newbie and not sure what to do.....

[old fashioned]

We have 3 red sex link hens and 1 bantam rock roo since Sept 14, 2009. All about 1 1/2 years. They have Purina Layena crumbles, grit, oyster shell and ACV water 24/7 in the pen-door is left open during the day. They are let out to free range all day, locked up at night. I give treats of whatever I have on hand-yogurt, birdseed, cooked eggs, oatmeal, wheatberries, kitchen/garden stuff, greens, bread, etc. Plus anytime they see me they come running, especially if I have a shovel cause they know I'll be digging (worms, bugs, etc.)-more like a chicken stampede. As you can tell, they eat all the time-yet still are skinny. I can feel the breast bone (keel?) on every one. Their crops are full but not hard, I've massaged them. (just in case I'm wrong-a full crop would look like a golf ball or ? in their right front pocket?) 3 days ago we dusted (garden/poultry dust in can) and wormed them with Pig Swig (Piperazine? for pigs and poultry) though I'm not sure if this would be enough because the label says "roundworms in poultry". Nice but what about other types of worms? I've seen posts on BYC to up their protein levels higher than 16%. But wouldn't they be getting that between the feed, treats and ranging/digging?

Also wouldn't ya know the one hen that has all her feathers is the one that doesn't lay eggs. She eats plenty, drinks alot of water-more than others, ranges the yard pecking and scratching, but is slower than the rest, lays down several times though doesn't appear to be "pushing" just resting. I've not seen her dust bathing herself so much in the last week and now that I think of it I'm not so sure if the others have either since we dusted them. She does not seem to fly or flutter upwards, but is "grounded"(?). Poo seems normal, though she does poo in her bed and has it sticking to her butt feathers. If I don't get it cleaned out, then she just sleeps in another spot. I haven't found any worms in anyone's poo yet but may still be too early to tell. Her eyes are bright, combs and wattles are red-though seem a little lighter shade in the last few days. Her legs are a creamy color, and feet are more yellowish. The other hens legs and feet are creamy colored. She just seems so "bottom heavy". I'm not sure if she's egg bound, beginning to molt, or has Ascites and I can't take her to a vet, we just don't have $$. I've tried to feel for the "egg" though I've not tried putting my finger in her vent yet. But how long can a hen be egg bound and live to bawk about it? I'm thinking it more Ascites and that would break my heart since I lost my own mother last year to "congestive heart failure". I couldn't put the hen down for it, but would just try to keep her as comfortable as possible.

I guess I'm just asking to get a more knowledgable and experienced persons take on this to either confirm or deny my bumbling diagnosis, other possibilities, ideas, etc. anything I'm doing wrong? anything more I could do without cost? Any help is greatly appreciated.

 

[Judy]

You won't necessarily see worms in the poo. I would follow the piperazine about two weeks later with some ivermectin. I would also dust with permethrin or 5% Sevin for mites/lice.

Here is a thread you may find helpful:

https://www.backyardchickens.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=123057

I don't know what else to tell you about the one who is not laying.

 

[old fashioned]

Thank you for replying. I did dust them with Permethrin (active ingredient of garden/poultry dust). I asked at the feed store about wormers and was told the "Pig Swig" (piperazine) was the thing to have. I had noticed the "ivermectin" and asked about it for chickens and was told in no uncertain terms it was for beef cattle and was looked at as if I was THE dumbest blonde for even suggesting it for poultry. So I had to swallow back all the #$%@ not so nice replies swimming in my head because I know I'm not experienced enough to challenge what they say (most info I have has been from reading posts on BYC). Not to mention the two different feed stores I've been to, to ask about DE as DE and NOBODY knows what I'm talking about, they only know by the formal name of Diamatious (spck)Earth. I don't mind being treated as a "dumb cluck" if for the greater good, but I really HATE it when others are so condescending.
Anyway, since the others seem just fine-very active, beautiful eggs, etc. I'm not too worried about them being skinny, just a little. Especially since they've been treated for worms and mites/lice. I am more concerned with "Nugget", but after soul searching I've accepted the fact that no matter what's wrong with her there isn't much I can do for her and will have to let God/nature take it's course.
I am still interested in any other replies, ideas, suggestions, etc. Thanks so much to all

 

[old fashioned]

Another thing I've noticed, is all the chickens will open their beaks and stretch their necks. Especially the rooster. Is this normal? or some kind of gagging, coughing or ??? Thanks again........

 

[PunkinPeep]

First, you'll probably always be able to feel the keel bone. They're too skinny if you can actually pinch it with your fingers. Free ranging burns off a lot of calories, so i think it's harder to get 'fat' free-rangers. And that's a good thing! It means they're healthy.

The stretching and yawning can sometimes be a sign of gapeworm....but not necessarily. So don't get too alarmed. I would suggest just making yourself familiar with the symptoms so you can look out for it, specifically since you're feeding them worms from the yard, which can sometimes carry gapeworm larvae.

If they did have gapeworm, ivermectin taken orally should take care of it.

 

[old fashioned]

Thanks, PunkinPeep. I'm not too worried (just enough to keep a close watch) about most of it all. But I had tried to get Ivermectin, but was told they only have injectable and pour on for beef cattle NOT poultry. Sheesh you would have thought I asked if eggs in the store were really laid by real chickens!!

 

[PunkinPeep]

That's true. It's not labeled for chickens. But it's the same stuff. I believe you can get the injectable and just give it orally instead of injecting it. I don't know much about the pour-on, but threehorses has some explicit directions about that somewhere here.

 

[old fashioned]

Thanks again....guess I'll have to bully my way to get the ivermectin. grrrrr!
Though I still wonder about Nugget with possible Ascites, egg bound, or just a fat lazy hen??? Does anyone know how long a hen can be egg bound before dying? Thanks for any suggestions.

 

[kathyinmo]

Get the ivermectin "pour on," for cattle. It is blue. You can use it in a syringe with the needle attached. NO, do not inject it, but use it for ease of the drops. I believe it is 5 drops on the neck. Be sure it gets on the skin, not in the fluff and feathers, as that will do no good.

 

[elmo]

Quote:
They're just rearranging the food in their crops when they do this, although you rooster may be doing something akin to "clearing his throat" for his crowing, too.