Blue x Black or Blue x Blue?

[rodriguezpoultry]

I've heard several different theories on the blue x black matings and blue x blue matings.

I've heard that blue x black will better the dark blue coloration, but it will somehow weaken the black. I've noticed the black x blue breedings give me much better and darker coloration on the blues. I'm not too sure on the blacks yet, but figured since one theory was correct, the other might be as well.

Has anyone else noticed their black x blue breedings coming up with better coloration of the blues, but with poorer specimens of the black coloration?

 

[pinkchick]

I have not noticed anything different with the blacks of a black x blue cross......what I have noticed is VERY NICE lacing and blue in the blues.

 

[Chris09]

This is what I found in a Old English Game Bantam book called:
Old English Game Bantams as Bred and Shown in the United States
By F.P. Jeffrey and William Richardsom
(Note Blue-Blacks are a Black colored bird out of a Blue on Blue mating)

Branson (1991):
I mate Splash Male over Blue-Black Female to the best Blues. I mate
Blue-Black male over Splash females to get my best Blue males. I mate
Blue over Blue and get 50% Blue, 25% Splash, and 25% Blue-Black.
I also mate Blue-Black over light blue and get 50% Blue and 50% Blue Black. The reason I use Blue-Black is because most Black Old English throw Brassy Backs and gives red in the hackle and saddle of the Blue Old English.

Bensinger (1995):
In the following article are some of my experiences with the breeding of Blue Old English Game Bantams. First let me say you should start with good quality birds.
Black on Splash:
All the chicks that hatch will be of a Blue color. Some
Will come a light ( pigeon) Blue with pore lacing and some will come with the desired lacing. However, I have found that the desired lacing does not come from this type of mating.
Blue on Blue:
From this mating you will get Blues, some of the desired lacing, and some that are too dark in the lacing and base color. A lot of these birds with the dark coloring will also have some Black feathering or Black ticking.
You will also find in some the male birds will usually have a serious fault in there hackle and saddle. They will almost always have a brown cast or rusty color. This a fault when showing. However, I have found that these can be bred to Blue females of good Blue color which will not be inherited by the offspring. I feel that the best colored males come from this mating, although they are usually a little on the dark base color side. You will also get Splash from this mating. These should be kept for mating as I will discuss later. You will also get Blue-Blacks which are completely Black.
From personal experience I feel the most correctly colored Blue females come from the Blue on Blue mating.
Splash on Blue:
This mating is my second chance for getting good color Blue males and females. In my selection of Blue male or female, I like to use birds that are of darker Blue color. The Splash in this mating should be used from a Blue on Blue mating.
You will get the following colors from this mating; Blue, some light and some with the desired blue color; Splash, from this mating they usually are correct color.
Blue-Black on Blue:
I personally feel that my best colored Blues do not come from this mating. However, I know a few breeders that use this mating for raising Blues who are very successful.
Black on Blue:
I tried this mating only once as I feel the resulting Blues were much too dark, and there were too many Blue-Blacks…….


Chris

 

[pinkchick]

Chris~

Great info! Thanks for sharing it! Off to switch out some birds and experiment! I love the blue gene.....sooooooo many possibilities.

 

[pips&peeps]

My personal experience is that I prefer the black to blue matings. I have found no problems with my black birds from this.

When breeding blue to blue, there were so many different color of blues it made my head spin. And, I like the darker blues because they can carry more black pigment to edge the feathers.

The SOP for all blue birds says:

each feather laced with black

There are very few birds in my opinion, that can by definition have lacing in the US (the Pg gene). This would be the wyandotte, UK type orpingtons and for some reason andalusians (because I don't think they carry the Pg gene).

So, I am working on a project this summer with my blue birds....

I will be breeding to a bird I have acquired that has the Pg gene and will see what my results are after two generations since it is recessive. If this works out for me, I hope to end up with a nice blue line with good lacing.​

 

[cochin44]

Chris,
Thanks for the article. That's all I breed is blacks and blues and this is very interesting.

 

[turbo]

I think some breeders feel like you will loose the green sheen when using a blue on your black or black on your blue, I have not found this to be true...leg color does effect the black....but I breed blue to blue...then every few years throw a black on the blues to darken the blue up. So the short answer is in Wyandottes the blue does not effect your black...at least for me. I have heard that Silkie breeders have problems with good black color when using blues on their blacks...

Jerry

 

[lildinkem]

pips&peeps :

My personal experience is that I prefer the black to blue matings. I have found no problems with my black birds from this.

When breeding blue to blue, there were so many different color of blues it made my head spin. And, I like the darker blues because they can carry more black pigment to edge the feathers.

The SOP for all blue birds says:

each feather laced with black

There are very few birds in my opinion, that can by definition have lacing in the US (the Pg gene). This would be the wyandotte, UK type orpingtons and for some reason andalusians (because I don't think they carry the Pg gene).

So, I am working on a project this summer with my blue birds....

I will be breeding to a bird I have acquired that has the Pg gene and will see what my results are after two generations since it is recessive. If this works out for me, I hope to end up with a nice blue line with good lacing.​

This was a Blue to Blue breeding
I was thinking this girl was a bit too dark a blue. But IF you like it Jean, I like it. IF you can believe it, she is actually even darker in person. lololol

 

[rodriguezpoultry]

The females bred from the blue x black breeding are still to light for my taste, but the black x blue breeding males are beautiful. The blue x blue came out with brown. It actually looks like a dark chocolate color, but I know it's just from the sun. Odd how bleaching makes even a good bird come out awful. If all the birds had the color, I'd probably not have an issue, but as he is the only one showing ANY sunburning...he is dinner. His 1/2 brother though...gorgeous! I can't wait to get photos to show the difference, although I am certain there is the matter of chance in the whole ordeal too.

 

[lildinkem]

Quote:
I am mostly doing Black with Blue for my Orps. I have one pen with the Blue cock, another has my best Black male with one of Julie's and one other breeders Blues, and my third pen has a Blue splash with my BUS who is in actually a 1/2 Buff and 1/2 Black male that has total Orp type and too nice not to try to make a Black and Blue with Akers blood in them. I too can not hatch enough and grow them up fast enough. Pics will be coming. It will be fun.