Farming and Homesteading Heritage Poultry

[gjensen]

Sorry, I can't concede on that one. I will agree that there are similarities, and could be used to occupy similar roles. One is longer than the other etc. The SOP does not go into great enough detail to fully describe what a bird is, and I will not even concider what is shown.

There is enough in the SOP to see the difference though. That is the written section. The NH is described as medium in length, and the Australorp moderately long. The NH neck is medium in length, and the Australorp is moderately long. This medium everything NH's weight comes from it's width. It should be a slightly wider bird.

One is a dual purpouse bird with an emphasis on egg laying. The other is a dual purpouse bird with an emphasis on putting meat on at an early age. This is reflected in the difference of body type.

If you buy Rhode Island Reds from Ideal and grow them out, you will see a particular tendency. (I am not speaking of their production reds, but their darks.) The faster maturing birds (or the ones with greater weight at younger ages) tend to be the shorter wider birds. That is not with out exception ofcourse. That is how the NH got it's shape. Pushing for that weight at young ages and speed of maturity. The longer and taller a bird is, the more frame it has to build. Or bone to grow out. This broad bird without the capacity of a longer bird is the reason for their historic reputation as average to good layers. The extra length of the Australorp is the opposite. Both had egg laying strains that did really well, so this isn't the best point, but you see what I am trying to say.

I am sure their is fault with what I have said. I see better than I say. My point is intended to be cosistant with my opinion that they do have slightly different body types, because the emphasis of the two are different. Close, but different. The closest bird to the NH in the SOP is the Delaware, the biggest difference being length and color.

Now what they have evolved to be? That is another subject.

I will continue to agree that there are similarities, and even in their development.

I hope this isn't taken as a negative. I enjoy reading your posts and thread. I have learned a lot. I guess that you can figure something like this coming from a NH enthusiast.

Where do I insert the smilies?

 

[Arielle]

Freds HEns--Isa Browns--order thee from where? and hope for a few mis-sexed birds that are actually boys? Thank you for clarifying the reality of the old homestead life. More to think about.

 

[Arielle]

SOrry if this has already been posted--from OSU on the heritage LF thread:


If anyone is interested in some good Standard Bred poultry, I just got this from Frank Reese, he is going to be selling chicks, hatching eggs and grown stock. His prices look very reasonable.


Good Shepherd Poultry Ranch Inc..
“THE OLDEST CONTINUOUS BREEDING FLOCK OF STANDARD BRED TURKEYS IN AMERICA”
The Mission of Good Shepherd Ranch is preservation of Standard Bred poultry
Life time member of the American Poultry Association and Master breeder
The hatchery and breeding birds are certified by the National Poultry Improvement Program (N.P.I.P.) through USDA
2013 Poultry sale list of hatching eggs, chicks, poults, ducks and geese:
All poultry at Good Shepherd are standard bred birds raised to meet the Standards of the American Poultry Association. Frank Reese has been raising, breeding, hatching and showing poultry for of 50 years. All the poultry raised at Good Shepherd can be trace back to known old American flocks. We have no factory genetics on our farm. All the birds, chicks and egg being sold are for breeding stock and not for just egg and meat. The main reason for selling our birds is to help people get started breeding and raising their own birds. We work very hard to keep our standard bred poultry at the highest of level for standard bred poultry meat production and eggs production. Many people are now calling standard bred poultry heritage poultry today but their real name is standard bred.
1. Barred Plymouth Rock of the Ralph Sturgeon strain. Got my first Barred Rocks in 1956 from Ralph from Ohio. Barred Rocks were King of the farm and meat world for over 50 years.
· Hatching eggs are 24 dollars a dozen
· Day old chicks for breeding stock are 5 dollars each for fewer than 100 chicks and 4 dollar each over 100
· Grown breeding stock 25 dollars and up from there depending on quality.

2. White Jersey Giants are pure Golda Miller strain. Have had Giants since 1962
· Hatching eggs are 30 dollars a dozen
· Day old chicks for breeding stock are 6 dollars each for fewer than 100 chicks and 5 dollars each over 100
· Grown breeding stock 25 dollars and up from there depending on quality.

