Is a pop door, 30inches off the ground, a good idea against daytime predators?

[squadleader]

As you can see in the photo above, I'm thinking of mounting the Pullet Shut Automatic Door, at the end of the chickens roosting bar, which is a five quarter x 5.5 inch deck board. In essence, I would be extending the roosting bar outside of the tractor, the extended perch would extend out of the tractor 30 inches.

The extended perch would be a 2x4 turned short side up. The extended perch would be 30 inches off the ground, the same height as the roosting board, which height the chickens are used to.

I'm considering this as a defense against larger daytime predators like dogs.

First a couple of things. We incubated, and raised chicks this spring. It was fun and interesting for the kids, but I promise you, I'll never do that again.

I'm an efficiency nut, and I'm very glad to pay $16 for a hen who is an adult, and is going to start laying next week, so I'm only going to be using this with adult birds.

Second, my birds free range all day, everyday, so they'll need to come out, and go back in several times a day, to lay, and grab feed during the day, which they do now, currently I chain open my people door, unfortunately, dogs can get in the tractor currently.

So in my mind, it seems it will be hard for a large predator to get good leverage on entering a door, 30 inches off the ground with a short sided 2x4 sticking out 30 inches.

I'm sure my birds can easily hop/fly up to this perch and walk into the tractor, but obviously not nearly as quickly as if the door was just six inches off the ground on top of the lower frame, in which case they would walk in on the ground.

So I'm wondering if in an emergency, like some kind of daytime attack, would the slow process of 13 birds trying to get back in the tractor be a real problem. In real life, I'm thinking that may not be an issue because it seems they shelter in place, whenever they perceive a threat, and wouldn't be trying to get back into the tractor either way.

I feel like having the door elevated like this, does provide an additional level of security for keeping dogs and such out of the tractor during the day.

There's so much experience on this forum, I'm hoping someone has seen this done before, and if so, was it successful.

I can mount the door low, if that's a better idea. I do hate to create a high hole in the tractor, only to discover later, I should have placed the hole low.

Thanks, and let me know what y'all think!

 

[SunHwaKwon]

IMO it sounds like a great idea. The only bad thing is some chickens (young ones) "forget" how to get in under duress. And then of course there is the bottlenecking issue you mention.

You say it is a tractor buy do you actually move it? That's a heck of a skirt. It doesn't look like you have any trees nearby for them to escape to so you might also consider making a roost about 6' tall in the area they can fly up to. If your breeds are not good flyers, you can make another one 3' tall several feet from it that they can use for an intermediate.

I like free ranging so I have chosen breeds that are a bit more flighty and predator resistant, such as what's on this list https://www.cacklehatchery.com/free-range-predator-resistant-special.html
My Ancona is also very predator savvy, as are my clean legged smaller bantams.

 

[Sophocles]

Any dog small enough to fit through a pop door (e.g. terriers) would be deterred by sufficiently high perches inside the coop anyway, no?

More crafty day-time threats like a weasel or the rare raccoon would probably not be deterred by this by itself.

Like SunHwaKwon I worry certain chickens will not be able to figure it out in a crisis situation.

 

[squadleader]

Hi SunHwaKwon,

You're reading my mind! The other day, I was wondering if a high perch around the tractor would be a good idea.

By the way, I move the tractor once a week. The big skirts work very well, they're 16 foot x 50 inch cattle panels (cheap at $22 from Tractor Supply), with half inch hardware cloth zip tied over them.

There's a natural curl to the cattle panels, that's why I weight them with cinder blocks, but it's a very useful characteristic for pulling because I don't have to raise the skirts when I pull, that saves a lot of time, and the skirts don't dig into the ground.

It only takes 5 minutes to pull the tractor each week, everything hangs inside it, and I just throw the cinder blocks aside, put the chain over the trailer hitch on my truck, pull it eight feet, and that's it for the week.

I can pull in any direction, but usually, because of my field orientation, it's sideways like this.

Here's what the door and perch extending off their roosting board would look like from within the tractor.

I like the idea of a high daytime perch you suggested. A 2x4 extended out from the peak of the hoop is about 6 feet off the ground, and then extending a 2x4 off the two side rails, about 30 inches off the ground, might serve as a good intermediate perch for the high perch, like in the photo below.

