cream legbar pullets. This allowed the pullets to grow without too much harassment from the juvenile males. It worked as planned. So on a whim, I decided to hatch some of these eggs to see what would come of this crossing. i was curious as to whether the autosexing traits could be transmitted.

When the three chicks hatched, I was fairly certain that the trait had been transmitted. The CCLxEE roo appeared to have a white spot on his head. Feather sexing also indicated that this chick was a roo. As you will note from the pictures at one week below, it does appear that the autosexing trait did transmit to this first generation cross.

Hatching pictures of CCxEE Roo





CCLxEE Roo at one week









Note what appears to be a definitive white spot on his head as opposed to a "cap" exhibited by other barred chick varieties. While certainly a case may be made for the chipmunk stripping on this chicks back, my feeling is that this more attributable to the EE inheritance.

For reference:

EE Mother of CCLxEE Roo



Father of CCLxEE Roo and CCLxRIR Pullets



With respect to the CCLxRIR crosses, each of these chicks exhibited strong chipmunk stripping as well some RIR striping from the back of their heads. Feather sexing also appears to indicate that these two chicks are pullets.

The following pictures are of the CCLxRIR pullets on hatching day:

Pullet #1





Pullet #2





The following pictures at one week of age are much more definitive. You will see heavy chipmunk striping and CCL eye liner as well as the RIR center strip down the back of the head. What you will not see is any indication of a white spot on the head of these chicks.

Pullet #1


Pullet #2


Both chicks together




This has been an interesting adventure. Thoughts?

 

[nicalandia]

Not to argue since I don't know personally, but I heard the exact opposite is true. Apparently crossing a CL or Ameraucana with a leghorn will result in a SBEL (Super blue egg layer). Genetically they are O/o+ and lay a darker blue egg than the O/O hens.

I hope to find out for myself one day. I gave a O/O rooster to a friend who has leghorn hens. I'm hoping to get some eggs from her and hatch them out this year. Of course it will probably be a year from now before I get any eggs from the resulting offspring.

The Term Super Blue Egg layer comes because they are super at laying blue eggs not that they lay super blue colored eggs..

 

[hootiehoo15]

Hi all! Just wanted to share some of our clb hybrids we decided to hatch. So far weve hatched a 1 sapphire, 2 ice cream bars, 1 of what we like to call an "ameraucan cream", 1 Sage egger (clb/welsummer), and our little Easter Bonnet (clb/ (polish/australorp cross))

 

[chicken pickin]

I have CL hybrid chicks They are Cream Legbar Rooster x SIlver Laced Cochins (which creates a Red Sexlink) pullets hatch reddish brown roosters hatch yellow/black or silver/black

These are my 2 pullets I am growing out

at hatch the 2 pullets are to the back left with reddish/brown faces










and I have 2 new hatched chicks they are CL x Silver Laced Wyandottes (also Red Sexlinks)

the red/brown chick is the pullet the yellow and black is the rooster

 

[normanack]

There's a group on The Facebook (I am too old to navigate properly to the group's page) called Chicken Genetics that can probably help.
I wish the Chicken Calculator let you choose by breed instead of color name; it would be easier for non-geneticists to use.

 

[TheFF]

This is a great thread! It is nice to see everyone's hybrids. I have two that just hatched last week or so. I think the light chick is a hen and the dark chick is a roo, I'm not entirely sure though. The light chick had a white EE for a momma and then black chick had a silver/grey Cochin for a momma.



My silly little Serama ended up being the broody that raised them. Actually, my other Serama thinks she is the momma too! So they get along quite will in the flock with two feisty protectors!

 

[nicalandia]

nice... she appears to be a Silver (S/-) with eb(partridge brown) instead of e+, how do you know that? she lacks Salmon breast, she is mostly wildtype for all other genes except she appears to have Pg(pattern gene) she looks melanized...


a cross of her to CCL will produce gold females with pale salmon breast this females(e+/eb) will be also barred as the CCL hens...

this cross will produce single barred males that will be golden instead of gold or instead of silver(S/s+) they will be dark barred...

the male will look like the single barred CCL below(google pic link) but with a cream/yellow instead of gold
http://www.google.com.ni/imgres?sa=...y=110&vpx=2&vpy=273&dur=468&hovh=194&hovw=259