Dry hatch lockdown humidity?

[Susan Skylark]

What is recommended humidity for coturnix lockdown after a dry hatch? I’m on day 13 of a 10 percent humidity dry hatch (yes it is ridiculous that is the point of this whole hatch) but I don’t dare leave it that low during actual hatching. Normally I’d run it at 65 percent (though it is more like 75 in my ridiculous little incubator if you add any water at all). Ideas or experience?

 

[ChickenCanoe]

You are on the right track. I would definitely go for 65-75%. If condensation forms on the window, it is too high. Otherwise, my opinion is you can't have too much humidity during pipping and hatching.
Honestly, I haven't hatched coturnix but hatching many species, I have discovered there is very little difference for most species of birds regarding temperature, turning, even humidity. Humidity is never a set number. In nature, it varies dramatically, and embryos still hatch.
Eggs vary in size and porosity, elevation and associated barometric pressure and oxygen concentration varies all over the world.
In any case, a higher humidity to prevent shrink wrapping is necessary. Setting birds accomplish this by sitting tight after pipping holding in that valuable moisture regardless of ambient humidity.
Another humidity related thing that is pretty consistent between species is weight loss. With almost all species, regardless of length of incubation, 12-14% weight loss is needed for proper hatching. That is what maintaining humidity is all about. If humidity varies throughout, it isn't critical as long as the weight loss is adequate but not too drastic. That is why people candle. But I prefer to weigh eggs when collecting, when setting and weekly. That way, the air cell is always the proper size.

 

[007Sean]

I know the purpose of your experiment but l would never run the incubator at that low % Rh. Coturnix do better with ~30% Rh durning incubation and increasing to ~50% Rh during the the last 3 to 4 days of the incubation process. Too high of a %Rh during hatching causes other problems, like 'stuck chick syndrome', curled toes, and possible drowning.

These experiments have been done before, so there is data out there if you do the research.

 

[Susan Skylark]

I know there is probably plenty of data out there with statistically significant data sets, I’m more interested in exploring the limits of my own set up and system, yes the data (or the internet or hearsay or whatever) says x, but is it really that way for a reason or just because we’ve always done it that way? I’m fascinated by life, especially embryology and genetics and want to explore every aspect. Some people like football or knitting, I’m a little more of a geek! And these little birds are amazing, day 16, 3/6 hatched, other 3 pipping. 10 percent humidity until day 14 now 75 percent (stupid cheap incubator!). I’m never going to get any of this published or make any remarkable discoveries, but personally I find it very fascinating and something I can share with my kids.

 

[ChickenCanoe]

There is a lot of data that is valid. It is really the way it is because poultry meat and eggs are a significant element of global human nutrition, have been for a couple hundred years but due to research, development of new breeds/hybrids and the need for cheaper means of feeding the exploding human population, mountains of significant scientific research have been accomplished and is ongoing.
Millions of chicks are hatched daily around the world. Some poultry producers have incubators that set tens of thousands of eggs. It is nearly impossible to comprehend the numbers of eggs and chickens required to feed 8 billion people, the majority of whom eat at least eggs if not both.
All of that volume means that the data needs to be scientifically sound. Too much money is at stake.

 

[007Sean]

I know there is probably plenty of data out there with statistically significant data sets, I’m more interested in exploring the limits of my own set up and system, yes the data (or the internet or hearsay or whatever) says x, but is it really that way for a reason or just because we’ve always done it that way?

Yes, it's that way for a reason....many people both lay and expert and scientific institutions have determined what is the best ranges to set the incubator at to achieve maximum, optimal operating parameters for incubating. It's not just some number they pulled outta the air.

I've had a few chick's hatch at way less than optimum operating ranges but that doesn't mean I should operate the incubator at those parameters, just because a few chick's hatched under those inadequate conditions.

In recent years more researchers and 'hobbyists' alike have transformed the hobbyists side of raising poultry. In the 30's and 40's it was 103°F for optimum operating temperature and 86% Rh by wet bulb measurements. Today, it's 99.5°F and depending on what species your trying to hatch, the %Rh will range from 30% to 50%.
Also depending on a particular species and the location of the incubator, (region, coastal, mountain, plains) those conditions will have to be adjusted to 'fit' that particular location, in the past it was a stead fast parameter for all locations, no research had been done by hobbyists, and even today you will on occasion see people here (newbies) asking for help because they were using the old data to set their incubators at....so to bring a long answer to the point, yes, there is a reason the current day parameters are what most everyone considers to be the optimum operating procedures for hatching poultry.

 

[Susan Skylark]

Huge difference between commercial poultry producers and a backyard freak like me with a dozen birds total! They are raising chicks by the thousands and I’m fiddling around with half a dozen. They have millions of dollars at stake, I’m risking a half dozen eggs (breakfast for 1!). They have to manage precision and efficiency to the third decimal place to even function, I can ask what if and see what happens. While it is interesting to learn that turning chicken eggs 88 times daily increases hatch rates by 1.3 percent, it really isn’t helpful to my situation whereas 1.3 percent over a million eggs makes a huge difference. On the other hand, I’ve discovered that yes you can successfully hatch quail eggs at either ten or eighty percent humidity and that I really really like the dry hatch method, which is very practical for me, as now I can hatch eggs in my ridiculous little bubble incubator and not have to mess with humidity several times a day. Not useful to poultry producers in general, but personally it is very helpful as it might also be to all those neophyte incubators who are freaking out because their humidity isn’t perfect. It is one thing to say ‘the literature says X’ and quite another to say, it is very possible to encounter y and still have a successful hatch. Sort of like those warning labels plastered all over the infant car seat and everywhere else that gets new parents so freaked out they are amazed anybody ever survives infancy. As a neophyte incubator I was always wondering how I was going to screw it up, this hatch (6 or 7th?) was a breeze, everybody hatched quick and unassisted and the chicks are up and around and vigorous quick, quick, quick. It may be partially due to the dry hatch but I’m guessing mostly it is me getting comfortable with the whole process, again not helpful to ‘big poultry’ but certainly helpful for me! I want to know what works and what doesn’t and what is best for the birds in our little flock and us as their caretakers.