Cattle panels?

[ShrekDawg]

Okay, so I do have a master question thread post and should really post this there to keep track but it's gotten limited responses (though great responses, thank you) and never posted this particular one so posting here. Plus I figure this is more universal and may help other people. I can always put the link to this one in there anyway so I can find it.

But ANYWAY.

I've heard of plenty of people making "hoop coops" with these cattle panels and I briefly considered it then thought I settled on something else. Well, now I'm back thinking about it and have come up with several questions, hence the making of this thread.

So first and foremost is WHAT cattle panels?

I'm pretty sure I know which ones (seen tons of people mention the 16 foot around $20 ones) but I was realizing while going through TSC's website that there are actually several different ones. There's not like 20 pages and hundreds of results or anything like that but it seems that there are about 9 or 10 potential options.

Sooo...

Here is TSC's cattle panel page and would any of these work or are there specific kinds? Obviously the solid metal bar horse corral ones wouldn't work and definitely wouldn't bend but even just cattle panels there's so many. Feedlot panels, horse fence panel, utility panel, etc. etc. are they all the same? is there a difference? again, here's their page.

http://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/catalog/farm-ranch/fencing/corral-feedlot-panels

I also noticed that there seem to be different ones for different animals but that some are more expensive?

Next question, which kind of goes along with it, is has anyone ever used the 8 foot ones? I know to bend it would create way too short and narrow of a run but maybe someone has used it or just used it straight and not hooped?

Which leads me to my next question: do they have to be bent into a hoop coop? would it be possible to, say, connect a few and just make a normal run from it? Perhaps using, for example, two 16 foot panels for the long end and an 8 foot panel? Or connecting the two 16 foot ones? Probably too long for me but wondered if anyone had done it. And if it is possible to do this, has anyone ever put two on top of each other? Or just put a roof on it as is at 4 foot? for connecting to each other, I simply mean like you might with HC, either tying the panels together or getting a piece of wood to screw it to in order to make it say 8 foot instead of 4. At that point though I suppose it may cost about the same or be about as much work as just getting HC or welded wire.

Another question, and the main reason I actually thought of this, is has anyone ever used one as a brooder?

Wondering because I've been trying to make a brooder in the garage, just a larger kiddie pool than their current one with welded wire around it then trying to tie HC to it but it's a pain, and it's not fun and I know they will outgrow it fast so I have been trying to think of new ways. I was thinking of just making a traditional wood frame for the HC but we don't really know how to operate much and that's more permanent. Someone also recently in the other thread suggested PVC pipe and plastic HC or even normal HC but just the PVC making it easier to adjust and move. I like idea but that seems like work too. I don't know, I'm just trying to think of the best and easiest way possible because they really need to move out and really need space.

Another potential thing that I thought of that we could do either with traditional wooden framed HC or welded wire, our chainlink dog kennel, or the cattle panels, is to make an area next to the garage. We decided we don't want the coop there since it's so close to the neighbors but I figure setting up a temporary brooder would be fine and that would provide tons of room to run and fly. There's also a fence piece on one side and obviously the garage on the other (complete with a door) so we would only really need 2 fence pieces, maybe 3 or more depending on how big they are. The area is 9 feet wide by 26 feet long but we don't have to use the full area. I thought that might be great, especially with HC on the ground in the area. However. my mom is still insisting they are way too little to be out there and that a coyote would get them the first night. I say not if it's secure but she says we don't konw how/can't do that by ourselves. Well, we've never tried but I could guarantee I'm a lot more careful than my dad (I'm pretty positive I'm OCD/also just weird and precise and stuff so I'd be really careful and also follow recipes exactly, etc. etc. hah) and with something like cattle panels it really would not require any special skills. And if it can keep cows, horses, hogs, sheep, goats, etc. etc. in, I'm pretty positive it can keep coyotes out. Or at least I would hope. But that said, I too am nervous about putting littles that little outside but if it is secure, I don't see the issue. Perhaps though I will make a garage thing and then move them out there when they are a wee bit bigger, say at 3 or 4, maybe 5, weeks. I do like the somewhat "sheltered" thing of the garage though but I could provide that outside too surely?

And also, surely something bigger would need less cleaning? I would still clean it regularly obviously, especially being as they're so little still, but I just mean it might smell less/poop would be more spread out instead of in one tiny little area?

But ANYWAY.

I'm rambling now and making this post wayyy too long so I am going to end this post right now but any and all input would be greatly appreciated, even if you don't have the answer to every question, as I'm sure most people don't.

