it is used in some breeds/colors that is hard to get both sexes the correct color... they will breed a male line and a female line and rarely if ever cross them... almost strictly used for show stock...
Old and Rare Breeds
- Thread starter saladin
- Start date
Are you talking about breeding back to the same family of birds
such as crossing brothers to sisters for several generations?
Wouldn't cause genetics issues with an eventual lack of
genetic diversity? Something that seems to be a problem in
some breeds here in the US on some breeds like Lakenvelders.
Just not enough breeders.
Muffin14143
Songster
It does sound a little risky, but I guess if trying to preserve a rare breed it's worth it.
Double mating:
Some color patterns are stable, but some are not. These latter tend to have a spectrum of light to dark, picture a barred bird that seems very light as if the dark bars were small and the light bars were larger; on the other side of the spectrum there would be dar birds where the dark bars were larger than the light bars. Other patterns are like this as well, where one aspect of the pattern might be very pronounced or hardly visible depending on the bird. Maybe the aspect of the pattern is well defined, or maybe it is all smutty, meaning blurred in to the other colors.
In these pattterns, to get well marked birds in a given sex, it is usually necessary to use one mate that is well marked and one that is not. For example, a well marked female, if paired with a well marked male, might produce poorly marked females, but a well marked female, paired with an overly dark male, will produce well marked pullets. However, the males will not approach the Standard. Thus, in order to get males that approach the Standard, the opposite polarity is required. Thus, one use two different breeding programs to produce weither well-marked pullets or cockerels. Lamon and Slocum's work The Mating and Breeding of Poultry does a pretty good job of explaining which patterns need to be double mated and which are fine with single or Standard mating, meaning a mating where both parents approach the Standard.
Some color patterns are stable, but some are not. These latter tend to have a spectrum of light to dark, picture a barred bird that seems very light as if the dark bars were small and the light bars were larger; on the other side of the spectrum there would be dar birds where the dark bars were larger than the light bars. Other patterns are like this as well, where one aspect of the pattern might be very pronounced or hardly visible depending on the bird. Maybe the aspect of the pattern is well defined, or maybe it is all smutty, meaning blurred in to the other colors.
In these pattterns, to get well marked birds in a given sex, it is usually necessary to use one mate that is well marked and one that is not. For example, a well marked female, if paired with a well marked male, might produce poorly marked females, but a well marked female, paired with an overly dark male, will produce well marked pullets. However, the males will not approach the Standard. Thus, in order to get males that approach the Standard, the opposite polarity is required. Thus, one use two different breeding programs to produce weither well-marked pullets or cockerels. Lamon and Slocum's work The Mating and Breeding of Poultry does a pretty good job of explaining which patterns need to be double mated and which are fine with single or Standard mating, meaning a mating where both parents approach the Standard.
interesting, I have never heard of this before. Thank you for the information
Double mating has been used for many, many years and while I would rather not do it......it works. I can't think of anything "risky" about it and this phrase "lacking genetic diversity" is overused and usually an excuse for poor breeding. I am not saying this is the case all the time because there is some lack of genetic diversity in a few breeds...........just not as many as some folks like to talk about. The term is overused IMO.
Walt
Walt
WHAT IS DOUBLE MATING? The A.B.C. of Breeding Poultry for Exhibition, Egg-Production and Table Purposes
1919
Double-mating means the mating of two pens, one to produce
exhibition cockerels and the other exhibition pullets. This process
of breeding has done much to spoil many good old breeds, for
few little men have accommodation sufficient to keep two pens.
Many poultry fanciers give this double-mating question some
hard knocks, but we have only the Club Standards to blame. When
a new breed comes into being, the first desire of the faddists is to
draw up a standard that is hard to breed to. They contend that
it is better to have a breed that is difficult to obtain high-class
specimens of, than where we can easily breed winners. As things
are at present, double-mating is necessary in many breeds, and
I leave it at that.
In the case of laced varieties, such as the beautiful Gold and
Silver Laced Wyandottes, we have perforce to adopt the double mating
principles. If we mated the Palace winning Cock to the
Palace winning Pullet we should breed birds that were of very
inferior quality. By fitting up a cockerel-breeding pen and a pullet breeding
pen our chances are excellent. In the cockerel-breeding
pen of any variety the male will be a tip-top show specimen and
his mates females that are not show birds, but merely breeders
likely to throw high-class cockerels when mated to the exhibition
male. The pullets from this mating will, of course, be " duds
and not fit for show purposes. The females in the pullet-breeding
pen will all be first-class exhibition birds and the male not a show
bird, but a breeder most likely to breed tip-top exhibition pullets.