3. Dark and White Laced Indian Game Cornish are pure Tommy Reece strain. Got my start in Cornish in 1994 when Tommy Reece passed away.
· Hatching eggs are 30 dollars a dozen
· Day old chicks for breeding stock are 6 dollars each for fewer than 100 chicks and 5 dollars each over 100
· Grown breeding stock 30 dollars and up from there depending on quality.

4. New Hampshire got my first New Hampshire back in 1956 from a friend of the family. My strain of New Hampshire’s is the old meat strain.
· Hatching eggs are 24 dollars a dozen
· Day old chicks for breeding stock are 5 dollars each for fewer than 100 chicks and 4 dollars each over 100
· Grown breeding stock is 20 dollars each and up from there depending on quality.

5. Columbian Wyndotte I have been working for years to make and improve my own Columbian Wyndotte. With the help from the late Cecil Moore I feel I have come up with a very good Columbian Wyndotte.
· Hatching eggs are 24 dollars a dozen
· Day old chicks for breeding stock are 5 dollars each for fewer than 100 chicks and 4 dollars each over 100
· Grown breeding stock 25 dollars and up from there depending on quality.

6. Bronze turkeys from Norman Kardosh, Rolla Henry and Cecil Moore. I got my first turkeys back in 1958 from Norman Kardosh and kept them ever since. The standard Bronze is the King of turkeys and cannot be beat for a fine heritage turkey.
· Hatching eggs are 5 dollars each for less than 4 dozen eggs and 4 dollars each egg above 4 dozen
· Day old poults are 10 each for less than 100. Their 9 dollars each for 100 to 300 and 8 dollars each above 300
· Grown breeding stock starts at 100 dollars each and up from there depending on quality.

7. Narragansett turkeys from Norman Kardosh, they were Norman’s favorite turkeys. Got my first Narragansett in 1966
· Hatching eggs are 5 dollars each for less than 4 dozen eggs and 4 dollars each egg above 4 dozen.
· Day old poults are 10 dollars each for less than 100. Their 9 dollars each for 100 to 300 and 8 dollars each above 300
· Grown breeding stock starts at 100 dollars each and up from there depending on quality.

8. White Holland is a sport of my Bronze as they were first made 150 years ago. Large self –breeding white turkeys with brown eyes. I worked with Norman Kardosh over a number of years to make a good White Holland.
· Hatching eggs are 5 dollars each for less than 4 dozen eggs and 4 dollars each egg above 4 dozen
· Day old poults are 10 dollars each for less than 100. Their 9 dollars each for 100 to 300 and 8 dollars each above 300
· Mature breeding stock is 100 dollars each and up depending on quality.

9. The Blacks were kept at Danny Williamson’s farm for a number of years and Danny did a great job of keeping size up and a good black bird.
· Hatching eggs are 5 dollars each for less than 4 dozen eggs and 4 dollars each egg above 4 dozenl
· Day old poults are 10 dollars each for less than 100. There are 9 dollars each for 100 to 300 and 8 dollars each above 300.
· Mature breeding stock is 100 dollars each and up depending on quality.

10. We do have smaller amount of breeds we are working on at this time to help save and preserve.
Rose Comb White Leghorns, Blue Andalusian, Rose comb Ancona, Dark Brown Leghorn, Buff Leghorn, Rose Comb Minorca, White Faced Black Spanish, Silver Laced Wyandotte, White Cornish that are Lou Straits old line, Golda Miller’s pure line of Black Jersey Giants which I got from Golda the first time in 1960 and Sadie Lloyd’s line of Bourbon Red Turkeys If there is a breed you’re looking for please let us know and we might be able to help you find a good old line of that breed. It is always best to buy poultry from a known breeder who has work hard to preserve and maintain an old line of poultry.

11. We also have Roger Stanford’s line of Rouen ducks, Gerald Donnelly’s line of Aylesbury ducks, Rolla Henry’s line of Dewlap geese both gray and buff and Roger Stanford’s line of African geese. Please contact us for pricing.

It is always best to come to the farm to pick up your birds. Give us a chance to teach about the birds you are buying. If you wish us to ship live birds we will only ship by air. The flight must be a direct flight to a major airport with no flight changes. You will have to pay to have us drive them to the airport and the cost of shipping.

