- Thread starter
- #5,471
The Heritage Rhode Island Red Site
- Thread starter Robert Blosl
- Start date
PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE Don't any of you think I am being sarcastic. I'm being for real. When I posted these pictures, I put a little caption with each one saying what I liked. One thing I can say for sure is this. THESE RIR's change so much from one month to the next and the one that we think isn't worth two cents today might turn out to look better then any of the others in another month or two. Just the same can happen with one that looks good can stop developing and not be as nice as we think. Believe me, I don't get upset when folks say something that they think or see in these birds, we all have opinions and as Walt said, we are to close to our birds sometimes and don't see what others do.
I can honestly say that I've never had one group of birds where 90% of the cockerels have such terrible looking necks all at one time. It's like they lost all their hackle feathers and the new ones are taking forever to grow back in. No, they aren't lacking anything and they are out from early morning until they go in on their own at night. I've never seen them picking at each other to pull them out so I don't know what it is. None of the pullets are like that, just the cockerels. I'm not worrying about it, they don't go to a show till next week so I think they will be fine by then lol Had tho throw a little funny in there.
This bird was leaning forward, What I liked about him was that he had a nice front end on him right now. As for his back, believe me when I start looking for the back I imagine a level on them. I will never have a cockerel/cock bird that had a bump as big as a pea on his back if I'm planning on keeping him for a breeder. If they are roached from neck to oil gland at all, I will not keep them. Tail set on some of these reds is a project right now that a lot of us have to work on with both the male and female. Some of the thing in these birds have been overlooked for a while and it seems that MOST of the guys that are really trying to improve the breed are working on the things that have been overlooked and I honestly think that tail set in male and female, lacing in tales on females, length and straightness of back, cushion and width of tails on females, things like this I think will be improved upon in the next few years. We all have a lot of work to do to either keep or improve upon some of the things that some have left go for a few years. Gosh, I've had some of the top breeders tell me when I got birds from them that I would have to watch a certain thing or demon would pop up. lol We have to watch each hatch. We will never be able to say WOW, I finally fixed that and then forget about it. We can mess up an awful lot of birds with just one wrong breeding if we aren't careful. Just my two cents worth. Read this, read it again then tell me all my wrong points.
Thanks
Jim
Pick on me or my birds all you want BUT don't say to much against the breed. I love them. lol They don't mess up themselves, WE DO IT.
I can honestly say that I've never had one group of birds where 90% of the cockerels have such terrible looking necks all at one time. It's like they lost all their hackle feathers and the new ones are taking forever to grow back in. No, they aren't lacking anything and they are out from early morning until they go in on their own at night. I've never seen them picking at each other to pull them out so I don't know what it is. None of the pullets are like that, just the cockerels. I'm not worrying about it, they don't go to a show till next week so I think they will be fine by then lol Had tho throw a little funny in there.
This bird was leaning forward, What I liked about him was that he had a nice front end on him right now. As for his back, believe me when I start looking for the back I imagine a level on them. I will never have a cockerel/cock bird that had a bump as big as a pea on his back if I'm planning on keeping him for a breeder. If they are roached from neck to oil gland at all, I will not keep them. Tail set on some of these reds is a project right now that a lot of us have to work on with both the male and female. Some of the thing in these birds have been overlooked for a while and it seems that MOST of the guys that are really trying to improve the breed are working on the things that have been overlooked and I honestly think that tail set in male and female, lacing in tales on females, length and straightness of back, cushion and width of tails on females, things like this I think will be improved upon in the next few years. We all have a lot of work to do to either keep or improve upon some of the things that some have left go for a few years. Gosh, I've had some of the top breeders tell me when I got birds from them that I would have to watch a certain thing or demon would pop up. lol We have to watch each hatch. We will never be able to say WOW, I finally fixed that and then forget about it. We can mess up an awful lot of birds with just one wrong breeding if we aren't careful. Just my two cents worth. Read this, read it again then tell me all my wrong points.
Thanks
Jim
Pick on me or my birds all you want BUT don't say to much against the breed. I love them. lol They don't mess up themselves, WE DO IT.
There's nothing wrong with that male, it's too soon to tell anything and I can't tell tail angles in a young bird.
