Egg bound hen refusing to lay eggs?

[heahab]

One of my Rhode Island Red chickens has been egg bound for at least 5 days now. I have tried soaking her in warm water with epsom salt, lubricated the outside and inside of her vent with coconut oil, massaged her abdomen for hours at a time, given her calcium supplements (300 mg per day) as well as calcium in other forms, even given her feed made for relaxation! When feeling her abdomen and vent areas I can feel about 2-3 maybe more eggs. I have been doing a mix of these treatments for the last 5 days to no eggs being laid. I have been able to massage an egg right to her vent, but it is almost like she is not wanting to lay the egg and is not letting it come out. She is pooping but her poop is very watery and runny. I'm not sure what else I can try to get her to lay eggs so advice/ tips would be greatly appreciated.

 

[nuthatched]

Are you sure you're feeling eggs?
Egg binding kills much quicker than 5 days.
What's "feed for relaxation"?
How's she acting? Because a bird in that state would be at deaths door.
If she was egg bound, she couldn't poop at all.

 

[LaFleche]

I have been able to massage an egg right to her vent, but it is almost like she is not wanting to lay the egg and is not letting it come out.

300 mg calcium is not enough to help expel an egg. 600 mg calcium citrate + vitamin D3 per day would be much better.

But she might have laid the eggs you are feeling internally which means that she may have no way to get them out.
Trying too hard to massage stuck eggs out can lead to ruptures of the oviduct and the eggs slipping into the abdominal cavity.

Is a vet an option for an X-ray?

And welcome to the BYC community!

 

[heahab]

Are you sure you're feeling eggs?
Egg binding kills much quicker than 5 days.
What's "feed for relaxation"?
How's she acting?

I am almost positive it is eggs. Neither of my other Rhode Island Reds have the same lumps. She has 2 of the suspected egg lumps on both sides of her a little past her wing as well as a lump right below her vent. I know that egg binding is fatal in 24-48 hours so I was shocked that she is still moving around. The feed is just a scratch with lavender that I decided to give to her because I am willing to try anything at this point lol! She is moving around a small bit but is acting still fairly lethargic- but that is not too out of the ordinary for her. She had sour crop in April of last year and never fully recovered 100% and has remained a bit lethargic.

 

[heahab]

300 mg calcium is not enough to help expel an egg. 600 mg calcium citrate + vitamin D3 per day would be much better.

But she might have laid the eggs you are feeling internally which means that she may have no way to get them out.
Trying too hard to massage stuck eggs out can lead to ruptures of the oviduct and the eggs slipping into the abdominal cavity.

Is a vet an option for an X-ray?

And welcome to the BYC community!

I will absolutely up the dosage and add D3- I am terrified of accidentally giving her too much calcium. There is what I am suspecting is an egg that is right below her vent- could that have been laid internally? I am scared of them breaking because I know it can lead to infection so I am being pretty gentle with her and massaging the eggs to encourage her laying them. Unfortunately the vet is not an option at this point.
Thank you!

 

[nuthatched]

I am almost positive it is eggs. Neither of my other Rhode Island Reds have the same lumps. She has 2 of the suspected eggs lumps on both sides of her a little past her wing as well as a lump right below her vent. I know that egg binding is fatal in 24-48 hours so I was shocked that she is still moving around. The feed is just a scratch with lavender that I decided to give to her because I am willing to try anything at this point lol! She is moving around a small bit but is acting still fairly lethargic- but that is not too out of the ordinary for her. She had sour crop in April of last year and never fully recovered 100% and has remained a bit lethargic.

If a vet is not an option, then unfortunately, you're going to have to put her down. If she's really that bad and is suffering from the issues lafleche brought up, there's no non vet solution. I'm sorry.

 

[heahab]

If a vet is not an option, then unfortunately, you're going to have to put her down. If she's really that bad and is suffering from the issues lafleche brought up, there's no non vet solution. I'm sorry.

Any idea what is happening to where she is still pooping? I am almost positive it is eggs that I am feeling. I haven't really been able to find much regarding it on the internet.

 

[nuthatched]

Any idea what is happening to where she is still pooping? I am almost positive it is eggs that I am feeling. I haven't really been able to find much regarding it on the internet.

Like LA fleche said, she could be internal laying in a cavity.

 

[Wyorp Rock]

One of my Rhode Island Red chickens has been egg bound for at least 5 days now. I have tried soaking her in warm water with epsom salt, lubricated the outside and inside of her vent with coconut oil, massaged her abdomen for hours at a time, given her calcium supplements (300 mg per day) as well as calcium in other forms, even given her feed made for relaxation! When feeling her abdomen and vent areas I can feel about 2-3 maybe more eggs. I have been doing a mix of these treatments for the last 5 days to no eggs being laid. I have been able to massage an egg right to her vent, but it is almost like she is not wanting to lay the egg and is not letting it come out.