Contacts for information about birds

Frank R. Reese Jr.
730 Smoky Valley Road
Lindsborg, Kansas 67456
785 227 3972
[email protected] email
www.reeseturkeys.com website
www.heritagechef.com website

Devon Reese
620 664 1778 phone
[email protected] email

Ryon Carey
620 245 7469 phone
[email protected] email

 

[Fred's Hens]

There may be another distributor, but I am not aware of one. Townline Hatchery in Zeeland, MI. If you want a cockerel? You'd probably not get one in a box of 25. LOL That's the way it goes. If you don't, there'd probably be one or two or three in the box. I believe they'd gladly stick a cockerel or two in the box if you asked when ordering.

Most of the Michigan - Northern Indiana feed stores, TSC, Family Farm and Home and other outlets also sell Townline birds during their spring chick days.

But, since this thread is geared to heritage, standard bred fowl, that needs to be the focus, I should think. There are standard bred birds that will lay plenty well enough to provide all the eggs a homesteader would ever need.

 

[Arielle]

There may be another distributor, but I am not aware of one. Townline Hatchery in Zeeland, MI. If you want a cockerel? You'd probably not get one in a box of 25. LOL That's the way it goes. If you don't, there'd probably be one or two or three in the box. I believe they'd gladly stick a cockerel or two in the box if you asked when ordering.

Most of the Michigan - Northern Indiana feed stores, TSC, Family Farm and Home and other outlets also sell Townline birds during their spring chick days.

But, since this thread is geared to heritage, standard bred fowl, that needs to be the focus, I should think. There are standard bred birds that will lay plenty well enough to provide all the eggs a homesteader would ever need.

THanks Fred. I'm at that point of trying to figure out which direction to head in. Bob suggested using one poultry venture to support the other. I suspect it will be the black copper marans for me rather than trying to sell eating eggs.

 

[Yellow House Farm]

There's an organic farm down the road that uses ISA browns, and they're nice factory hens. When we were doing table eggs year-round for the local market, we had a strong showing from our Anconas. To this day, I believe firmly that one can do well using heritage breed egg-layers for eggs. They're more than capable of providing the production needed for the possible distribution potential of a homestead.

 

[Yellow House Farm]

Sorry, I can't concede on that one. I will agree that there are similarities, and could be used to occupy similar roles. One is longer than the other etc. The SOP does not go into great enough detail to fully describe what a bird is, and I will not even concider what is shown.

There is enough in the SOP to see the difference though. That is the written section. The NH is described as medium in length, and the Australorp moderately long. The NH neck is medium in length, and the Australorp is moderately long. This medium everything NH's weight comes from it's width. It should be a slightly wider bird.

One is a dual purpouse bird with an emphasis on egg laying. The other is a dual purpouse bird with an emphasis on putting meat on at an early age. This is reflected in the difference of body type.

If you buy Rhode Island Reds from Ideal and grow them out, you will see a particular tendency. (I am not speaking of their production reds, but their darks.) The faster maturing birds (or the ones with greater weight at younger ages) tend to be the shorter wider birds. That is not with out exception ofcourse. That is how the NH got it's shape. Pushing for that weight at young ages and speed of maturity. The longer and taller a bird is, the more frame it has to build. Or bone to grow out. This broad bird without the capacity of a longer bird is the reason for their historic reputation as average to good layers. The extra length of the Australorp is the opposite. Both had egg laying strains that did really well, so this isn't the best point, but you see what I am trying to say.

I am sure their is fault with what I have said. I see better than I say. My point is intended to be cosistant with my opinion that they do have slightly different body types, because the emphasis of the two are different. Close, but different. The closest bird to the NH in the SOP is the Delaware, the biggest difference being length and color.

Now what they have evolved to be? That is another subject.

I will continue to agree that there are similarities, and even in their development.

I hope this isn't taken as a negative. I enjoy reading your posts and thread. I have learned a lot. I guess that you can figure something like this coming from a NH enthusiast.

Where do I insert the smilies?