W
W
- Thread starter
- #5,474
I would love to have all of them. They are still to young and going through their final finish but they are going to look great at 8 months of age. I think to many people pick poor young birds apart over little issues which have nothing to do to the over all worth of the bird or the strain. If you can get a dark even colored real good typed bird with a nice even width of back you got a good strain. Its very hard to pick young birds and how they will look at maturity that is why it is best to just let them mature and grow up and then make your picks.
Great job of rearing them. Jimmy Love to see some pictures of your Rose Comb pullets that may be related to that great male you posted a few weeks ago. They should be right on the money at this time.
Hope I did not put a monkey wrench in the post I made on the questions.? I was wondering if you thought this nice male had the right stuff I was asking about. The others should grow up and be great males as well. bob
Great job of rearing them. Jimmy Love to see some pictures of your Rose Comb pullets that may be related to that great male you posted a few weeks ago. They should be right on the money at this time.
Hope I did not put a monkey wrench in the post I made on the questions.? I was wondering if you thought this nice male had the right stuff I was asking about. The others should grow up and be great males as well. bob
Bob that hen you have as your avatar now (and the Black and white Rooster in your pics too)...I see the brick and the flat topline, surrounded by what looks like sweeping curves to me...I like that look
- Thread starter
- #5,476
Got a wonderful personnel message this am from a beginner asking this question: If we met you at a breeders home and you picked me out two pair of S C Rhode Island Red Large Fowl what kind of care package of information and instructions would you give me for this year, next year and the next which would be a fool proof no nonsense system and or failure proof. Using the KISS formula you talk about. So I am going to put together a step by step program for him and one other Person as they will be partners in this project. We are heading to Pennsylvania to Jimmy's place and to Steve's home in Georgia to get the birds.
Also, when you compare pictures of a old standard to todays birds there is a difference in the type of the bird. You should use no older than the black and white picture that Schilling used in the 1950s that is the one I use and like.
No color is going to be looked at in this three year program. So you folks who want to get on a cliff and worry about color go right a head. You are wasting energy for nothing its TYPE and LETS build the Barn thinking on this program. I hope it will get you guys from self distrusting your
Can you see the brick shape of this cut below?
It helps to pick a strain with even width of BACK if not it will take you 6 years
to select birds to get to this level. That's to much time and money wasted so
start out first with a even width of strain large fowl gene pool. Jimmy and Steve have
these kind of strains.
selves as all beginners seem to do when they get started with Rhode Island Reds. It seems even the other people who converting from barnyard feed store chickens are doing the same thing. More interested in baby chick color feathers than waiting for the poor birds to mature and then they got still a new H breed with maybe good color but poor type. Stay tuned.
These are all the pictures you need to look at and compare your Reds with. These are Cuts that Schilling did before he died for the APA Standard of Perfection I hope we can be blessed to use them for Educational Purposes only by the APA. The other is a male with a nice wide even back to look at as you need and the other is a shape pictures that was used by the APA judges when testing new judges years ago .l hope this may even help you as you read this post today. Save these pictures in your computer and then this is what you need if you follow my lesion for this fellow. He will not fail.
This is Fantasy teaching we are not going to Jimmy's or Steve's home. But if I did this is what we would do.
More to come tomorrow.
Also, when you compare pictures of a old standard to todays birds there is a difference in the type of the bird. You should use no older than the black and white picture that Schilling used in the 1950s that is the one I use and like.
No color is going to be looked at in this three year program. So you folks who want to get on a cliff and worry about color go right a head. You are wasting energy for nothing its TYPE and LETS build the Barn thinking on this program. I hope it will get you guys from self distrusting your
Can you see the brick shape of this cut below?
It helps to pick a strain with even width of BACK if not it will take you 6 years
to select birds to get to this level. That's to much time and money wasted so
start out first with a even width of strain large fowl gene pool. Jimmy and Steve have
these kind of strains.
selves as all beginners seem to do when they get started with Rhode Island Reds. It seems even the other people who converting from barnyard feed store chickens are doing the same thing. More interested in baby chick color feathers than waiting for the poor birds to mature and then they got still a new H breed with maybe good color but poor type. Stay tuned.
These are all the pictures you need to look at and compare your Reds with. These are Cuts that Schilling did before he died for the APA Standard of Perfection I hope we can be blessed to use them for Educational Purposes only by the APA. The other is a male with a nice wide even back to look at as you need and the other is a shape pictures that was used by the APA judges when testing new judges years ago .l hope this may even help you as you read this post today. Save these pictures in your computer and then this is what you need if you follow my lesion for this fellow. He will not fail.
