Crested cream legbar,egg color question

[chickenfarmergal]

So I know that both blue and green eggs are acceptable egg colors in CCLs. However I was wondering if you bred a Roo from lines that are blue to a hen that has light green I suspect you have a 50/50 chance of getting either blue or green but if you took one of those chicks that are laying blue and bred it back to a blue would it breed the green out?
Also another question why is it so many people think if it's not blue then it's not a pure Crested Cream Legbar? I would love to learn more about this breed. And the different lines that have created the blue or green eggs

 

[chickenfarmergal]

Anyone?

 

[DarJones]

The genetics are fairly simple. Blue egg on chromosome 1, white egg trait, and brown egg trait. There are at least 3 variants that produce white eggs. Combine white egg with the blue egg gene, you get blue eggs. White plus Blue plus Brown = tinted eggs with either dark or light brown tinting depending on dosing effects.

In your example, a tinted egg layer is mated to a blue egg layer then the offspring mated back to a blue egg layer. Half the chicks would lay blue eggs and half tinted.... at least in theory. What I've seen so far is that there are multiple genes that result in white eggs therefore there are varying levels of blue, white, brown, and tinted blue. I suspect but can't yet prove that this would skew the ratio a bit in favor of blue with brown tint.

Short answer, hatch a bunch of chicks and you will recover blue egg layers, probably between 40 and 50 percent of female chicks hatched.

 

[chickenfarmergal]

Thanks for the response. I've got both blue and pale blue with hint of green and pale green CCLs. I was trying to breed more blue back into them so I was going to do some experimenting. I also was wondering if I kept the hens that laid the bluest and bred back to a Roo carrying the blue would that enhance the blue. My thinking is yes but my biology classes were a LONG time ago...lol

 

[WVBirdsAndBees]

Yes, try to breed the best blue layers to roos that seems to pass on blue laying genes. I'm not a genetics expert but the breed is generally supposed to lay blue, so you're on the right track by reinforcing that in your breeding program.

Since it's a newer breed in the US, there's a lot to work on so you have to kind of choose. However, the things the breed was developed and is known for are being sexable at hatch, laying blue eggs, and having the crest. All cream legbars should check those boxes. If they don't, serious breeders would say avoid using them for breeding stock. After that, I look at disposition and give preference to those who show more cream coloring than the darker gold. Then comes body, feathers/pattern, etc.

There are obviously more standards. You can find the full proposed standard online, think there is a club website. They are wonderful birds, our favorites. There is a CL breeding to the standard thread here that is helpful as well if you have more questions.

 

[chickenfarmergal]

Thanks so much I did find that thread last night as well as some Google search leading me to the CCL club,etc.
I have nice crests, also have good combs except on one who's comb is smaller. Some of them are laying some really pretty blue,some lighter blue,another is a blue-ish green and at least one is laying a pale green. I'd like to enhance the blue, for sure. They're young so I know I'll see a little change in egg size so I would also like to pick the hens that lay a larger egg.

 

[DarJones]

It is a common belief that breeding can enhance the blue egg trait. My experience is otherwise.

If there is one copy of the blue egg gene, the eggs will be blue but not quite as intense as eggs laid by a hen with two copies. It is my goal to breed homozygous (2 copies) blue egg laying chickens. I can visually pick out the most intensely blue eggs in a tray. When I get results back from DNA tests being performed on my chickens, I will be able to determine if visually picking darker blue eggs is a valid method to pick hens that are homozygous.

For a hen that is homozygous (2 copies) for blue egg, larger eggs tend to be lighter colored than smaller eggs. I suspect that many of the claims for breeding chickens that lay intense blue eggs is because they were selected to lay small eggs. Please note that this is related to the size of the chicken. A large hen that lays a small egg and is homozygous for blue egg tends to lay eggs that are visibly more intense blue.

Young hens tend to lay both smaller eggs and more intensely blue eggs. I have not attempted to determine if this is just a factor of young hens laying smaller eggs or that young hens produce more of the pigment for blue eggs.

Breeding the intense white egg trait into a breed tends to enhance the blue egg trait. Leghorns and several other mediterranean breeds carry the intense white egg trait. This appears to be a case where the intense white egg color enhances the blue.

If doing selection for blue eggs, I would weigh the eggs into groups of 40 to 45 grams, 45 to 50 grams, and 50 plus grams. Then put them into egg trays in order from least to most intensely blue. I would then pick out in a ratio of 3 of 10 of the most intensely blue eggs to hatch. Using this method should permit selecting for blue eggs without selecting for small eggs. Just use your discretion whether or not to hatch the small eggs. Keep in mind that young hens usually lay small eggs increasing to large eggs after about a year of laying.

 

[WVBirdsAndBees]

No problem!

I'm in a similar boat. We have 1 who lays lighter green so we moved her to the layers coop, hoping to keep the blues as the breeders. The eggs do get bigger and I'm sure you could select for it. Ours don't ever put out the jumbo size that their leghorn cousins do. To us, they make up for that with the auto-sexing, better personalities, blue egg color, crests, etc.

The breed has a lot of work to do going forward, with relatively small imported groups making up the entire genetic base over here. But they are our favorites.

Appreciate DarJones genetics insight. I may use that exact strategy, although I'm not as concerned with egg size as I am with simply making sure the flock is homozygous for blue. I could have them tested or select for the bluest blues while watching for any greens or whites in subsequent generations. Between that and selecting for autosexing, crests, combs, etc - its easy to see why they aren't the easiest birds to breed. Well worth it to me, though.