Diatomaceous earth--- Really that harmless?????

[chickengeorgeto]

I use DE on my tomato plants and it kills the tomato worm. All that is left is the skeleton....

Interesting, but I do think that what you saw was a Tomato Horn Worm that had been parasitized by Braconid Wasp Larva. Once the wasps young have finished eating the caterpillar's muscle tissues they burrow out through the THW skin and spin a small cocoon in which to complete their metamorphous. After the wasp young mature and leave, their cocoons fall off and all that is left of the THW is an empty brown husk, hence the skeleton of the THW that you saw.

If Diatomaceous Earth is actually an insecticide, for it to work on THW it would be necessary to pile DE up to the top of your tomato plants because in order to work DE must come into contact with the target insect, the Tomato Horn Worm in this instance. Also because the THW is the caterpillar phase of the Sphinx Moth, the female moth lays her eggs high up in the tomato plant so that when her eggs hatch, the growing caterpillars will have a ready source of sweet, tender, succulent, and nutritious tomato vine on which to feed. If you spot a THW in your garden and it has tiny rice like capsules on its body, do not disturb it because if it is not already dead the damage the Braconid wasp larva have inflicted has caused the THW to stop feeding. You want every one of these tiny non stinging wasps to grow up to target more THWs.

http://www.organicgardening.com/learn-and-grow/how-to-control-hornworms

 

[kschicks2013]

To each their own. I use a mask and I feel safe. I understand your concerns. As far as asbestos they don't carry that you have to special order it. Ha ha. Have a fantastic day and evening.

 

[freshH20]

Adding my 2 cents worth on DE.

We have used it all my life...to help with fleas and to worm adult dogs.

WARNING!! Do NOT use around infant animals...it will kill them and it is not pretty. Yes, personal experience here in the worst way! It does to their lungs and intestines exactly what it does to the legs and bodies of the bugs...they need to be off the momma to use.

ALSO, in older, sick, young persons in the house...don't let them breath it in, like in the event you are spreading and they are around. It works great (in the house, as a border, in the coop, etc), but people with lung issues, it can hurt.

wonderful day to all

Kim

Kim, you may have gotten ahold of some DE that is either laced with arsenic (which most of the non-food grade mines are) or one that is crystaline silica (generally used for industrial purposes). ALL of the sites I have been to warn that NOT ALL DE IS THE SAME, and goes on to explain the risks with using DE that is NOT classified as organic food grade. I have used and sold Perma Guard products for over 12 years. In 40 years, Perma Guard products have been givin to infant animals, dusted on crops, consumed by all types of animals and humans of all ages with NO reported issues. To make such a post here, you are doing MORE than giving your 2 cents, you are fear mongering. If you had read the previous 900 messages, you would understand that if you use the food grade DE that is MEANT to be used on animals, you would not have lost your animals. It has no ill effects on the lungs or intestines. I'm sorry to sound harsh, but you are mixing apples with oranges, and you are very misinformed. The post is discussing the effects of organic, food-grade DE NOT DE meant for industrial use.

 

[freshH20]

Chewing tobacco is also completely organic and besides powered chewing tobacco aka snuff is a powerful pesticide as well as a proven cariogenic. The jury however is still out on DE's effectiveness as a pesticide but its value as a cariogenic is proven beyond a doubt.

Besides lung cancer Diatomaceous Earth causes silicosis and other lung illnesses. A more accurate name for Diatomaceous Earth is "Silicone Dioxide." But that name hides some of the health risks of Silicone Dioxide by implying that it is just dirt, as harmless as mothers' milk. Nothing is further from the truth.

Here is a research paper from the Center for Disease Control dealing with the cancer risks for workers in the Silicone Dioxide mining industry. It appears that you may use Silicone Dioxide (DE) in a careless manner for up to 10 years before your lung cancer risks rise by 50% or more.
http://www.cdc.gov/niosh/awards/hamilton/pdfs/crystal-silica.pdf

This risk is in addition to the risk of falling ill from silicosis that Silicone Dioxide imposes on men and women involved in the open pit mining of Diatomaceous Earth.

I will go out on a limb here and predict that in the future you will see TV ads from law firms urging you (or your love ones) to apply for benefits due because of fatal lung cancer and silicosis induced illness, just like the ads you currently see targeting the families for asbestos induced mesothelioma victims.

This is an ignorant post. Do MORE research, especially organic, food grade, amorphous silica. There are many dangerous sources of diatomaceous earth, but Perma Guard DE is not one of them. http://www.freshwaterorganics.com

 

[freshH20]

I did a simple search. My criteria for credible sources make so further investigation is needed. There is a great noteable lack of agreement among sources and the page 12 example above indicates that as well. Actual assays for toxicity are what is needed which are likely out there but and they should be used to back up your assertions.

The toxicity is not the issue... it is the abrasion. DE is a mechanical kill, not chemical.

 

[freshH20]

Yeah.... but.... DE is especially 'sharp', that's part of how it kills insects-it cutx their exoskeleton, you don't want even a bit in your lungs.

Actually, you should be using amorphous DE, which passes through the lungs without any damage.

 

[aart]

Quote: Sorry anything that can kill an insect from mechanically scoring it's exoskeleton is not going into my lungs.....

.......and I find your history of postings here very interesting, do you work for a company that mines/processes DE.

 

[freshH20]

If Diatomaceous Earth is actually an insecticide, for it to work on THW it would be necessary to pile DE up to the top of your tomato plants

With logic like this, one might think it necessary to flood your home in order to wash your face. FYI, it is possible to dust the entire plant and then any bug that crawls on it or lands on it will come in contact with the DE...
Not only is it possible, but that is the only way that a logical person would do it.

 

[freshH20]

Sorry anything that can kill an insect from mechanically scoring it's exoskeleton is not going into my lungs.....

.......and I find your history of postings here very interesting, do you work for a company that mines/processes DE.

I'm glad you find them interesting. There is a tremendous amount of disinformation and misunderstanding regarding DE. I do not work for a company that mines DE, but I have used it and sold it for nearly 15 years, as I have stated in previous posts. I have done more research on DE than most, which is why most of those selling it online have copied information from my site and posted it as their own. Regarding your statement, there are two types of DE, crystaline and amorphous. Amorphous does not harm your lungs. Supposedly, the worst claimed effects on the lungs is a claim that prolonged breathing of the dust can cause a condition known as dusty lung. However, in 15 years of handling it, warehousing it, selling it all over the world, and talking to folks who have used it for nearly 40 years, I have never heard of a single incident of dusty lung - even from a second hand source. Further, I don't personally know anyone who has even worn a dust mask when working with it (although I am not trying to dissuade anyone from doing that). The DE settles very quickly, and if one is simply conscious of not inhaling DE, it is not much on an issue. If one is not using DE for fear of having their lungs sliced... I would call that a very irrational fear. Hundreds of thousands of people use it daily with no protective gear, and there a no reports of lung damage in 40 years. I'd place the risk somewhere between getting hit by lighting twice and getting hit by a space ship.

 

[aart]

Quote: My house was hit by lightening twice while it was being built.

Is packaged DE labeled as amorphous or crystaline...if not, how does one tell?