The cockerels from this mating will be " duds " and unfit for the
show bench. The whole modus operandi can be thinned down to
this :The cockerel-breeding male must possess all the necessary
characteristics to breed exhibition cockerels, whilst the pullet breeding
male must boast of those characteristics that will go to
breed exhibition pullets. The system is not so complicated as it
would appear at first sight and is interesting to follow out, but there
must, of course, be many " wasters " in the progeny whether
male or female respectively. In many cases fanciers are satisfied
with breeding one sex only and winning honors with same. They
specialize in pullets or cockerels, keeping the pullet-breeders or
cockerel-breeders only as the case may be. This naturally does
not entail so much work as would be necessary if the two sorts
were bred.
Here is another good artical on Dbl Mating
http://books.google.com/books?id=7x...wBg#v=onepage&q=double mating poultry&f=false
Chris
Double-mating means the mating of two pens, one to produce
exhibition cockerels and the other exhibition pullets. This process
of breeding has done much to spoil many good old breeds, for
few little men have accommodation sufficient to keep two pens.
Many poultry fanciers give this double-mating question some
hard knocks, but we have only the Club Standards to blame. When
a new breed comes into being, the first desire of the faddists is to
draw up a standard that is hard to breed to. They contend that
it is better to have a breed that is difficult to obtain high-class
specimens of, than where we can easily breed winners. As things
are at present, double-mating is necessary in many breeds, and
I leave it at that.
In the case of laced varieties, such as the beautiful Gold and
Silver Laced Wyandottes, we have perforce to adopt the double mating
principles. If we mated the Palace winning Cock to the
Palace winning Pullet we should breed birds that were of very
inferior quality. By fitting up a cockerel-breeding pen and a pullet breeding
pen our chances are excellent. In the cockerel-breeding
pen of any variety the male will be a tip-top show specimen and
his mates females that are not show birds, but merely breeders
likely to throw high-class cockerels when mated to the exhibition
male. The pullets from this mating will, of course, be " duds
and not fit for show purposes. The females in the pullet-breeding
pen will all be first-class exhibition birds and the male not a show
bird, but a breeder most likely to breed tip-top exhibition pullets.
The cockerels from this mating will be " duds " and unfit for the
show bench. The whole modus operandi can be thinned down to
this :The cockerel-breeding male must possess all the necessary
characteristics to breed exhibition cockerels, whilst the pullet breeding
male must boast of those characteristics that will go to
breed exhibition pullets. The system is not so complicated as it
would appear at first sight and is interesting to follow out, but there
must, of course, be many " wasters " in the progeny whether
male or female respectively. In many cases fanciers are satisfied
with breeding one sex only and winning honors with same. They
specialize in pullets or cockerels, keeping the pullet-breeders or
cockerel-breeders only as the case may be. This naturally does
not entail so much work as would be necessary if the two sorts
were bred.
Here is another good artical on Dbl Mating
http://books.google.com/books?id=7x...wBg#v=onepage&q=double mating poultry&f=false
Chris
Thanks for that article Chris. I will copy it into my files and maybe on another day try to understand it a little better. I didn't really feel brain-dead today until I read that. Good to know for my laced breed though... I think.
- Aug 22, 2010
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Not always patterned birds either. I show black Old English Game Bantams and you'll get your better females from a male that has a bigger broader breast and less extravagant of a tail. Where you would use a standard fitting male to breed for nice cockerels. I don't have male line Blacks but I know there are many if not most varieties of OEGB that hebe male and female lines. You could do the same in breeds like cubalayas. If you never breed from females with black smut up front, the males will get more and more red in the breast. And having a little white in breeding hens wings will improve the color of the hackles. But these females used for breeding would not do well at a show but will throw nice males. This is a common practice and doesn't affect the fertility.
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I am finally connected with a gentleman in Ontario who has Belgium Meschel Malines and am ordering eggs! I am so excited. Here are two sites he shared with me that you might find interesting.
The first one is about the breed in general and the second is from his site.
http://www.aviculture-europe.nl/nummers/06E01A07.pdf
http://www.bulbsoffire.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=81&Itemid=109
The first one is about the breed in general and the second is from his site.
http://www.aviculture-europe.nl/nummers/06E01A07.pdf
http://www.bulbsoffire.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=81&Itemid=109
Last edited:
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