The American Cemani Breeders Club...open forum

[bluenkimchi]

Quote:
Most have colors, but if you do selective breeding and culling for only the blackest offspring, then when you either cross breed or just stick to the HC, you can get some very black ones. I'm going to experiment with my cemani and the Hmong pullet and let you guys know how their offspring turns out next year.

 

[blackbirds13]

Culled my M.Bean boy today. Saw no point in keeping him going and was worried if I sold him someone would use him a Cemani flock... and with worse yet with my name on him. If I'm going to do this I think I need a good rooster to start with. I definitely think the TM pair are both pullets - small bodied and small combs still, and their stance is not too upright

. If so then I will have 3 pullets that I can try to do something with.

This talk of Hmong chicken is disconcerting to me as someone who may need to purchase a rooster later on in the breeds introduction. I only outsource my Legbars to Greenfire and I think I may have to do the same if I am going to be assured that I get what I am seeking.

Some Hmong chicken don't have a straight comb and though fibro-melanistic they do carry plumage genes that are not all black. Does anyone know if they are even the same genetic strain as Cemani. This is an area I need to do research on.

 

[bluenkimchi]

Quote: Yes, most have color feathers, though selective breeding/culling, will yield a pure black bird as a result. But black isn't that important to the Hmong folks, so they have never had to bred for a jet black bird. The HC is mainly a meat/soup bird, thus color of plumage is not important trait factor they were selecting/breeding for. But,as I said, if through working and selective/culling purpose, to narrow down to a specific traits, it's all possible to get a desire bird of one's choice.

I don't know about them sharing same genetic as cemani, but they could have had some cemani blood in them at some point?

I don't know if you can do more research on them, since they don't seem to have had any professional record written about them as far as I can tell yet. But, if you do extensive research, you might be able to find some info about them in another language? Good luck if you find more info, I would like to know more as well

 

[Phage]

The inevitable has begun and people are trying to cash in and sell mixed breed and very sub par cemani eggs on ebay etc for silly money.

No details of what lines they come from, how old the eggs are etc - details that knowledgeable people parting with serious $$ need to know. One guy who to be fair has better looking birds is charging $55 to ship 6 eggs!!!!
As for the mixed breeds, one says they are BCM crosses, another does not even state what they are crossed with, or if they are actually mixed breed x mixed breed. Another has chicks with feathered legs?? Almost all the "cemanis" shown do not have good pigmentation (someones "culls"??).

This is so disappointing, especially with all the talk about not selling eggs or chicks until quality is good. Guess that does not apply to everyone, and some people just need to make a living and jump on any opportunity.

I guess until the serious breeders - who document everything, are selling their improved stock (live chicks or started birds) GFF is the only reliable source

Hopefully by then the market will not be saturated with poor quality birds and people will be disillusioned and have moved onto other things.

Sorry about the sad post.

 

[Chickengirl1304]

The inevitable has begun and people are trying to cash in and sell mixed breed and very sub par cemani eggs on ebay etc for silly money. 

No details of what lines they come from, how old the eggs are etc - details that knowledgeable  people parting with serious $$ need to know. One guy who to be fair has better looking birds is charging $55 to ship 6 eggs!!!!
As for the mixed breeds, one says they are BCM crosses, another does not even state what they are crossed with, or if they are actually mixed breed x mixed breed. Another has chicks with feathered legs?? Almost all the "cemanis" shown do not have good pigmentation (someones "culls"??). 

This is so disappointing, especially with all the talk about not selling eggs or chicks until quality is good. Guess that does not apply to everyone, and some people just need to make a living and jump on any opportunity. 

I guess until the serious breeders - who document everything, are selling their improved stock (live chicks or started birds) GFF is the only reliable source  

Hopefully by then the market will not be saturated with poor quality birds and people will be disillusioned and have moved onto other things. 

Sorry about the sad post.

This is nothing new though. People do this with all chickens, especially the ones worth more $$

 

[sharkman]

Phage, Do you have adult pics of the chick in your profile? Did you produce it?
Rob

 

[boykin2010]

The inevitable has begun and people are trying to cash in and sell mixed breed and very sub par cemani eggs on ebay etc for silly money. 

No details of what lines they come from, how old the eggs are etc - details that knowledgeable  people parting with serious $$ need to know. One guy who to be fair has better looking birds is charging $55 to ship 6 eggs!!!!
As for the mixed breeds, one says they are BCM crosses, another does not even state what they are crossed with, or if they are actually mixed breed x mixed breed. Another has chicks with feathered legs?? Almost all the "cemanis" shown do not have good pigmentation (someones "culls"??). 

This is so disappointing, especially with all the talk about not selling eggs or chicks until quality is good. Guess that does not apply to everyone, and some people just need to make a living and jump on any opportunity. 

I guess until the serious breeders - who document everything, are selling their improved stock (live chicks or started birds) GFF is the only reliable source  

Hopefully by then the market will not be saturated with poor quality birds and people will be disillusioned and have moved onto other things. 

Sorry about the sad post.

Why do you think GFF is the only reliable source? There are multiple different breeders with proper documentation and improved stock besides GFF.

 

[Phage]

I guess until the serious breeders - who document everything, are selling their improved stock (live chicks or started birds) GFF is the only reliable source  

Why do you think GFF is the only reliable source? There are multiple different breeders with proper documentation and improved stock besides GFF.

Apart from T-M who are they? I would really really like to know!!

Like I said, until serious breeders are selling their improved stock (improvement takes time/years and more than one or 2 crosses between 2 lines), and those breeders become well known as reliable it is difficult to know for certain what you may be buying. I hear complains about how people are buying birds from "reputable breeders" for good money and they are not worth keeping/breeding. Most people on this thread are relatively new to cemanis and are still improving their stock before they are good enough to sell - or at least that is what they SAY they intend to do. I am not sure how long you have been breeding them. At least with Greenfire AT THIS TIME you know what you are getting. They are not perfect but not horrible either.
Also GFF are VERY careful to be sure the customer is happy with what they have bought. So far I have not heard a single complaint about a GFF cemani.

 

[Phage]

Phage, Do you have adult pics of the chick in your profile? Did you produce it?
Rob

Rob - these came from purchased eggs. They are cemani mix (high percentage) from the pre GFF cemani era.
I gave them to a friend who needed them for a *special* project. They are mature now and the 2 naked necks are both cockerels, and the chick on the left a pullet.
I am not a naked neck fan, but it does show off the nice dark skin. Will see if I can get pictures of them now.

 

[Chickenwingo]

Now they are cool looking I have to say, I am not into the bare neck thing or cross breeding in any way and for sure do not support it , I have to say they are very interesting looking and have very nice plumage color. Hats off to you for the first bare necked crossed cemanis they are cool looking, Funky.