Fenbendazole (Safeguard), Corid & Other Parasite Concerns

[RichnSteph]

Hello folks!! Usually my hubby is in charge of the chicken research as I'm wrangling our one year old, but I have a rather involved question, so here I am to type it up.
So as he posted yesterday, we lost one of our girls that we suspected to have been dealing with the blackhead disease for quite some time, before we received her back from foster once we finally got our land established, house built & chicken castle set up. All of our research suggests that even if this wasn't the case, the best bet is to go ahead and treat the flock since we have a combination of 4 different sources of girls/rooster out there that we have enlisted in building our flock. I have checked with all the previous owners and no one has dewormed and our ages run 8 months-3 years old. I suspect that everyone started on medicated starter feed, but that's it.
So for starters, we did some Wazine in the water tonight for basics & as that was the only one I could get from the local feed store. So in my research I'm thinking, it will be very best to follow this up with a dose of Safeguard (Fenbendazole) which will not require a 10 day booster due to the prior Wazine treatment, they are getting today. Now to complicate matters, I understand that coccidiosis is another concern and although not as likely the cause of our fatal loss yesterday, definitely something we need to address since we have so many different origins for our birds. Does the Wazine & Fenbendazole combo cover us, to include cocci? Or do I need to go ahead and run a round of Corid with them after the Safeguard? We are doing a heavy withdrawal for 10 days from the latest round of dewormer so that's not a concern. Just got our last 4 girls in yesterday anyway, so they won't probably lay for us for two weeks to begin with. So in a nutshell... if concerns are that we lost a hen to blackhead disease, and want to be covered for coccidiosis as well due to 10 birds coming from 4 different sources, is Wazine + Safeguard enough? Or should we cover all bases and go conservative on the new flock with a Wazine + Safeguard + Corid? We WILL NOT be combining any of these treatments, we will be spacing them out a couple days apart for each- just for clarification.
Thank you in advance chicken wranglers!
Steph.

 

[Michael Apple]

I have checked with all the previous owners and no one has dewormed and our ages run 8 months-3 years old. I suspect that everyone started on medicated starter feed, but that's it.
So for starters, we did some Wazine in the water tonight for basics & as that was the only one I could get from the local feed store. So in my research I'm thinking, it will be very best to follow this up with a dose of Safeguard (Fenbendazole) which will not require a 10 day booster due to the prior Wazine treatment, they are getting today.

Wazine is Piperazine and only is effective against roundworms.
For regular worming regiments, a dose, then another 10 days later is often followed. If one suspects a high wormload, they will dose 3-5 days in a row with Safe-guard (Fenbendazole), then disregard that 10th day deworming. With Safe-guard liquid suspension (labeled for goats), I use .5 cc dose on any bird under 4 lbs. For larger birds I dose .75 to 1 cc. I use a 1 ml syringe minus the needle.

Valbazen suspension (also labeled for goats) is Albendazole which gets all worms and is dosed .5 cc for adult LF and .25 cc for Bantam sized fowl. It is dosed once then 10 days later.

Now to complicate matters, I understand that coccidiosis is another concern and although not as likely the cause of our fatal loss yesterday, definitely something we need to address since we have so many different origins for our birds. Does the Wazine & Fenbendazole combo cover us, to include cocci?
No. Corid (Amprolium) and other Sulfa drugs are effective against Coccidia protozoa.

Or do I need to go ahead and run a round of Corid with them after the Safeguard?

If you see regularly loose, watery droppings, birds losing weight, nice red combs fading to pink, you might consider doing a treatment dose of Corid for the whole flock after deworming. Corid 9.6% liquid is dosed 10 ml per gallon of water, making a fresh solution each day in drinkers. There is also a 20% Corid powder which is dosed 1 to 1.5 ml per gallon of water. This is done for 7 days.