She has 2 of the suspected egg lumps on both sides of her a little past her wing as well as a lump right below her vent.

There is what I am suspecting is an egg that is right below her vent- could that have been laid internally?

Any idea what is happening to where she is still pooping? I am almost positive it is eggs that I am feeling. I haven't really been able to find much regarding it on the internet.

She's not refusing to lay an egg, a hen is not capable of doing that.

You may be feeling eggs or lash material that has been internally laid in the abdominal cavity.
Some people are also able to locate the Gizzard and feel that under the left wing.

I would not feel inside the vent anymore and I would not attempt to massage anything out of her any more.

Please understand, if the masses/eggs/material you feel are under the vent/in the abdomen below the vet between the legs, then they are not in a position to be reached or expelled.

If she is so lethargic and unwell, not responding, seems to be in lot of pain or misery, then putting her down will be a kindness.

If you want to see what you were feeling in her abdomen, once she is gone, perform your own internal examination, open up the abdominal cavity carefully and see what's inside. Often being able to actually see helps with learning and then you'll be better equipped to know what may be happening with other hens with similar symptoms in the future.

If you look at the image below, you'll see that the Oviduct runs along the back of the hen, eggs/lash material, etc. can and does sometimes drop into the abdominal cavity since that is open, the oviduct is not "closed". Organs you may be able to feel if you are pressing around all over the body are the gizzard, spleen and possibly the liver.

The large intestine meets at the vent/cloaca, if nothing is blocking that section, she'll still be able to poop.

One of my Rhode Island Red chickens has been egg bound for at least 5 days now. I have tried soaking her in warm water with epsom salt, lubricated the outside and inside of her vent with coconut oil, massaged her abdomen for hours at a time, given her calcium supplements (300 mg per day) as well as calcium in other forms, even given her feed made for relaxation! When feeling her abdomen and vent areas I can feel about 2-3 maybe more eggs. I have been doing a mix of these treatments for the last 5 days to no eggs being laid. I have been able to massage an egg right to her vent, but it is almost like she is not wanting to lay the egg and is not letting it come out. She is pooping but her poop is very watery and runny. I'm not sure what else I can try to get her to lay eggs so advice/ tips would be greatly appreciated.

I am almost positive it is eggs. Neither of my other Rhode Island Reds have the same lumps. She has 2 of the suspected egg lumps on both sides of her a little past her wing as well as a lump right below her vent. I know that egg binding is fatal in 24-48 hours so I was shocked that she is still moving around. The feed is just a scratch with lavender that I decided to give to her because I am willing to try anything at this point lol! She is moving around a small bit but is acting still fairly lethargic- but that is not too out of the ordinary for her. She had sour crop in April of last year and never fully recovered 100% and has remained a bit lethargic.

I will absolutely up the dosage and add D3- I am terrified of accidentally giving her too much calcium. There is what I am suspecting is an egg that is right below her vent- could that have been laid internally? I am scared of them breaking because I know it can lead to infection so I am being pretty gentle with her and massaging the eggs to encourage her laying them. Unfortunately the vet is not an option at this point.
Thank you!

Any idea what is happening to where she is still pooping? I am almost positive it is eggs that I am feeling. I haven't really been able to find much regarding it on the internet.

 

[heahab]

She's not refusing to lay an egg, a hen is not capable of doing that.

You may be feeling eggs or lash material that has been internally laid in the abdominal cavity.
Some people are also able to locate the Gizzard and feel that under the left wing.

I would not feel inside the vent anymore and I would not attempt to massage anything out of her any more.

Please understand, if the masses/eggs/material you feel are under the vent/in the abdomen below the vet between the legs, then they are not in a position to be reached or expelled.

If she is so lethargic and unwell, not responding, seems to be in lot of pain or misery, then putting her down will be a kindness.

If you want to see what you were feeling in her abdomen, once she is gone, perform your own internal examination, open up the abdominal cavity carefully and see what's inside. Often being able to actually see helps with learning and then you'll be better equipped to know what may be happening with other hens with similar symptoms in the future.

If you look at the image below, you'll see that the Oviduct runs along the back of the hen, eggs/lash material, etc. can and does sometimes drop into the abdominal cavity since that is open, the oviduct is not "closed". Organs you may be able to feel if you are pressing around all over the body are the gizzard, spleen and possibly the liver.

The large intestine meets at the vent/cloaca, if nothing is blocking that section, she'll still be able to poop.
View attachment 4025002

Wonderful information- thank you. I am still fairly new to chickens and had never heard of a lash egg. She does not seem to be in a lot of pain. The only symptoms that she is showing are lack of eggs being laid as well as being more lethargic than the other hens. She is still eating and drinking normally, if not better than the other hens. The last thing I want to do is keep a hen who is suffering alive, but I don't really think she is in all that much pain. Would it be worth it to try to give her antibiotics, or is it too late for that? And if I did treat her, would she be able to live a somewhat normal quality life as a non-laying chicken?