The male with the barring is quite a bit closer to the Standard than the other male. The Kathy males and females are about equal in conformation but the females are getting closer to the Standard color. I have judged the bird that won at Red Bluff and it did even better at that show. So the color is what is taking time. Even well established breeds/colors need constant attention to color. It is a difficult color pattern but folks like Kim and others that are working on these Dels are getting closer and closer to the color Standard. I think they are close to the Standard in conformation. WaltI know the hens look amazing I wonder about the cockerels. I think they seem to be lagging a bit (at least in coloration) than the girls. Here are the 2 cockerels Neil has access to. The one with the barring in the tail is a Kathy bird from Kim's culls. The one with the back turned here is one from Jules (fortyfivefarm) line. We both have 2 pullets from Kim's culls. I think it is definitely harder with the boys because you usually cull them harder than the girls and don't usually have the option to keep backups like you can layers.