Thank you in advance.

 

[aart]

I think that folks who just use plastic have other means of predator protection, like hot wire and/or LGD and/or other fencing.

'Chasing space'...is what you're doing with your chicks, common for newbies who don't realize how much room they need and how fast they grow.
You start small for the cute tiny chicks then a week or two later they're huge and you scramble to get a bigger space set up.

Can't remember what your whole story is and what your plans for a coop are.
I always advise to get the coop built before you even get chicks...often too late for that by the time folks come here going ......gaahhhh!

So is the hoop coop something you're contemplating for your adult bird coop...or another intermediate brooder/growout coop?

 

[paintedChix]

Wow. Difficult to follow all that you are trying to accomplish.

What kind of chickens did you get? How big will they be? How many? That will determine basic size of a coop. In MA, if you aren't doing the coop part for the birds in the garage, you will need a large enough coop to keep them in during your snowstorms (doesn't all of MA get snow?).

Cattle panels are WONDERFUL things!! The page you showed from TSC had all kinds of livestock fencing. The reason hog, sheep and horse panels are more expensive than the cattle panel is simple. Smaller spaces between the squares = both more vertical and more horizontal pieces to be welded in. Material and time to build - even in mass quantities = higher $ amount. For our Shetland ponies and eventual goats - I'd love to have the 2"x2" horse panels - but at almost $60/panel (and at the TSCs here in NC it's $69/panel) - I can get 3 panels of the cattle (now a combo panel w/ smaller squares on the bottom - used to be all the same size and 52" tall rather than the 50" tall it is now) and cut it myself.

Don't know that you could bend an 8' panel around a kiddie pool or into a coop or run. Seems would be too short to me after I've used the 16' ones. BUT you could try. Cheaper to purchase the 16' ones and cut your own. Gardeners cut them all the time to use as trellis in combo with raised beds.

Our mature chickens can go right through a cattle panel by itself - whether it is in the regular setting or in an upright, curved hoop coop setting. Chicks can go thru that much faster. We didn't have problems with predators here (NC) on our previous property and not so far on our new set up either. SO - chicken wire works great - no HC on the sides OR as an "apron" on the ground. We covered our hoop coops completely with the chicken wire, then cover that with tarps to provide shade during the summer and cover during the rain, bit of snow and freezing precip we get. Eventually, our hoops will get covered with corrugated panels - think greenhouse type.

The link already shown has a fantastic set up by a fellow NCer. Made me drool! If you go thru the info on deep litter method, you'll see other hoop coops - BeeKissed has a great one and so does a woman in NY (I think). Also, Blooie (in WY or the Dakotas - wind, snow, cold) uses hers as a run with a connecting tunnel to their chicken coop. There are many others using the cattle panel hoop coops in different formats. Ours aren't fancy, but works for us. Still have some tweaking to do and things to build!

We currently have 3 different hoop coops - each made with a wooden base about 8'x10'. Each is slightly different in design, though not by much. To move them, though that was the original plan, is difficult! They are HEAVY - w/o added pop doors, hanging feeders, waterers, nesting boxes OR roosts. And ours don't have any wood sides/backs on them either. Also, we followed one design with the boards all the way around level and square. We have rough land and that makes it hard to pull them around - even if using a tractor, lawn mower or truck - both the front piece and the back piece "catch" on uneven areas, cacti (yep, got lots of that here on this new property), weeds, tufts of grass separate from other grass & brush. The "catching" is hard on whatever is used to pull it (think transmission/engine/clutch repair or painful shoulders/backs) AND also on the coop itself - each jolt works loose something somewhere.

Lots of pics to follow!

Building our first hoop coop -



After seeing several versions of a cattle/stock panel "hoop coop", I wanted one or several! So here is our first attempt - Juli and I are doing the build. It's already been a long day and this is turning out to be some work. Good work, but work. We get the panels zip tied together, then get them stapled to the 2x6x10 boards that will make the sides, then reverse it and stand it up. Then comes attaching the front and rear boards - hmmm... pre-drilling holes is wonderful!



Our granddaughters are checking it out! The bucket to the right side is the "pop" door. The end on the inside of the pen is cut out and to let chicken in/out, you just pull off the bucket lid (which can't be taken away as it's attached by a cord made from braided hay string). The front and back of this pen is 8' wide. The 2 cattle panels are 50" "tall" - so joined is 100". That's a little more than 8'. Say "coop" or "pen" is 8'x8'4". If it was made 3 panels long, it would be 8'x12-1/2'.

