Genetics Help Please, Curious Tail Development - or lack there of...

thecuriouslynx

Chirping
7 Years
Jan 13, 2013
55
11
99
Hi all. I am an older backyard flock breeder of many years with little knowledge of proper genetic breeding to any standard other than my own, so I will appreciate any response, especially from geneticists, breeders or even if you just think they are cute! I have bred generations of my private flock of non-standard mixed Ameraucana Easter Eggers for fun and table. I am curious whether genes from their original Aracauna lineage could affect or consistently present themselves in a new manner resembling the source lineage but is obviously not authentic to it?

LOL! This "rear end" effect (which makes me call them Puff Tails) first appeared in one cockerel about five years back. I thought it sort of cute and went with what Mother Nature was offering by keeping him and breeding him back to the flock. Over the last few years slowly in the males this "rear end" has developed to be a fairly consistent presentation and seems to slowly be shortening the girls tails also. Some chicks will "age out" of it and grow short tails as their teenage hormones surge however, many others stay mostly without into adulthood. As can be seen in the pics the boys still develop neck hackles and the typical narrow sword feathers just in front of where the large curving sickle feathers should grow. Of those I have inspected, most seem to still have tail vertebrae (parsons nose) but smaller than average. They seem to have no problems breeding. All adult cocks and coming of age teenage cockerels have high sexually activity and definitely make contact with the hens. Proven by the high percentage of developing embryos when I candle seven day eggs. I have heard of the genetic mutation of roosters being "hen tailed" but my understanding and internet research has shown that they still do have tail feathers, and resembles a hen’s tail - no large curving sickle type feathers.

Hard to get good pics when they keep moving but below are a few of the boys and how they look. First pic is a twelve month old cock (named Hey Hey from the Moana movie since he looks so funny), second is a seven month old son, third a five month old son? And four a three month old son? Hard for me to tell at times. All are from different hens and none have been "feather plucked". Nothing really there to pluck! LOL!

Is this physical presentation a throwback genetically to the source lineage, an extreme form of hen type feathering in males like an extreme appendage alteration of the skin genes similar to crested chickens or, something else? I know overall chicken genetics are very convoluted and an EE’s genetics even more so LOL! But if anyone can contribute I would appreciate it.

Thank you for your time and responses,
The Curious Lynx
IMG_20200601_173350.jpg IMG_20200726_051946.jpg IMG_20200827_121917.jpg IMG_20200811_191034.jpg
 
Maybe one or some of your Easter Eggers had Rumpless genes from the Araucana, and that's coming out. Not sure about yours if they still have the tail (Parson's nose). They're cute!

If you like the trait, sure, breed them! Note that it is better to keep some clean-faced birds because double copies (homozygous) of the Tufted gene causes in-shell mortality and failure-to-thrive.

Here's a bit more info on Rumpless Araucanas - the Rumpless gene is Rp

https://www.araucana.net/introaraucana/

https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/araucana-lethal-gene.136239/

https://www.feathersite.com/Poultry/CGA/Arau/ACARumplTufted.html

https://poultrykeeper.com/chicken-breeds/rumpless-araucana-chickens/
 
Looks like the recessive rumpless gene is popping up in your flock. Very interesting!
I wouldn’t worry about lethal genes. They are caused by the eartuft gene, which your birds do not have.
 
Maybe one or some of your Easter Eggers had Rumpless genes from the Araucana, and that's coming out. Not sure about yours if they still have the tail (Parson's nose). They're cute!

If you like the trait, sure, breed them! Note that it is better to keep some clean-faced birds because double copies (homozygous) of the Tufted gene causes in-shell mortality and failure-to-thrive.

Here's a bit more info on Rumpless Araucanas - the Rumpless gene is Rp

https://www.araucana.net/introaraucana/

https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/araucana-lethal-gene.136239/

https://www.feathersite.com/Poultry/CGA/Arau/ACARumplTufted.html

https://poultrykeeper.com/chicken-breeds/rumpless-araucana-chickens/
Thank You. I think they are cute too! My birds are an assortment but they do all lay various shades of blue or mint green egg. So in that sense they could go back to the Araucana and this is why I am seeking other opinions. The pics do not show them real well. Seeing them live reveals better how the puff tails are coming through with the different body types. Some are very lean and more upright stance game bird looking and others are round and more squat. This year has produced the most absence of tails in the male chicks, two-thirds of them. The girls have tails which are getting shorter but it is going slower on their side and i am not sure why. do you have any thoughts on that?
 
Looks like the recessive rumpless gene is popping up in your flock. Very interesting!
I wouldn’t worry about lethal genes. They are caused by the eartuft gene, which your birds do not have.
Hi there, Interesting yes. Is it truly the rump less gene though and would that gene be connected to the skeleton? Or, is this something affecting just the length of the tail feathers? It is popping up pretty consistent this year so it has "settled in" to the genetics. Where some of the females over the past couple years are getting shorter tails they are not quite as short just yet. And seem to have a bit different shape with a fuller loin area. I have a large flock however all of the hens must now carry the genetics for it since the offspring have all been bred by a puff tail rooster for a couple years. I think the hen carries and passes the genetics to the sons and the rooster carries and transfers to the daughters? Not sure if that is that correct.
 
Maybe one or some of your Easter Eggers had Rumpless genes from the Araucana, and that's coming out. Not sure about yours if they still have the tail (Parson's nose). They're cute!

If you like the trait, sure, breed them! Note that it is better to keep some clean-faced birds because double copies (homozygous) of the Tufted gene causes in-shell mortality and failure-to-thrive.

Here's a bit more info on Rumpless Araucanas - the Rumpless gene is Rp

https://www.araucana.net/introaraucana/

https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/araucana-lethal-gene.136239/

https://www.feathersite.com/Poultry/CGA/Arau/ACARumplTufted.html

https://poultrykeeper.com/chicken-breeds/rumpless-araucana-chickens/
thank you very much for the links. I have started to go through them, very informative! Yes I do like my "mutts". And they are keeping me sane during this crazy time too! I will keep a few smooth faced hens now, thank you. but should I ever breed a smooth faced roo to the hens? will that mess up anything? Or just breed smooth face hen to muff and beard cock? I think this info may be in the links you listed though?
 
thank you very much for the links. I have started to go through them, very informative! Yes I do like my "mutts". And they are keeping me sane during this crazy time too! I will keep a few smooth faced hens now, thank you. but should I ever breed a smooth faced roo to the hens? will that mess up anything? Or just breed smooth face hen to muff and beard cock? I think this info may be in the links you listed though?
Just so you know you can breed bearded to bearded. The mb (muff beard) gene is not leathal. The ear tuft gene is.
 

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