As you can see, I parked a utility trailer near the tractor, to give them some extra ground cover, they do pause beneath quite a bit, coming and going to my house, which off to the right out of the photo. They also seem to like hanging out under my front porch a lot.

I appreciate your thoughts on the raised pop door, I just haven't ever seen it done, and I'm wondering if I'm making some kind of obvious mistake.

 

[squadleader]

Hi Sophocles,

The more I think about a crisis, the less I'm thinking it'll be a problem because they're usually away from the tractor during the day. The odds of the whole flock suddenly trying to use the tractor as shelter from a predator is probably remote.

But that being said, individual hens do go back to the tractor to lay during the day, so an individual hen might be in there by herself during an attack, in the nesting box.

I got the small Pullet Shut Automatic Door, it's 9.5 inches wide and 10.5 inches tall, as opposed to their standard door that's 11 inches wide, and 15 inches tall. I've chained my door all the way down to 6 inches wide, and even my big rooster goes through without a problem, so I know I could even put a wood blocker on inside side of the Pullet Shut Door and choke the opening down to 6 inches, making it even harder for a dog to enter.

Probably the most vulnerable bird would be an individual hen who's in the tractor during the day, she's only 24 inches off the ground in the nesting box. I've had packs of off course hunting dogs come on my property before, I hate the thought of them getting in the tractor during the day.

I don't think any of these issues make this a bad idea.

However, the one issue that can only be answered by someone who's seen this done before, is do the birds not like it, and if so, enough that they don't want come back to the tractor to lay during the day.

I'm certain it's fine for getting out in the morning, and returning to roost in the evening, it's the back and forth during the day I wonder about.

 

[aart]

Have seen higher pop doors, but they usually have a ramp up to a 'porch' (platform) in front of pop door.
Not sure what you propose would be viable for many of the reasons posed,
especially the panicked traffic jam.
Might reduce chance of predator infiltration and loss from such,
at least the larger preds.
I think if their feed and water is inside they will go back in during the day.
Only one way to find out, try it and see.

 

[squadleader]

OK you guys, I'll be the Guinea pig/idiot, who's going to test out this little idea of a fly in pop door! Once I figure out the new framing in the tractor interior, I'll install the new Pullet Shut door that's sitting in corner, rearing to get in the game.

It's going to be higher than I figured, I'm going to put it at the end of the new roosting bar at 42 inches, up from the current 30 inches. It'll exit on the south end, with a long perch bar on outside, maybe six feet long.

We'll see if the hens can fly up 42 inches.

After all the "how long, steep, wide or whatever posts about ramps, here's the one asking, should there even be a ramp?

Think of how tough my hens will be, strutting around the barnyard, "ramp, ramp!, we don't need no stinkin' ramp!"

Ok, so worst case scenario, some hardware cloth over a new hole in the tractor, and a pop door on the ground like normal people.

Since nobody's chimed in with even having heard of such a thing, we'll do it like an auction. Once, twice, three times, and if no other bidders, OK, I'll own this thing! The world's first fly in pop door!

Brings to mind the old adage "be careful what you wish for, you might get it."

 

[Larry55]

This may sound like a crazy idea but what about investing in a livestock guardian dog? Then u could put door where ever u wanted.

 

[squadleader]

That's not a bad idea, I've got a 17 pound Jack Russell, when it gets a little warmer, I'm going to leave him in yard while I'm gone, instead of the house.

There was a post today that made the point 42 inches isn't too high for even a roost bar, so I'm thinking about making it 36 inches off the ground, it should be fine.

At night there's no issue at all. I'm going to install the automatic door, this is me just trying to throw the odds as far as I can in the chickens favor, in how I do the install.

I'm thinking there's no downside really, and who knows, it might keep another animal out during the day.

I have a strong feeling it'll eliminate any dog activity. Any dog high enough to reach the door is going to be too big to use it, and smaller dogs shouldn't be able to reach.

Plus I'm choking the width with a board from 9.5 inches down to 6 inches. I've been using m 6 inches on the current door for several weeks now, and even the big rooster can get through.

This is the small Pullet Shut door, not the regular size. Unless you've got some unusually big birds, this size works.

I'll report back after I get it installed. I've got some things I want to change on the framing and roof before I can install the door.