A stable breed brown egg layer of commercial value - possible?

[NatJ]

Aren't they the same thing?
Production reds and red sex link?

Sex links are sexable by color when they hatch.
Production Reds are not color sexable.

Red sex links often have white tails (black tail is less common but also possible).
Production Reds always have black tails, just like Rhode Island Reds and New Hampshires always have black tails. None of them will ever have a white tail.

 

[rockethoe]

Sex links are sexable by color when they hatch.
Production Reds are not color sexable.

Red sex links often have white tails (black tail is less common but also possible).
Production Reds always have black tails, just like Rhode Island Reds and New Hampshires always have black tails. None of them will ever have a white tail.

but are production red a hybrid (f1 RIR x New Hampshire/RIW) or a stabilised breed descended from that cross? I get a different answer everywhere I look.

 

[NatJ]

but are production red a hybrid (f1 RIR x New Hampshire/RIW) or a stabilised breed descended from that cross? I get a different answer everywhere I look.

As far as I can tell, some are an F1 cross and some are a stabilized line descended from the cross.

For example, Ideal Poultry sells them and says this:
"Production Reds were developed from Rhode Island Reds and New Hampshire Reds for efficient brown egg production."
https://www.idealpoultry.com/product/1417/2
That sounds like a stable genepool now.

But Cackle Hatchery says this:
"The Production Red chicken breed is a cross of Cackle Hatchery’s® best Rhode Island Red chicken production line over Cackle Hatchery’s® best New Hampshire chicken production line. This cross produces a very vigorous, healthy egg producing hen."
https://www.cacklehatchery.com/product/production-reds/
That sounds like a direct cross each time (probably good because of the hybrid vigor from crossing the two different lines of birds.)

Welp Hatchery says this:
"Production Reds are a brown egg cross or non-standard breed that was developed for the purpose of efficient production of large brown eggs with crosses utilizing Rhode Island Reds and New Hampshire Reds."
https://www.welphatchery.com/layer-type-chicks/production-red-female/
That sounds to me like crosses in the past, developed into two or more breeding lines at the present, that are then crossed to produce the chicks they sell (but I could be interpreting it wrong. Their description could just as easily mean they now have a true-breeding line that came from crosses in the past.)

I think "Production Red" may be a bit like the term "Easter Egger," in that it tells you something important about the chicken, but that kind of chicken can be produced in several different ways. Production Reds do PRODUCE lots of brown eggs, and have RED feathers with a fairly predictable body type, but can be a true-breeding line or a hybrid. (Easter Eggers are even less predictable: the important point is that they lay blue or green eggs, but beyond that they can have any possible chicken traits. They can come from many different crosses of breeds, or from breeding Easter Eggers to each other.)

 

[buddy44]

Wasn't the original Production Red an Rhode Island X New Hampshire?