There is a treatment dose for symptoms as I stated above, and there is a preventative dose. The preventative dose is half of what I stated. I use a preventative dose for 5 days, every three weeks until birds reach maturity 9-12 months of age since I do not use medicated feed. The reason I do not use medicated feed is because the amount of Amprolium used in feeds did not prevent problems in the past. My way of doing it by treating water has. After any deworming, or medication treatment, I always use vitamin-electrolyte-probiotic soluble powder in waterers for 3 days thereafter. It helps restore the good gut bacteria and nutrients quickly. Here is some valuable information about Coccidiosis:
http://www.thepoultrysite.com/articles/1138/coccidiosis-control

We are doing a heavy withdrawal for 10 days from the latest round of dewormer so that's not a concern.

What do you mean by "heavy withdrawal"?

Just got our last 4 girls in yesterday anyway, so they won't probably lay for us for two weeks to begin with.

If they are moulting, be aware that Benzamidazole classes of anthelmintics like Fenbendazole can cause "feather burn" or irregular feather growth.

So in a nutshell... if concerns are that we lost a hen to blackhead disease,

Histomoniasis (Blackhead) is caused by a protozoan carried by cecal worms. Are you sure that is what it was?
Histomoniasis: http://www.thepoultrysite.com/diseaseinfo/74/histamonosis-histomoniasis-blackhead

 

[RichnSteph]

Michael,
Thank you so very much for the wealth of information. Here's some clarification for your questions:

What do you mean by "heavy withdrawal"?
Just that we will start a 10 day period over (or long if required per med used) from the date of most recent administered withdrawal requiring med.

Histomoniasis (Blackhead) is caused by a protozoan carried by cecal worms. Are you sure that is what it was?
Not entirely. It may have been E. Coli. Or even Cocci. Let me give you a quick review of events.

Background - fostered by an elderly family member, 2 RIR mixes on large lot in suburbs. Had decent coop housing for overnight stay but daily free ranged. Coop was cleaned weekly, but with newspaper as the bedding over gravel (changed weekly), and shredded paper in the nesting boxes (changed weekly, maybe?). Never dewormed, vaccinated, etc. Conditions of this persisted from 16 weeks of age until just over 2 years old when she joined our household 2 weeks ago appearing in good health & laying. In the past 8 months she was attacked by neighbor cats twice. The first time resulted in a very depressed demeanor, hiding away from everything under bushes, in small tight areas next to the house. Mimicked behavior of overheating. Comb went pale, and lethargy set in, comb then drooped from that point on and never stood up again. Treated as dehydration as not sure if cat attack happened or not, until second attack was witnessed 3 months later, with same result in behavior creating suspicion of first round symptoms mirrored. Second time, she presented suspected injury to her breast area. Family member thought she had ingested something that got stuck in her craw (quote from family member - I personally am not sure if this is even possible). I suspect, injury occurred at the breast area, affecting respiratory, and maybe caused some internal bleeding. She was treated with Durvet and seemed to recover nicely, eating with very healthy appetite, slow to resume laying, but pinked up and happy. Had many episodes thereafter of depression, lethargy, watery poop, followed by apparent full recovery and eating like a pig and gaining weight/resumed laying, and then back down the roller coaster of lethargy, diarrhea. Seemed this cycle repeated over and over in 1-3 week time frames all the way up until yesterday. Suddenly from normal upswing, she was not able to support herself. Not eating/drinking, 3rd eyelid rarely open. I checked her over and fed her water via syringe which would produce a head shake and full eye opening for a brief moment. She had extremely loose droppings with minimal black color and primarily bright mustard yellow, but liquidy - not foamy or frothy or bloody. This was the first time we'd seen this as she even had a regular dropping clinging to her back end tail feathers when we brought her in to check her out. No other apparent external evidence, but condition worsened within an hour, and she was gone. Symptoms aren't exact to any particular condition and all the rest of our birds are in fabulous spirits and health, no signs of combs being anything but bright, vivid red combs, and solid regular droppings.

I'm trying to be as proactive as possible to cover my flock with a broad spectrum preventative to make sure they are all in the clear and also to address the fact we've pulled from 4 sources in the past 2 weeks to create our flock.

It sounds possibly that our best bet will be to follow up the Wizane with the Valbazen, and a 10 day booster of the Valbazen thereafter and maybe a quick dose of Durvet just to give everyone a boost. Would you agree?

