Barnevelder breeders lets work together and improve the breed

[Double Laced]

Marans are based on Pti-1L(only!), Id, W

Barnevelder have Id, w+

It is not so complicate to create clean shanks (as proven already by Lord Greenway (the creator of english Marans), in five Years, if You have only to deal with Pti-1L!

There are many clean shanked varieties in breeds, which are based on Barbu d'Uccle, but they managed it aswell, even if they had to deal with the selection against Pti-3 and Vulture Hocks (v)


PS: With Pti-1B (Brahma) would it be more difficult. Pti-1B is dominant over Pti-1L (Langshan).


So You have to deal with 2 genes in contrary to at least 13 egg shell genes, who noone knows how they are really controlled.
In Germany and the Netherlands the show breeder crossed in Wyandottes in Barnevelder and Leghorns in Welsummer and destroyed by this way, the egg shell colour.
This fault can't be recovered probably for many decades.

Five years is a long time!

You still have to deal with the 13 egg shell genes regardless of which breed you choose so that argument doesn't stand up, so perhaps we had better agree to disagree.

I do agree that the rush to produce every variety of every bird regardless of the breed standard is a big problem, the problem is you don't need to show the egg to show the bird or vica versa. And there is a major problem with bad breeders trying to make a profit selling hatching eggs on the likes of ebay!

 

[Redcap]

To recreate the silver double laced (SDL) Barnies needed 10 Year to get rid of autosomal red. This is what they thought!
http://www.tuinvee.nl/Het rode stiefkindje WEB.pdf (See picture from David Hancox - the ash [dirty] silver birds)
The problem was, that they used a silver pencilled Wyandotte line with hidden autosomal red (additinationally to the part of the brown double laced Barnies).
The dutch breeders and the english breeder who recreated the large version admit, that they have still atavistic problems with the autosomal red therefore again and again -after ten Years.
The atavististic problem of autosomal red is an additonally reason, why I have introduced Birchen Marans. In this strain has the advantage, that You can realize AR-Discolouration much better. Additionally the egg colour in SDL Barnies is finally destroyed (eggs from Chris Millwards strain - he backcrossed the SDL bantam version from rthe NL with UK BDL Barnies*)
Top: Ixworth eggs
Bottom: Left - UK Welsummer Eggs - Right - UK SDL Barnevelder
It is a far way for me to reach the deep brown of UK Welsummer and perfect SDL type birds.


* So I thought, that his strain should have better egg colour again, when I imported them in 2012.
But the problem is that the bantam BDL Barnies had already more "diluted" egg shells (in comparison to the large BDL Barnies)
by Cross-in of Wyandottes over decades (Initially for Creation of the BDL bantams, but also later for improvement of Type)

Finally I got the information in 2014, that there is a large version in the Netherlands now, which was recreated with large Barnies and large Wyandottes.
And surprisingly their egg shell colours seems to be really better (if the left eggs are really from SDL Barnies).


But I have decided, that I want a deeper brown - similar to my UK Welsummer.
This feels to be the true egg shell colour - which was labeled as dark brown in old breed reports.
In this time the Barnevelder, Welsummer and Marans were almost equal (of course the Marans were superior already then).
But in a doctoral thesis of 1936 about the Marans, the Dutch breeds were mentioned in Comparison to them.
The Marans have been improved more and more over decades, and some UK breeder have been so smart to mirror the trait to the Welsummer aswell.
Unfortunately, in Germany and in the Netherlands they went another way. Today both Dutch breeds can't reach the old glory of a dark layer in these both countries.

 

[Double Laced]

I managed to breed both bantam and large fowl silver laced barnevelders inside 4 years with no problems of red leakage. and the eggs are brown but not dark brown. I used a standard silver laced wyandotte in both cases.




I'm not sure exactly what you are trying to say. my advice earlier was to use a bird like a white sussex to breed with the white barnevelder if thats what it was. And then to avoid anything with feathery legs which is still what i would advise. This thread is about barnevelders and i always select for dark egg amongst other things.


and my silver large fowl

 

[Redcap]

My original plan was to use UK Cuckoo Marans, but no single chick hatched from the imported eggs. Soon after this mis-success I realized that Cuckoo could hide also the creamy silver. Therefore I decided to go the "safe" way, as I want to get dark eggs and a clean silver. This is possible with Birchen Marans.
And again, I would create white Barnies with white Marans to keep or improve the egg color. After ten Years - Both parties, Mr. Beugelsdijk who recreated the SDL Bantam Barnevelder and Mr. Tensen & Simmelink who recreated the large fowl SDL Barnevelder in NL, told me that they needed in each case 10 Years to bring them to Standard Show quality. I am sure to have perfect Barnies with smooth/clean shanks, but wit very dark egg colour in the same time. I just want to say: All roads lead to Rome. And finally sometimes the obviously harder way is the shorter.

 

[Redcap]

Dear Neil,

could it be, that You know Colin Booth?

 

[Double Laced]

He breeds Araucanas If memory serves. Know of him. don't think i've ever met him unless by accident at a show

 

[Redcap]

My initial thought was, that You could be the second breeder, from where I've got the second part of hatching eggs of SDL Barnevelder in 2012, which he organized for me and I could pick up at his place. But I realized, after my posting, that You are too far away from him.

 

[tls_ranch]

Most of my flock is molting. I'm spoiling them, because it is still so dry and brown here with very little green in sight. They got pumpkins yesterday

This hen is almost done molting. Her tail feathers are still growing back in.

I don't think I'm going to offer any eggs until spring especially if we do get hit with this big El Niño. Mainly because I like to hatch for myself to check fertility and I don't want to raise up a bunch of chicks in what they say will be a nasty, wet winter.

Trisha

 

[tanya06horse]

My babies are getting big!

 

[yummychocolate3]

I'm looking for a Barnevelder Rooster for my two hens...or some eggs. I keep my chicks inside my family room in a nice big brooder until they can go outside when it's nice...the whole room is solely for chickens, so you would'nt have to worry about them getting cold or wet.

Here is pic of my two Barnies