New Call Duck Colors... what do you think?

[KateBeauchemin]

My mother- & Sister-in-law have been mixing their calls for a few years now.

We have gotten a neat lilac color female and also black bibbed males from their stock of blue fawn, chocolate (bibbed) whites (& crested), and butterscotch. Using only these breeds we have gotten multiple different colors.

Today I purchased 2 lilac drakes, 1 blue bibbed (hen), 1 black bibbed (drake) and 2 mystery quackers.
One is lilac splash, and one is black splashed, I believe they are both hens.

I was wondering does anyone have the same colors?

I have used my http://kippenjungle.nl/kruisingEend.html call duck color calculator, and think the lilac splash may be know as lavendar splash. This is the only time the word/color lavendar comes into play. They have listed lilac and lavendar separate colors:

Future Breeding plan:

Are the splashes considered lavender? Someone with these colors I'd appreciate any help...

Thanks in advance.

Black bibbed drake in front, blue bibbed right back, black splash back left.

Lavender hen left, 2 lilac drakes on right

They just got done with a bath, so they're a little wet. LOL

 

[KateBeauchemin]

I am still reading and awaiting information/pics of lavender/lilac/splash colors.

Dogwood acres email doesn't work either. They have the lilac CALLS on their site with pictures. They also have a silver which looks alot like my little "lavendar splash hen." They call them call ducks because the originate from 2 call duck parents. I'll contact them outside the internet.

I am not discouraged by any of the comments, i don't have to explain myself or really feel the need to. I merely asked if anyone had seen these colors before.

I posted some pics of my blue fawn color aracauna hens, that i purchased thinking they may have a 'proper name for the color' or ideas of breeding these to my Blue Copper maran, and getting beautiful blue colored olive eggers. I got 2 comments out of maybe 20, that had to deal with my color question. I know how forums work, and if the two answers dealt with my question the other 18 not dealing with my question really had no relavence to the topic, It's a free country and people can say what they like.

I don't have control over what people say or do, only how I react to them. Respect. I could have very easily take the offensive and just tell everyone to keep their comments to themselves unless it has to deal with my color question. But i've seen it on other forums where 8 pages has gone by and the question has not been answered and alot of bickering has arose. Pointless to be offensive myself. Having to shift through meaningless pages for information i asked for.

But for this continually perpetuating post, I will for, YOUR ALL sake, define my every motive of my FUTURE breeding plan, like i said in my originial post. This is MY topic. If you want to talk about my "so-called call ducks and what you don't like about them and who's got the best..." PRESS, Start New Topic And post there. "People who think Kate's Ducks are crap" I'm sure you will get alot of people that agree with you. And frankly, I prolly wouldn't read it as it STILL DOESN"T pertain to the color information i asked for.

Now some history for those who'd like to have the knowledge of what i'm trying to do:
When my family first starting buying calls ducks, we started out with a few COLORS. We found that when we had chocolate calls and blue fawn calls together, we found out there were 4 different colored babies which we compared to GERMAN research. The 2 non-common colors were: 25% blue self bibbed males (meaning any blues out of these PURE bred call parents ARE boys). 25% Lilac bibbed FEMALES, no males will be lilac in this generation. 25% Black self bibbed MALE, 25% chocolate self bibbed Female. These are the research results of a GERMAN study, I am taking their STUDY, and making my own research based on their genetics calculator to see if it is true. And it HELD 100% true in our breeding for our 2nd generation. All chocolates were females, the one black we got was male. And the only lilac we got was female. We had no Blues this batch.

Now starting with the 2nd generation with this new lilac color, breeding back to a chocolate drake maybe for all the nahsayers, to a HIGH QUALITY championship winning A+ type chocolate call drake, then percentage of lilac goes up to 50% ratio when mated back with chocolate drake of pure breeding. 50% chocolate bibbed, 50% lilac bibbed, and only those colors. No more black or blue bibbed in the next generation. And both chocolate and lilac can be male or female. The lilac male I have, i don't know what his history is but according to my hundreds of hours of research there are a few possbilities, but i won't explain them on here. Since I'm starting with a new color of CALLS from our stock, not the ones i just picked up. I never said i wasn't open to bring in SQ stock to make perfect SQ calls with perfect confirmation and with a new color, if i was out for major bucks i would do that, i am not, maybe i should be. I'm performing some research to see if what they said was true instead saying it must be true because it was proven by someone else. Calls + Calls still equals Calls, not chickens.