I think that we are in agreement, but that we're coming at it from different angles. I'm stressing is their imilarities, while you're reiterating the differences that still make them separate. What I'm hearing you say is that they're essentially the same bird with "slightly different body types" to compensate for their historical production values. I agree completely.

"I hope this isn't taken as a negative. I enjoy reading your posts and thread. I have learned a lot. I guess that you can figure something like this coming from a NH enthusiast." Of course not! How can we challenge each other an grow and expand out thinking is we're too polite to disagree or approach something from a different angle? It only makes us think/write out our ideas, which is to everyone's benefit.

 

[7961]

When the day comes to talk about Wyandottes on the new Thread this picture needs to show up there. Can you see the circle in this males all around type. In Reds we look for the Brick. In Rocks we look for the derby hat or the gravy bowl look. He is a nice birds and would love to mate his daughters back to him for two or theee years to fix this type. They have a good gene pool of birds. I am glad you have him.

For sure I can post it there when the time comes...I am assuming that you are referring to the Chicken University Thread. Thank you for the kind words of encouragement. I have 2 maybe a 3rd pretty nice females that I am going to mate him up with. A mental note has been made, I won't forget about mating the daughters back to him. I want to do what is right and keep this line pure.

 

[gjensen]

There's an organic farm down the road that uses ISA browns, and they're nice factory hens. When we were doing table eggs year-round for the local market, we had a strong showing from our Anconas. To this day, I believe firmly that one can do well using heritage breed egg-layers for eggs. They're more than capable of providing the production needed for the possible distribution potential of a homestead.

On our other topic, I do not think we are quite there. That is ok, and it isn't important to me.

On this point, we are in agreement. I believe the same, and that is why I read this thread. That is, with selection, the right breed, and proper management. I at least believe that you can come out ahead.

I do not know that there is a market for meat in my area. These rural Southerners are practical. They are not going to pay much more for a chicken dinner. Many will pay a little more for eggs. My wife sells eggs, and it pays for enough feed to feed a flock. I sold enough eggs, chicks, and culls to pay for growing out the replacements. Now that isn't all of the misc. and time that comes with the process.
I would like to make enough improvement to pay for that misc. and my own meat and eggs. The meat and eggs (and fertilizer) being the profit. I think that it could be done. I have found that the "customers" that my wife has do not care what color the eggs are. They just want to know where they came from.

I do better selling plants, and do not put any effort into selling them. The word gets out that you have that hobby, and they prefer to get their blueberry plants, muscadines, etc from you vs. Lowes etc. My birds contribute to that effort. My point is that it becomes a system, where one contributes to another. We produce more fruit than we need so guess who enjoys the extras.

I do not think that you can do anymore good for a breed than to breed them correctly and use them in a system that they fit. Most of the breeds were bred to do something, and their original developers knew what they were doing.

I think a challenge is that many of the more modern breeds were selected to perform well on cheap processed grains etc. I am of the opinion that these grains will continue to get more expensive. I believe that the American breeds can and should continue to have a role, but I also believe that this is cause to give the Mediterranean breeds a second look, particularly when they tend to be overlooked. I think the Anconas are an excellent choice, and this thinking is one of the reasons I decided to give Catalanas a shot. Kind of a middle ground between my New Hampshires, and the lighter Mediterraneans. The Mediterraneans just make sense when your primary goal is to produce eggs.

I flock of well bred Anconas would be far and away more appealing than a flock of the commercial hybrids on range. Better suited for it to.

 

[Arielle]

Quote: You bring up a point that I have been trying to get to : which birds do well , say foraging, rather than standing around the feed bucket sucking down expensive grain.

I know this isn't your favortite breed YHF, but I would like to bring up the Buckeye for a moment. My understanding of this breed is that is wasn't designed for the showroom but rather a homesteading situation. THe ABLC picked this breed for what ever reason, perhaps it was Don Schrider that actually picked this breed, and from what I understand, he was able to increase the rate of gain and put on a full pound of body weight more in three years of selection. ( I"m sorry I can't remember where I read this. ) In many respects this bird fits my needs: forager, small comb, thrifty, camoflauged, spry, and easy going temperament, meaty and some eggs.

COmments welcome.