My Jumbo quail roo is injured on his backside, kind of to his left.

Ok, now imagine your current complete quail feed averages 23% protein, 3.4% fat (this is long enough as is, I'm not even going to get into all the other stuff). Now imagine you follow the thumb rule and add treats in the form of dried mealworms at 10% of the weight of the feed you are offering.

Now there's some disagreement. Birds are reasonably good (again, Cx excepted, and individuals vary) at balancing their energy intake, ALL ELSE BEING EQUAL (important caveat). Birds are also rather good at balancing their protein intake (ALL ELSE BEING EQUAL). Sadly, they are pretty bad at balancing for an appropiriate amino acid profile - which is much more important than crude protein alone. They show similar ability to self regulate Calcium intake, and a few other things. But in this case, it doesn't help - there isn't broad enough selection to allow a bird to permit a bird to balance its own intakes.

Itr will either eat all the complete feed and all the mealworms, all the mealworms and some of the complete feed, or something inbetween. That provides our ranges.

A bird which eats 9 parts feed, 1 part mealworms has increased iots average protein intake from 23% of the diet to 25.2%, a very tiny relative improvement. On the other hand, its fat intake has gone from 3.4% of the diet to 5.56% of the diet - a very substantial increase in fat intake (and daily energy). The bird eating the regular aration of feed PLUS 1/10th the ration in mealworms is 25%/5.36% respectively - less average fat (though still a significant amount over desired) and increased its total calory intake singificantly.

As it turns out, birds don't deposit intramuscular fat well. They aren't like us. Anyone who has eaten bird and paid any attention at all knows most of the subcutaneous fat is deposited at the keel, and the inner thigh. Anyone who has butchered their own bird knows they deposit fat a third place - in the inner organ cavity, where it can compress the heart and be deposited in the liver, kidneys, etc. Where fat nodules grow suifficiently large in the liver, it becomes friable (a fancy word for "crumbly"). Crumbly livers result in ruptured blood vessels, which then leak into the inner organ cavity. Inchickens, this is called FLHS Fatty Liver Hemorragic Syndrome, and contributes to sudden poultry death. By compressing the heart, they result in reduced blood flow - higher incidence of frost bite in extremities (comb, toes, etc), greater damage during processing, and more rarely, sudden heart failure - its the poultry equivalent of COPD.

Now that's not to say fat is all bad, or that you can't deliberately design a balanced feed with a higher average fat level - but you do so by cutting carbs to reduce the total mKe (metabolizable kinetic energy) to the desired target. For the typical at home poultry owner, they have no ability to adjust the mKe of their feed, so they should be concerned with adding significant amounts of fat to the diet due to the potential for netaive health consequences.

just as you would not offer yourself a "treat" of 4-6 oz of bacon each day w/o expecting health consequences over the long term, you shold not offer your birds significan amounts of dried mealworms, Boss, etc each day unless you have designed their diet around that (in which case, its part of a recipe for a complete feed, not a treat)

and that leads me to my next post, making your own feed.
 
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Quail do not like changes. I don't mix my quail up at all. No integration. I hatch regularly and keep hatch mates together from day one on. I only keep small groups 1 male per 5 or 6 females.
I have videos of my set ups here:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCMb1Uplve6sorA_vs4HLFwQ
I don't see much about your set-up from the videos on your channel, unless rabbits are with your quail. I know quail can be upset easily, and when they're frightened it can cause them to stop laying for a couple weeks. I'm not (yet) convinced that they dislike variety in their feed. I'm just not that into the idea of a commercial feed. Newbie questions, I know.

What about the concern of too much space? MyShire Farms, recommends three quail per sq. ft. That would mean my aviary of 4X9 sq feet should have 193 quail!! If I put that many quail in my aviary, it would look like a madhouse to me and yet MyShire Farms insists. Is my math off? Is he just trying to sell us chicks?? What say you??
 
For the majority of people, in the majority of situations, the anser to making feed at home is "Don't Do It". Its NOT cheaper (you can't compete on economies of scale with any large producer), its not complete (the typical at home feed mix looks only at crude protein, without consideration for amino acid profiles, fiber content, fat, mKe, and a host of needed vitamins and minerals - and frequently doesn't even get the claimed crude protein levels correct), nor do they (unlike the big mills) use a vitamin pre-mix or nutritional "balancer" to ensure minumum levels of those things. Finally, its even Less certain than buying from a reputable producer - because you don't know the nutritional values of any of your ingredients. At least when you buy a bag, there are some representations, which are tested and inspected at some rate.