This is Fantasy teaching we are not going to Jimmy's or Steve's home. But if I did this is what we would do.
More to come tomorrow.
Last edited:
Got a wonderful personnel message this am from a beginner asking this question: If we met you at a breeders home and you picked me out two pair of S C Rhode Island Red Large Fowl what kind of care package of information and instructions would you give me for this year, next year and the next which would be a fool proof no nonsense system and or failure proof. Using the KISS formula you talk about. So I am going to put together a step by step program for him and one other Person as they will be partners in this project. We are heading to Pennsylvania to Jimmy's place and to Steve's home in Georgia to get the birds.
Also, when you compare pictures of a old standard to todays birds there is a difference in the type of the bird. You should use no older than the black and white picture that Schilling used in the 1950s that is the one I use and like.
No color is going to be looked at in this three year program. So you folks who want to get on a cliff and worry about color go right a head. You are wasting energy for nothing its TYPE and LETS build the Barn thinking on this program. I hope it will get you guys from self distrusting your
Can you see the brick shape of this cut below?
It helps to pick a strain with even width of BACK if not it will take you 6 years
to select birds to get to this level. That's to much time and money wasted so
start out first with a even width of strain large fowl gene pool. Jimmy and Steve have
these kind of strains.
selves as all beginners seem to do when they get started with Rhode Island Reds. It seems even the other people who converting from barnyard feed store chickens are doing the same thing. More interested in baby chick color feathers than waiting for the poor birds to mature and then they got still a new H breed with maybe good color but poor type. Stay tuned.
These are all the pictures you need to look at and compare your Reds with. These are Cuts that Schilling did before he died for the APA Standard of Perfection I hope we can be blessed to use them for Educational Purposes only by the APA. The other is a male with a nice wide even back to look at as you need and the other is a shape pictures that was used by the APA judges when testing new judges years ago .l hope this may even help you as you read this post today. Save these pictures in your computer and then this is what you need if you follow my lesion for this fellow. He will not fail.
This is Fantasy teaching we are not going to Jimmy's or Steve's home. But if I did this is what we would do.
More to come tomorrow.
You are one good fantasy teacher. You really had me wondering what was going on. lol Hey Bob, that is okay. I like living in a fantasy world sometimes. No problems in there.
Jimmy
- Thread starter
- #5,478
Getting started with Reds
This is a fantasy method of getting strated but I could go with you to so many good breeders homes and find older birds that they do not need anymore and these make the best breeders and many times such minor faults such as combs or tail angles or color in legs or wings is a minor issue but if you find a mate to compensate these faults you can get some very good breeders to start with.
In this series we will go in steps as get the birds, get them in their new homes get them ready to lay eggs for the early spring and then hatching, brooding and rearing then culling for next year. Very simple system and we are only looking for breed type in our first one to two years. Color will follow on a good stain for possibly up to three to four years and then you will have a good idea what color should be looked for in culling and hopefully you will still be in the hobby to learn this skill. Most people disobey the basic laws of getting started and are out in three years. Hopefully, you won't be one of these here today gone tomorrow Red people.
After going to Jimmy's home he had some extra birds to sell for breeders. We found one nice hen that molted back even in color and produced many nice males for this year. Also a pullet with a seven point comb with brick long oblong type. We found a male with a five point comb and just all around great brick shape but maybe just a little short in body for him but his sire was dead on with a 27 inch length of body. The hen will be mated with a male that I posted that was about four or five months old and happy to have this guy as Jimmy has about two more just like him.
Now we put the pairs in pens that are 5x5 feet and have a 5x10 foot wire run for the breeding season. Above the roost area we have a clamp light with a 75 watt bulb in each pen hooked in tandem and hooked up to a wall mart timer which comes on at 5 pm and goes off at 9 pm so each pair gets 15 hours of light which is day light and artificial. This is turned on around Thanksgiving. We have a nice nest in each pen for each female. We have a good 20 % game bird breeder feed we bought locally. We will also buy us a pint of Cod liver Oil, Wheat Germ Oil and put every other day a two oz cup of fresh scratch with these items soaked into this feed. We then give the pair this two oz treat to help fertility. We do this all through the breeding season. Also, we give them fresh grass clippings, clover leaves or Alfalfa leaves during the year as a treat if we can get it. Fresh water daily and a nice four inch litter of straw or shavings for the breeders to walk on. What we do now is hope we start getting eggs out around Christmas and get ready to set them in the incubator.