The black bibbed, through more research will only produce a blue or black when mated to any other color we have, which is not part of what i want to do. (but we did get alot of black babies this year from 1 black bibbed drake) But Kuddos to the black bibbed calls at 2010 nationals for being mutts from SQ parents or grand parents or great-grand parents and one of them was white, the SCANDEL of it all! Sorry having too much fun and I have a migraine now

Now with the 3rd generation and continuing migraine: Taking the lilac hen (Whose genetic make up is this M+M+ Li+Li+ Ee+ bl+bl+ C+C+ B+B+ r+r+ d- Bu+-, for those of you keeping track)
If I were to breed it back to a chocolate now... 100% chocolate offspring. Weird, oh yes I know. So dead end for me. We'd have to bring in new stock non-related with the same background and breeding to get the Lilac male to breed to lilac hen.

But if i had another Lilac drake from a new 2nd generation NON-RELATED (which NOW I think I do, as to MY COLOR LILAC HEN):
25% chocolate self bibbed H&D (hens and drakes) possible. 25% lavender (splash) self bibbed H&D (NO PICS ANYHERE!!!), 50% Lilac self bibbed H&D. The lilac is still 50% but the chocolate gene is down to 25%. And what to do with lavender???????? (i'm not that far with their reseach because all the thinking makes my head hurt, BUT I WILL!)

Now I can take one of the Lilac self bibbed CALL hens (all show quality by this point, mind you), or lavendar splash and mix with what... to get this to breed true lilac call ducks.

Do you see where I am at now? If noone has ever seen a lavendar splash or black splash (where is that from?), or posted a picture about them, or done some continual breeding, then how can they say they don't exist? Or under a different color name? Or came from BEI??? Or are alien calls transplanted here to mess with me!!! LOL
(Motrin kicking now, yhewwww)

Well no one said they don't exist, no one has said nothing relevant to what splash looks like. I have 2 mystery hens that in chicken color terms are deemed SPLASH. Are mine Splash? I guess I will have to wait for someone who has the 3rd generation of breeding, or get there myself this spring.

Meanwhile, back at the ranch, NOW you all know my diabolical scheme to make 100& bred true lilac call ducks, that WILL BE SHOW QUALITY in 10 years and I'll blow you all away with their beauty!!!

And if you support me I may give you a break on the hatching eggs. Just leave your name and number after the beep. BEEEP!

It's been entertaining. Now can we all play nice now???? (I'll get a pic of my sis' lilac (what we are calling it and Germany is calling it)) and compare it to the drake I have for fun. The little call ducks in my incubator are telling me to JUST WAIT LADY until we come out, cause I might be surprised.

Peace, blessings, and Motrin to you all.

 

[KateBeauchemin]

I know they are not typey like everyone likes, but they are a start. I'm not offended everyone has their opinions, i'm playing with them for the love of calls. I think the entire breeding down smaller thing is highly overrated myself (my opinion), making the calls harder and harder to hatch. I talked to a breeder in Arkansas who says he pips for them and hand hatches every single egg he gets. I'm not all about that.

Frosty Flake belongs to my sister-in-law, who is selling the eggs on ebay, ironically enough.

We are trying to find more around us.

We prolly have 60 ducks between us all, LOL! We just love them, we're not out to win any shows. Friends' kids showed them at county fair, placed 2nd, after blue sweds ducks. Judge said they are "not tiny, but nice all the same." We are content with that.

Again, does anyone know anything about the color, my main question...?????

 

[duckluck]

I disagree with the "conformation first, color last" argument. Good type is a rarity in rare colors because they are exactly that: rare. You can have great parents and when outcrossed for rare colors, you will still have a lot of "platypus" looking ducks show up in the offspring, probably all of them. Look at the NCBA website at some of the Nationals pictures and see how many non-standard colors you see in the pictures that have great type. If people let that scare them off from bringing their ducks out to shows, we wouldn't have much to be looking at there. We see good type in droves in whites and grays because they are commonly owned and have been worked with and refined for generations. You can work on refining them down for type later, first you have to have the ducks to do it with! Calls were bred for by humans, they don't exist in nature as a breed.