Who says you can't brood chicks in it?? These babies have been in the "coop" for a month already - these 3 were only 1.5 weeks old when I brought them home on October 17th. The first night, they spent in my feed room, then they were in a dog Xpen, covered in chicken wire, in this coop. They had the baby chick waterer and feeder, a "crate" they could bed down in w/ shavings, 3 sides blocked in so that heat could be retained and a warm light hanging from above. That whole thing is now out, they are eating/drinking w/ the two big girls (Australorps) but still have their light hanging. Will be putting in a baby roost for them this weekend near the light - they keep flying up to the buckets and feeder. The blue bucket ("pop" door) isn't open yet... No nest boxes yet here either - one of the next projects - soon - as the two black girls are about to start laying. We've started deep litter method with this coop - will be adding both leaves and pine straw again this weekend. Our property is predominantly sand - no way to remove it, so we are amending it thru the DLM.







pic is the other 2 coops. They will need to have more tarping done before winter hits here or I might have problems. But that will come - probably over Thanksgiving. They have since had quite a number of loads of pine straw and leaves added to them and need many more... They are sitting on top of hay/horse manure that happened when we didn't clean this section of the horse pen for 8 months. We shifted the horse pen, and put the hoop coops here. The bucket pop doors are now open and both the boys and the girls have learned to go out/roam and return at dark. Sometimes we find a boy in with the girls - I move them back... They are doing a GREAT job of aerating the horse manure NOT in their coops - YAAAYYYYY! Got 2" of rain today. They didn't drown and are quite happy.



The pen before "blue horse pen" moved over and chicken coops put on top of manure hay where Jazzy/Taff are standing in pic. You can see the blue horse pen in pic above - behind the coops.
That hay "rack" is a cattle panel wrapped around a round bale of hay. Jazzy has reached over (doesn't work so well w/ full size horses) and bent/folded up the panel. I removed these (had 2) and used these panels to hold the trash/bonfire burn pit instead.



We also have 2 sheds built from wood pallets and cattle panels (on our new property). The pallets are all the same size - 4'x4'. Then I hooped the panels for the ceiling/roofs. These aren't for the chickens right now, so no wire on them. But they'd work well for chickens. This was the first one we built when the ponies in temporary, leased quarters on 3 acres of land between where we moved from until we closed/moved into the new property. Worked great for 60+ days! Easy to put up and easy to take down and held up during snow, ice, rain and WIND. Cozy, too.



This is the first shed that we put together on the new property. It's about 10' wide x 8' deep. Reusing panels that have been moved/hauled long distances 2x means we now get some "funny" shapes... Right now it's connected by hay string. Plan on bolting it together eventually. Maybe before the pallets disintegrate...




This shed is 12' wide x 8' deep. It will be expanded this winter to 16' wide x 12' deep. It is also temporarily tied w/ haystring to hold it together. when we expand it, we will use bolts on the pallets and fencing staples on the panels to hold them in place. This area is much more level than the boys' area is.



And then we use them in the "traditional" way - for fencing in our ponies. Ponies are notoriously hard on this fencing - but it's so much easier to put up and also to replace if a pony "gets stupid"...

 

[paintedChix]

The two hoop coops that I have the boys and girls in? They are also only 8'x8' (2 cattle panels). There are 12 girls (didn't get exact hatches - O didn't know) - ranging in age from June 24th thru August 19th (I got them in September - all were feathered in) in the one (need to do at least 3 nest boxes - will probably do 4) and there are 9 boys in the other one. They are all 1/2 Brahma Xs - the boys are getting HUGE (like mini turkeys!!) and we plan on processing all of them by Christmas. There are currently 2 roosts in each coop - about 6 girls on each in theirs & some of the boys still sleep on the ground... Since they are free ranging now, and I don't really expect to have to close them up permanently, I feel that they should easily be able to live in that size coop. Don't know that that would work if I was in a colder climate or where they needed to be closed in for several days at time. I think, especially with their sizes, that we would see problems with fighting (not just the boys)/pecking orders, boredom and habits there of.

I was going to point out something else, but now can't remember what it was. AH - once the boys are processed, I could split the girls and do 1/2 in each coop. Then if they have to be locked up for any reason, shouldn't be a problem so much.