If we went to Steve's house we could find two males and two females which would be great breeders as well.
Remember its not what you see in the breeders that you are breeding for in the long run but their parents, grand parents and great grand parents with in the germ plasma of these two pair of breeders. If they are all from the same strain they are all pulling for you. We are only getting Reds from one good line such as Nelson or the Old Reese Mohawk line in this study. This could also be done with Underwood or Flanagan line form Texas . In my fantasy two pair they are pure E W Reese line or my old line. Just don't get mixed lines or forget everything I am trying to help you with.
Tomorrow we will talk about incubation, hatching and brooding.
This is a fantasy method of getting strated but I could go with you to so many good breeders homes and find older birds that they do not need anymore and these make the best breeders and many times such minor faults such as combs or tail angles or color in legs or wings is a minor issue but if you find a mate to compensate these faults you can get some very good breeders to start with.
In this series we will go in steps as get the birds, get them in their new homes get them ready to lay eggs for the early spring and then hatching, brooding and rearing then culling for next year. Very simple system and we are only looking for breed type in our first one to two years. Color will follow on a good stain for possibly up to three to four years and then you will have a good idea what color should be looked for in culling and hopefully you will still be in the hobby to learn this skill. Most people disobey the basic laws of getting started and are out in three years. Hopefully, you won't be one of these here today gone tomorrow Red people.
After going to Jimmy's home he had some extra birds to sell for breeders. We found one nice hen that molted back even in color and produced many nice males for this year. Also a pullet with a seven point comb with brick long oblong type. We found a male with a five point comb and just all around great brick shape but maybe just a little short in body for him but his sire was dead on with a 27 inch length of body. The hen will be mated with a male that I posted that was about four or five months old and happy to have this guy as Jimmy has about two more just like him.
Now we put the pairs in pens that are 5x5 feet and have a 5x10 foot wire run for the breeding season. Above the roost area we have a clamp light with a 75 watt bulb in each pen hooked in tandem and hooked up to a wall mart timer which comes on at 5 pm and goes off at 9 pm so each pair gets 15 hours of light which is day light and artificial. This is turned on around Thanksgiving. We have a nice nest in each pen for each female. We have a good 20 % game bird breeder feed we bought locally. We will also buy us a pint of Cod liver Oil, Wheat Germ Oil and put every other day a two oz cup of fresh scratch with these items soaked into this feed. We then give the pair this two oz treat to help fertility. We do this all through the breeding season. Also, we give them fresh grass clippings, clover leaves or Alfalfa leaves during the year as a treat if we can get it. Fresh water daily and a nice four inch litter of straw or shavings for the breeders to walk on. What we do now is hope we start getting eggs out around Christmas and get ready to set them in the incubator.
If we went to Steve's house we could find two males and two females which would be great breeders as well.
Remember its not what you see in the breeders that you are breeding for in the long run but their parents, grand parents and great grand parents with in the germ plasma of these two pair of breeders. If they are all from the same strain they are all pulling for you. We are only getting Reds from one good line such as Nelson or the Old Reese Mohawk line in this study. This could also be done with Underwood or Flanagan line form Texas . In my fantasy two pair they are pure E W Reese line or my old line. Just don't get mixed lines or forget everything I am trying to help you with.
Tomorrow we will talk about incubation, hatching and brooding.
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Hey Bob, you need to change your time to 5 AM I think. lol I'm going out and count my chickens. I didn't know anyone was here and got any. You better be glad that I consider you a friend or I'd copy this message and give it to the law. ha,ha,ha. Gee, if the value of them were on here it would be even better. Make it high.
I'm still looking for all these fantasy birds. Oh my, this is kind of interesting reading. Did you get any sleep last night?
This is great Bob... thanks...
I have gone ahead and banded my birds and decided to make "pretend decisions" based on what I have learned from this thread over the last year.
When Steve comes to visit, I will not reveal my choices until he makes his evaluations... that will help me determine if I've really learned anything.
Should be an interesting comparison...
I have gone ahead and banded my birds and decided to make "pretend decisions" based on what I have learned from this thread over the last year.
When Steve comes to visit, I will not reveal my choices until he makes his evaluations... that will help me determine if I've really learned anything.
Should be an interesting comparison...
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