Old and Rare Breeds

[saladin]

Quote:
No not even three and yes they are all related those are the three main breeders. There is one strain from the initial importations (not sure who) they are all related. Then there was the importation of one or two British birds that provided us with a new influx of blood. Dick, Ron, and Peter have all used the imported British blood so their birds are more "refreshed" then other birds. But yes they are all very closely related! We need new blood in this country or we need to be very very very careful about not inbreeding to much.

Henry

This can be a problem but doesn't have to be at all; as a matter of fact, it can be a great benefit. Allow me to explain,

Years ago cockers discovered that they could take their line of Games and give some to a friend who would then breed the birds on different ground and make different selections than they themselves would make. After 3 or 4 generations they could then get a bird from this related line and the resulting offspring would manifest something like heterosis. Of course, I'm sure that Ptere Merlin already knows this.

 

[saladin]

Henry,

I forgot to ask: Do you or the club keep up with Favs in France? What is their status there?

 

[hcammack]

Quote:
No not even three and yes they are all related those are the three main breeders. There is one strain from the initial importations (not sure who) they are all related. Then there was the importation of one or two British birds that provided us with a new influx of blood. Dick, Ron, and Peter have all used the imported British blood so their birds are more "refreshed" then other birds. But yes they are all very closely related! We need new blood in this country or we need to be very very very careful about not inbreeding to much.

Henry

This can be a problem but doesn't have to be at all; as a matter of fact, it can be a great benefit. Allow me to explain,

Years ago cockers discovered that they could take their line of Games and give some to a friend who would then breed the birds on different ground and make different selections than they themselves would make. After 3 or 4 generations they could then get a bird from this related line and the resulting offspring would manifest something like heterosis. Of course, I'm sure that Ptere Merlin already knows this.

Peter is truly a master breeder! So is Dick. They are a great resource. We will see how it turns out not sure I actually need new blood as those three breeders still have theirs. We also have some exciting new colors. Check out the LF blues and blacks that have won the continental class the the blue bonnet classic. Go to the Faverolles thread their are some pictures there.

I haven't been in contact with the French club I am in regular contact with the British Faverolles and also in contact with Faverolles breeders in Belgium. The French birds are less refined they are lighter birds ands and have a different type then ours and the british birds. There is French type faverolles and German which is a darker bird like we have.

Henry

 

[saladin]

Excellent photos.

One of the arguements that is always raised is about the Standard of the country of Origin and our on Standard. It gets to the point of a dog chasing his own tail. You'll hear it over and over again; if you haven't already encountered it.

My thoughts are to follow the Standard of the country of Origin as closely as possible; realizing that the birds we have may not even contain the genetic material to conform to such a Standard. Thus, we have our own and it sometimes reads differently. I have also found that sometimes our Standard actually reflects the older more true to type bird than what presently is found in the country of Origin.

 

[HallFamilyFarm]

Quote:
None of ours do, compared to western civilization, which is then newer than.... etc. We forget what a new country we are.

Unless one is native american, obviously.

My forbears raised poultry in this country before it was a country! They raised Turkeys! Must have been the wild Eastern Turkey, as the Cherokees were in the area of the Carolinas, Georgia and East Tennessee. Guess that is one reason I like Turkeys!

 

[saladin]

Quote:
None of ours do, compared to western civilization, which is then newer than.... etc. We forget what a new country we are.

Unless one is native american, obviously.

My forbears raised poultry in this country before it was a country! They raised Turkeys! Must have been the wild Eastern Turkey, as the Cherokees were in the area of the Carolinas, Georgia and East Tennessee. Guess that is one reason I like Turkeys!

Some of mine were here too, don't know if they raise turkeys, but they for sure raised Games!

 

[saladin]

Jim,

Seriously, do you have research that shows the Cherokee or other Eastern Woodland Indians raised Turkeys? I am not aware of any.

I know the Aztecs first domesticated the Turkey and they were also raised by the Indians of the Southwest, but I was not aware any evidence had been found linking them with the other Indian groups of North America.

 

[hcammack]

Quote:
I think that may be true for Faverolles a long time ago the two types were separated and used to be both in france but now there is only light in france. Its a complex thing the Faverolles were really just farm duel purpose birds and were really inconsistent. Our standard reflects both the German and French type.

I have to do more research into this! Maybe Peter will know.

Henry

 

[saladin]

One of the things I've tried to do through the years is to collect Standards: not just old ones of ours, but those from other countries as well. Where there is no Standard for a particular breed I try to get information from the Country of Origin so that I can compile my own. I did this with my Malgache. It helps my breeder selection. I also try to publish the Standard I've written somewhere to get critiques.

It is all a very helpful process.

 

[hcammack]

Quote:
Got any Faverolles standards anywhere?