17 hours after internal pip and no sign of external pip

[Firsttimeduckmumma]

I have silver bantam ducks on lockdown now, they started rocking at 21 days so after asking on here I locked down 22 days ..theve been on lock down for 3 days and have internally pipped yesterday around 9 pm (probally a bit before)... it is now 17 hours and no sign of external pip although I can hear faint tapping so they are trying!
I'm thinking I need to use a safety hole as time is getting on .... there is not much information out there on silver bantam ducks so I'm figuring they will be the same as call ducks and probably need help with hatching?
I'm keeping all my fingers and toes crossed that someone out there is awake to advice me here in England pleasseeee

 

[ChickenCanoe]

Personally, I wouldn't screw with them.
If they are in lockdown, how do you know they internally pipped?

 

[Firsttimeduckmumma]

Rightly or wrongly I obviously looked via candle method!
All babies are still alive, we are 24 hours now since internal pip, and still no external pipping , we have done the emergency breathing hole and I feel a lot happier now I know they wont run out of air although it's still very stressful
I'm following the thread on here about assisted hatching and feel confident in the way it's been explained along with pictures (really does help)
Hopefully they will pip and zip on their own in the next 24- 36 hours but ready to do all I can to help out when and if needed.
I know some will not agree with assisted hatching but I want to do everything I can to help these babies out
And as said above theres not a lot (intfact nothing regarding silver bantam ducks) so I am assuming they will find it as hard to get out of their shells as call ducks which are notorious for being difficult to hatch.

 

[Firsttimeduckmumma]

Apologies I didnt mention above about lack of information on silver bantom ducks
I've lost the plot and was on a previous thread

 

[LynnaePB]

Good luck with your little ones! The assisted hatching guide for all poultry is my go to as well and has been super helpful. I'm not experienced with bantam ducks but I would think you made a good choice adding the safety holes. I've gone ahead and used them plenty of times now. They really don't hurt anything and they have saved lots of shipped egg babies of mine that got into awkward positions (like feet over head) that prevented them from being able to externally pip properly.

Hands on isn't for everyone but it's been great for me and I wouldn't do it any other way.

 

[Firsttimeduckmumma]

Thank you, your comment has made me feel better about assisting with the safety hole , I have a feeling these little ones are going to need more in the coming hours but praying they make it out by themselves. These were also shipped and was worried at first with a couple of saddled air cells but theve corrected themselves also All beaks are in the air cells so thank god I dont have to deal with feet over head like you have ( I dont think I would be confident enough with that)
Just a quick question .... would you now leave them for 24 or 36 hours before helping with the next stage , I dont want the membrane to dry out too much but at the same time dont want to assist too early ?

 

[MGG]

Don't do anything else. I wouldn't have done a safety hole. It makes the ducklings get passive, as the gas doesn't build up and force them to externally pip. Then they just give up and die. All of the eggs I've ever put a "safety" hole in, died. You need to let them do it on their own. I do believe assists are often necessary, and good to do if the bird 100% needs help and you know what you're doing. But you need to wait at least 24 hours before doing a safety hole, and 30 hours with no progress after external pip. Make sure your humidity is 75% or so, they'll dry out fast now that you opened their shells.

 

[LynnaePB]

Thank you, your comment has made me feel better about assisting with the safety hole , I have a feeling these little ones are going to need more in the coming hours but praying they make it out by themselves. These were also shipped and was worried at first with a couple of saddled air cells but theve corrected themselves also All beaks are in the air cells so thank god I dont have to deal with feet over head like you have ( I dont think I would be confident enough with that)
Just a quick question .... would you now leave them for 24 or 36 hours before helping with the next stage , I dont want the membrane to dry out too much but at the same time dont want to assist too early ?

Yeah I'd wait at least 24 hours. I've heard ducks can be really slow (not uncommon for them to go over 40 hours from external pip to hatching I've heard). Can you see the beak through the safety hole at all? I know with such a small hole it can be hard to see much but sometimes I can make out the beaks through the hole. If you can that will be a big help since you can watch for the nibbling/yawning motion that is indicative of the babies still working on absorbing yolk and/or blood vessels.

If it's been long enough and you can't see the beak you can widen that safety hole just enough to where you can get a better look. You don't want to do this too soon as if the safety hole is too large the chance of shrink wrap goes up. Of course you can also make a larger viewing window but you'll have to worry more about keeping the membrane moist in this case. The benefit is you can get a better view of the blood vessels though.

My chicks often let me know when they are ready. Even when they can't reach the shell or turn to zip they'll repeatedly strike upwards/outwards with their beaks just like they would when zipping when they are ready to come out. They shouldn't be yawning/chewing at this point and the blood vessels will have receded. Sometimes they will cheap more loudly/frequently along with the striking out.

I'm glad your little guys were able to internally pip with no issues. It should make any assisting needed much easier and safer! I hope they make it out on their own for you, I know how nerve wracking assisting can be when you aren't used to it.

 

[ChickenCanoe]

Rightly or wrongly I obviously looked via candle method!
All babies are still alive, we are 24 hours now since internal pip, and still no external pipping , we have done the emergency breathing hole and I feel a lot happier now I know they wont run out of air although it's still very stressful
I'm following the thread on here about assisted hatching and feel confident in the way it's been explained along with pictures (really does help)
Hopefully they will pip and zip on their own in the next 24- 36 hours but ready to do all I can to help out when and if needed.
I know some will not agree with assisted hatching but I want to do everything I can to help these babies out
And as said above theres not a lot (intfact nothing regarding silver bantam ducks) so I am assuming they will find it as hard to get out of their shells as call ducks which are notorious for being difficult to hatch.

Regardless of species or breed, ducks are ducks, chickens are chickens, robins are robins, emus are emus. They should and MUST hatch on their own.
Why do all the other 10,000 species of birds hatch without human intervention?
Because they have vigor. Not all things are meant to live to adult hood or even survive birth/hatch.
I understand wanting to save everything but not everything is salvagable
Without huge staffs and millions of dollars of equipment, many more babies would die in hospitals.
You don't have millions of dollars of equipment and it is best to let nature take its course.
If you want more to hatch, improve their vigor.

 

[ChickenCanoe]

By constantly handling the eggs, you are making matters worse. The hen sits tight on the nest to retain humidity. Candling and keeping the hen off the nest is drying out the membranes.

Lockdown means you don't mess with them whether they are under a mom or in an incubator.