Pictures of Possible APA Standard Marans Please...

[Chicks_N_Horses]

This thread is very interesting and helpful to me...

On more carefully inspecting my birds now, well, the hen that has feathered shanks...I noticed she has little white tips on her feathering on her shanks...WHAT does this mean?????? Is this OK for French Standard breeding?

 

[amazondoc]

Chef --

I found these additional comments on other pages (not the official standards page) of the French site:

"The breast is slightly spangled which reddish-brown spots…"

"the ideal thing is a breast as well as a throat which are well-marked by coppery spots but not excessively so."

"The cocks with blackish "ear-tufts" and black spoted shoulders, and so insufficiently coppery, and with totally black breast, will engender a very high proportion of completly black or with too slightly coppery hackle pullets. They must be rejected."

I hope this helps!

 

[Chef]

Quote:
Could you give me your definition of parsimonious please?


Chef

 

[amazondoc]

Quote:
I can't swear to you what the **French** meant by the term, but the definition in English in this context would usually mean something like "few" or "not many" or "scattered" or "sparse".

You started a good thread, Chef. It's important to learn as much as possible about both the French and APA standards. Folks can say "I breed to the (pick a standard here) standard" all they want -- but you can't actually DO that unless you know what the standard actually says!

 

[Chef]

Thank you.

I would have to agree with those interpretations.


Chef

 

[blackdotte]

I can't swear to you what the **French** meant by the term, but the definition in English in this context would usually mean something like "few" or "not many" or "scattered" or "sparse".


That is exactly what the French mean, and it highlights the difference in thinking. It allows for some natural variation, there should be some reddish-brown present, but not to excess.

I was advised by a US breeder that this was unacceptable to the APA because it was imprecise. An APA Standard wording to reflect this would need to give an exact number of spots ( 5 or 5-7 for example) and an exact size ( say ¼" square etc) to be acceptable. This being so that judges could measure or count the spots.

There is not hard & fast rule, it is in the eyes of the beholder, and the overall balance of the bird.
A guide I use ( just my interpretation) is that the red spotting on the breast should not exceed 10%.
David

 

[Krys109uk]

It seems odd that the French Standard written in French is not the same as the French standards written in English.

The French for the copper black male translates to "Copper Black Variety. Not yellow, not mahogany.
Black plumage with copper ornamentation, lancets of the cape & the loins (saddle hackle?) widely bordered with copper red, chest black or lightly marked with red, cuffs (?) & good black mirror.

 

[Steve_of_sandspoultry]

Quote:

 

[blackdotte]

"chest black or lightly marked with red,"
I think you will find that was the earlier version of the Standard, not the current one,
David

 

[Krys109uk]

From the current French site:
http://marans-club.club.fr/standard.htm#standard

Variété Noir-cuivré (cuivré: ni jaune, ni acajou)
Coq Plumage noir avec parure cuivrée, lancettes du camail et des reins largement bordées de rouge cuivré, poitrine noire ou légèrement tâchée de roux, brassard et miroir bien noirs.

Also...
http://marans-club.club.fr/ncui.htm#ncui

Rappelons le standard d'origine:

Le coq doit être : «…noir sauf le camail, la selle, les épaules, et les lancettes cuivrés. La poitrine légèrement émaillée de roux…».
La poule doit être noire sauf le camail qui est dit : «…aux plumes liserées de doré" et comportant des "reflets roux surtout au poitrail…» !

Rappelons le Standard actuel:

Le coq doit être : «…noir avec parure cuivrée, lancettes du camail et des reins largement bordées de rouge cuivré, poitrine noire ou légèrement tâchée de roux…»
La poule doit être «…noire sans trop de reflets ; camail cuivré et poitrine noire ou légèrement tâchée de roux…».