***Edited to add*** - The coop with the chicks in it has the two big Australorp girls (just now 5 months old), 2 lite Brahmas, 1 GLW & 5 wheaton/blue wheaton Ameraucana. None of the chicks are sexed and I still am not certain what I actually have - hoping to have at least 1 roo w/ the Lite Brahmas and 1 Ameraucana roo..

Here are pics of our other "short coops/pens". These were here when we moved in - I am taking the wire off the tops of these pens this winter and will be using cattle panel to build roofs for them. Will probably do them interlocked rather than separate hoops, but haven't made up my mind on that one yet. layering the natural bedding into them is fantastic! NO smell, and the birds are happier - good thing as I'm not really in a position to free range the birds every day.




What we started with when we moved in. The "hut" needs to have ventilation opened up on the bottom - about 1 foot off the ground. And I need to figure out how to get the window on the back of it opened. That SHOULD be enough ventilation to allow us to have the 7 hens & 1 roo that are in the pen/coop now closed up in the coop if absolutely necessary, The pen is about 16'x16'. These chickens aren't pets and if our 4 oldest (hatched Feb 2011) have quit laying by next spring, they may go in the freezer.






***Edited to add - too funny!! I didn't know about DLM at the time we were cleaning this area up. I could have put what we were cleaning up/out into each of the pens I knew I was putting chickens in and just continued it all summer. SIGH. Well, that's ok, I know now what to do!

 

[ShrekDawg]

   - your family will learn quickly that that cute new coop from TSC isn't going to hold that many chickens. 

Too bad, the cattle panels are only $20 at TSC and 2 would build an 8x8 coop tall enough to stand in that WOULD be big enough. You'd still need a run, but the coop would be exponentially larger than what they are buying for less than 1/2 the cost - you'd still need to purchase chicken wire/HC, hardware and framing lumber.  I built two hoop coops for less than $200 - prices will vary depending on what you need to use for hardware and extras.  That cost didn't include my waterers or feeders - some of which I had, some of which I'm making now (much less cost than the purchased ones!).  The nesting boxes could be built later so that they are outside or if inside you could add a 3rd hoop.

A run can be made either using the cattle panel hoops, a solid framed run or one of the "chunnels" someone else uses - they are quite nice!

Let us know how it goes!  I have to admit, chicken owning is a learning process and a fun one.  At least your whole family IS involved - that is AWESOME.  Do you live in a town situation or out in the country?

Hope you and yours had a great Thanksgiving.

Figured I'd answer now as we stopped at the bank and gas station so got the time.

Anyway, yeah, I hope they'll see but they also don't really know anything so may say it's fine. They're only just past 4 1/2 weeks though (5 weeks on Monday) so plenty of room to grow out and by then maybe we will be able to build or buy something else.

It's a kit though so have to put it together which I've heard kits can be a huge pain so it really is a shame. But better than what they have now.

If I did it I would probably build the run with cattle panels too and just make it one big thing or with a door between.

I'll definitely let you know though and yeah, I've learned so much already. I suppose it really is great, and lucky, they're now willing to help though. Before they weren't. We live in a town and one street of houses behind us and condos in front. We're set back in the woods. We have almost 3 acres but a lot of it is wooded.

And thank you, you too! We went to my uncle's which was fun.

 

[Mahlzeit]

Wow that was a lot to get through and unfortunately I am just tagging along to get the answer to your first question. I am looking into making a hoop coop or two and was wondering which one of those panels works best.

 

[ShrekDawg]

Wow that was a lot to get through and unfortunately I am just tagging along to get the answer to your first question. I am looking into making a hoop coop or two and was wondering which one of those panels works best.

Yeah, I got of got onto a tangent... I tend to do that. xD sorry about that!!! But it's alright!! I love for people to be able to tag along and also benefit from things! And actually, in fact, I originally made this post only to ask the first question anyways but then, again, tangent. hah sorry about that!!!

 

[BBQJOE]

I have no ideas to offer, but I thank you for the use of paragraphs, or I might have replied, tl;dr.

 

[ShrekDawg]

I have no ideas to offer, but I thank you for the use of paragraphs, or I might have replied, tl;dr.

Yeah, I tend to talk too much hahI just always go to say one thing but then think of a bunch of other things to say too and yeah xD but I do always try to use paragraphs cause that's just weird not to haha

 

[ImBabyHuey]

Chicken runs/coops would firstly need to be predator safe. I would use hardware cloth attached to a framework of your choosing. Check out hoop coops in Coops section for great ideas And answers to many of your questions.