Then I'm onto helping our Silver Laced Wyandotte recover from harsh treatment by roosters at her previous home (yes, I may be a chicken rescuer taking in the injured and maltreated), and has a lot of bare skin and some hot spots to mend.
Thank you again for your help, you have been wonderful!

 

[Michael Apple]

Michael,
Thank you so very much for the wealth of information. Here's some clarification for your questions:

What do you mean by "heavy withdrawal"?
Just that we will start a 10 day period over (or long if required per med used) from the date of most recent administered withdrawal requiring med.

Histomoniasis (Blackhead) is caused by a protozoan carried by cecal worms. Are you sure that is what it was?
Not entirely. It may have been E. Coli. Or even Cocci. Let me give you a quick review of events.
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I'm trying to be as proactive as possible to cover my flock with a broad spectrum preventative to make sure they are all in the clear and also to address the fact we've pulled from 4 sources in the past 2 weeks to create our flock.

Introducing new birds to an existing flock shouldn't be done until they have been quarantined for at least 30 days to ensure the new ones are healthy and free of disease. it is not a good idea to mix old and young birds together. There are braod spectrum antibiotics which are effective against gram negative and positive bacteria, but when it comes to intestinal worms, Coccidia, and other protozoa, specific medications are used.

It sounds possibly that our best bet will be to follow up the Wizane with the Valbazen, and a 10 day booster of the Valbazen thereafter and maybe a quick dose of Durvet just to give everyone a boost. Would you agree?

Nope. You already treated with Wazine. 10 days later dose with Valbazen suspension. Durvet is a brand which makes numerous supplements and medications. What was the medication/supplement with the Durvet brand name you used?

Then I'm onto helping our Silver Laced Wyandotte recover from harsh treatment by roosters at her previous home (yes, I may be a chicken rescuer taking in the injured and maltreated), and has a lot of bare skin and some hot spots to mend.
Thank you again for your help, you have been wonderful!

You're welcome. Most of us want to see our birds healthy and thriving. Taking in injured or abused (I consider neglect abuse) is an honorable task. There are some people who shouldn't be allowed to possess animals, let alone raise children. I've seen it with dogs and cats most of my life. Certain precautions and biosecurity should be practiced though with taking in birds, so you don't undermine your good intentions.

 

[RichnSteph]

Indeed animal abuse is sadly quite a regular practice. It's disheartening.

Introducing new birds to an existing flock shouldn't be done until they have been quarantined for at least 30 days to ensure the new ones are healthy and free of disease. it is not a good idea to mix old and young birds together. There are braod spectrum antibiotics which are effective against gram negative and positive bacteria, but when it comes to intestinal worms, Coccidia, and other protozoa, specific medications are used.

That's what I've determined so far, and it seems we can't nail down the exact cause of the loss of the one hen, although we have the history on her, that we are pretty able to decide at this point there isn't a further treatment to be done. Thankfully everyone else is doing very well. Suppose we didn't quarantine everyone due to the flock coming together the original 7 at the same time and then the other 4 just received 2 days ago-about 10 days apart, the same day we found the hen on her last moments. So I didn't have much of anything established in our yard, just from each of their own in their previous homes where we had full history on all and the first 7 came from family/family friends we are very familiar with. I do believe we probably should've expected the outcome on that hen given her history, and the up and down and many attacks by the feral cats at her previous location. I am thinking more and more that may have been the underlying cause, as she just was never the same, and we took her knowing that she had this up and down wellness tendency.


Nope. You already treated with Wazine. 10 days later dose with Valbazen suspension. Durvet is a brand which makes numerous supplements and medications. What was the medication/supplement with the Durvet brand name you used?

Thank you, that clears it up completely! 10 days from today, Valbazen will be given and I'll call that good for deworming. Our grandmother was the one who administered the Durvet solution to the 2 RIR mixes a few months ago, as they were with her until we got them over to our place 2 weeks ago. I have to wait until we make the drive to see her again and retrieve the bottle to find out exactly which product it is. She was trying to tell me over the phone yesterday as she was sure it was a dewormer, but after hearing the list of a few ingredients, I explained to her it was not; she couldn't read the label print too well to let me know which version of solution it was. I'll do some research once I receive it.

Thank you again, many times over!!