I agree that they need more refinement, but this looks like an exciting new color and I hope you won't let anyone detract from your enthusiasm for working with them. We would not have any of the colorful Calls today if someone did not develop them, and Calls of any color or stripe are sought after. I don't see you having any problem selling them. People want cute, colorful little ducks, period.

 

[Special Agent Husak]

Kate, I can completely understand why you are done posting here. There is a reason why I have been a member here for years and even the "old" BYC to which I posted a lot. and yet so few posts. I have found that here, it is better to be a ghost than to post. You will find some really honestly good people here and then you will turn up the ones that want nothing more than to tear you down, beat you up, and show everyone how much more they know, and how much better they are than you. I beg you, please, please, PLEASE...don't let those kinds of people discourage you from what your doing.

I have had some "judges" tell me my Calls are the best they've seen. I've had others laugh at them and not place them at all. It's just one persons opinion of your ducks. I don't believe you asked anyone their opinion of the quality of your ducks, just a question of color. I personally can't answer your question as to the "color" of your ducks. I just don't have enough knowledge in that area. I will freely admit that. Just so you know, when some people have trouble admitting that they "just don't know the answer" to a question. They try to divert that fact away from themselves by puffing themselves up elsewhere.

Sorry you've had a bad experience Kate, but I totally understand.
I too, like your pic's of your ducks, I see excellent potential there. Remember, we may not be poultry experts, but we ARE poultry breeders and without us, those poor judges would have nothing to judge.

So sad

 

[Special Agent Husak]

Again, does anyone know anything about the color, my main question...?????

I believe this was her main question. Kate did not post here asking, "Hey yall whatcha think of great new Call ducks?"

She simply asked a question about color. Lavender or Lilac, which is it and what is the difference? I think pretty much anyone who knows anything about poultry knows that introducing a new, unrecognized color into the breed takes a lot of time, work and dedication. Perfection is never achieved but is strived for.

Even the sugar-coated opinions were not the answers she was looking for, but rather a comment that was meant to encourage her enthusiasm for this project and promote her interest in owning and breeding poultry.

As far as NYREDS being a judge, knock your socks off. My only concern as far as that goes is that I whole-heartedly hope that he/she is NOT a youth judge. I don't know how old Kate is, but comments like that can destroy a persons confidence in themselves. The number one rule in judging any animal to an exhibitors face is that you "condem than compliment". For example: "Your horses wither is not as prominant as it should be, although he has an ideal croup and tail set."

Sorry but I don't see the point in "Calls" that don't resemble Calls at all.

This comment coming from a "judge" is a little scary to me, as any person who is said to be knowledgable about poultry should know that any specific line on birds did not start out as a perfect example of the breed. It takes a lot of time and work.

There is an established standard for what constitutes a Call Duck & the birds pictured here aren't even close.

In my opinion (lol) what is placing well at todays shows bares little resemblence to what the original standard used to be. We americans tend to take something good and warp it until it is the "extreme". It cracks me up when folks say that something is "just a mutt". Then it becomes a "hybrid' and then finally develops into its own breed. Don't they realize EVERYTHING started out as a mutt?
It's rediculous for people to think that new colors just miraculously appear in perfect show quality ducks. WTH?​

 

[easttxchick]

Nice explanation(not that you should have had to give it) for your "diabolical plan".

I, for one, can't WAIT to see your new ducklings!

Looks to me like maybe you've done just a TAD of research, there. Wow, who would have thunk it?

Lavendar/Lilac Beauchemin Calls? Has a nice ring to it...

 

[learycow]

HI we just saw you post and was wanting to know if you have any lavender calls, or the butterscotch, or any color other than the normal colors. we are starting out and the breeding chart for some dna charts are way confusing if you can help that would be great we live out on the eastern plains thanks

I breed lilacs

 

[seymojo536]

This is just my opinion, take it for what ever it is worth to you.

Their heads are all wrong, their bills much too long/big and their legs too long.
They just look quite large and not compact for calls. I would concentrate on type and conformation to the standard first, get the color right last.

Like I said, just my opinion.

 

[4-H chicken mom]

They colors are very pretty but if you plan on selling them I agree with seymojo536 you will need to work on the confirmation as well if you want to make some good money.