Do mistakes happen? Sure they do. Is it possible that someone doing something unethical and/or illegal made a dangerous substitution? Again, sure. But those things are equally true of each and every ingredient you may buy off the shelf to make your own feed.
 
oh, and finally - one of our BYC users, @Ital is busy trying a radically different approach to feeding. Freefeeding a host (and I do mean a host) of individual ingredients of great variety in hopes that their birds will self regulate all their needs, on average. The sytem only works if you have great variety in ingredients - I think Ital is using the complete alphabet right now - 26 different offerings - and some of the ingredients aren't easily sourced unless you are in a major metro or have great delivery.

The approach - in theory - closely mimics foraging in the environment, and has some supporting studies (from the early 1900s) which suggest it could be effective. Many of us are following with great interest.

Is it a practical method? For most, no. Is it a cheaper method? Again, for most no. Will it support a modern bird at modern levels of production? That's a damned fine question, and we are hoping to find out.

Is it interesting? Oh, H yes! and it only has a chance of working because their are so many ingredients, across so many broad classifications - grains, near greans, pulses, legumes, seeds, etc.
 
and I hope @Ital doesn't mind the name drop _ I thought what they are busy doing was important enough to be worthy of mention as an alternative approach, though one most of us choose not to use for reasons identified above.

There is no "one right way". There are thousands of wrong ways. The best way is the way that works for you, in your circumstances, with your needs. But a bit of education on the subject helps you find your way much faster, and with fewer negative consequences for your birds.
 
and I hope @Ital doesn't mind the name drop _ I thought what they are busy doing was important enough to be worthy of mention as an alternative approach, though one most of us choose not to use for reasons identified above.

There is no "one right way". There are thousands of wrong ways. The best way is the way that works for you, in your circumstances, with your needs. But a bit of education on the subject helps you find your way much faster, and with fewer negative consequences for your birds.
Thanks!
 
I don't see much about your set-up from the videos on your channel, unless rabbits are with your quail. I know quail can be upset easily, and when they're frightened it can cause them to stop laying for a couple weeks. I'm not (yet) convinced that they dislike variety in their feed. I'm just not that into the idea of a commercial feed. Newbie questions, I know.

What about the concern of too much space? MyShire Farms, recommends three quail per sq. ft. That would mean my aviary of 4X9 sq feet should have 193 quail!! If I put that many quail in my aviary, it would look like a madhouse to me and yet MyShire Farms insists. Is my math off? Is he just trying to sell us chicks?? What say you??
I have hundreds of videos. Scroll through and you'll see quail set ups.
 
I don't see much about your set-up from the videos on your channel, unless rabbits are with your quail. I know quail can be upset easily, and when they're frightened it can cause them to stop laying for a couple weeks. I'm not (yet) convinced that they dislike variety in their feed. I'm just not that into the idea of a commercial feed. Newbie questions, I know.

What about the concern of too much space? MyShire Farms, recommends three quail per sq. ft. That would mean my aviary of 4X9 sq feet should have 193 quail!! If I put that many quail in my aviary, it would look like a madhouse to me and yet MyShire Farms insists. Is my math off? Is he just trying to sell us chicks?? What say you??
I said already I don't agree with how many birds he chooses to house together. Not very many people here keep quail like that.
 
Where about are you over seas?
Israel. I am usually reluctant to say so, someone inevitably makes comments. I'm a member of a group that studies the Grand Solar Minimum. When a particular friend of mine in Jerusalem, (he's Armenian, not Jewish) posts about unusual weather here, he gets disparaging comments. He wrote me and said he usually doesn't post about weather in Israel because someone always gets political, which is a shame.

The weather here is changing in interesting ways. It's especially noticeable because we have a set rainy season and a set dry season. The dry season is becoming noticeably shorter and the rainy season is much more rainy.

But I'll make an exception here, for now, and see how it goes. Otherwise, you'll just have to remember where I live, because if anyone makes disparaging, political comments, I'll be deleting this post.
 
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