Please help identify color of these call ducklings

[Asiakg]

Hello everyone!
I have already asked this on a bunch of groups on FB but so far no one has been able to help me identify these ducklings color, or even their mother’s color.
So to start, last year I obtained a bunch of call ducks. I was very inexperienced with the breed and did not have them separated by color at first. So I hatched one of the eggs laid by one of my ducks (unknown which duck laid the egg, and unknown which drake sired it)
The duckling appeared to be a chocolate mallard, but it developed angel wing. At this point I had done a lot more research and decided to rehome her for free to a pet home as I did not want to use a duck with angel wing for breeding.
I just saw the hen for the first time in over a year, and she’s definitely not a chocolate mallard like I had assumed. My trout colored Dutch hookbills are similar in color but this hen has spots while the hookbills do not. I asked a very experienced breeder her opinion on the hens color, and she showed me pictures of her miniature golden cascade ducks, which are identical in color to this hen. So I guess the first part of the mystery is finding out what is this color called in call ducks?

I had my favorite chocolate drake pass away recently and I desperately wanted another one. The same lady I gave my hen to, I had also given the brother to my chocolate drake. She said he had paired up with the weird colored hen and said they two of them were mating and laying eggs and asked if I wanted to try and hatch the eggs to see if I could get another chocolate. Since chocolates are very rare in my area and breeders will not sell calls till the fall, I saw it as my only chance to get some chocolates, so I went ahead and hatched the eggs. The resulting ducklings from this breeding do appear almost chocolate but there’s definitely a blue undertone to their down, in a certain light. They have markings like a mallard but are much darker, and they’re definitely not blue fawns. I was hoping someone might be able to pinpoint their color, so I can try to figure out if I can breed them to chocolate to get chocolate back! Thank you very much in advance! I have attached photos of the weird hen and also of the babies

https://imgur.com/HKWLE1h

https://imgur.com/MhlNuQx

https://imgur.com/XXMIuDm

 

[casportpony]

@WVduckchick, @shawluvsbirds, @Pyxis, @Conan, do any of you know what color these are?

 

[WVduckchick]

The duckling is blue fawn. The adult look appleyard to me

 

[Asiakg]

The duckling is blue fawn. The adult look appleyard to me
View attachment 2643296View attachment 2643297View attachment 2643295

I just typed the colors into the eend calculator. So dad Is chocolate and mom is silver apple yard, it says that combo will produce chocolate bibbed or black bibbed. I know it isn’t completely accurate with call duck colors though so probably not much Help lol. She did look similar to what apple yard look like as ducklings when she was herself a duckling so that’s definitely the closest match I’ve gotten.

I initially thought they may be blue fawns but they’re way more brown than blue, and my friend with a call duck business down the road from me brought over some blue fawns to compare, and the color was way different. The blue fawns have no brown coloring to them at all. And all of the blue fawns she showed me were darker, like a slate blue kind of color. Is there a large variance in blue fawn ducklings? Are some brown rather than blue? If so that would make sense! I just felt that these were a ‘warm’ tone whereas other blue fawns seem to be more of a ‘cool‘ tone. Thank you for your reply!

 

[Pyxis]

So dad Is chocolate and mom is silver apple yard, it says that combo will produce chocolate bibbed or black bibbed.

Dad was solid chocolate? Not chocolate mallard aka Nutmeg?

If he was solid chocolate, he had to be carrying a copy of mallard base as well because that's the only way to produce a duckling like that.

I initially thought they may be blue fawns but they’re way more brown than blue, and my friend with a call duck business down the road from me brought over some blue fawns to compare, and the color was way different. The blue fawns have no brown coloring to them at all.

There's a chance that the duckling could be lilac mallard - which is blue fawn plus chocolate.

 

[Asiakg]

Dad was solid chocolate? Not chocolate mallard aka Nutmeg?

If he was solid chocolate, he had to be carrying a copy of mallard base as well because that's the only way to produce a duckling like that.



There's a chance that the duckling could be lilac mallard - which is blue fawn plus chocolate.

Yes, he was a solid chocolate drake that I had purchased from Matt Kuecker, hopefully it’s ok for me to list his name, but he is pretty well known in the call duck world and is someone with a good reputation, so I figured it’s relevant in regards to the Chocolate drakes background

I had also considered that they may be lilac mallard. But as far as I can find, it looks like lilac may be sex linked to females, and at least one of the ducklings is a male, do you know if there is any truth to that? Or is it only in some cases where lilac is sex linked?

Thank You for your help! I sincerely appreciate it!

 

[Pyxis]

Yes, he was a solid chocolate drake that I had purchased from Matt Kuecker, hopefully it’s ok for me to list his name, but he is pretty well known in the call duck world and is someone with a good reputation, so I figured it’s relevant in regards to the Chocolate drakes background

I had also considered that they may be lilac mallard. But as far as I can find, it looks like lilac may be sex linked to females, and at least one of the ducklings is a male, do you know if there is any truth to that? Or is it only in some cases where lilac is sex linked?

Thank You for your help! I sincerely appreciate it!

It's sex linked as long as the mother isn't also chocolate. If she's got a brown tone to her, then she might be. If she is, then both and male and female ducklings could hatch lilac mallard.

 

[Asiakg]

It's sex linked as long as the mother isn't also chocolate. If she's got a brown tone to her, then she might be. If she is, then both and male and female ducklings could hatch lilac mallard.

You know what, I think you are right! I think you’re the closest anyone has come to identifying the color of the ducklings! That’s very exciting, the moms color is up in the air, no one really knows exactly what her color is considered. She is probably some type of harlequin, but whenever I type chocolate drake x any harlequin pattern in the eend calculator, I get lilac back as my result In most cases! So that would make perfect sense, I had thought lilac was always sex linked so I hadn’t seriously considered it as an option. Thank you so much! Once they start to get in their juvie feathers hopefully I’ll know for sure, but you’ve given me a much better starting point than I’d originally had!
If they are lilac I will be happy with that, as I can breed lilac to chocolate and get back chocolate I believe

 

[WVduckchick]

Outside on my phone, I do see more of the brown coloring in the duckling that I thought was blue fawn. @Pyxis is great with genetics!

@Asiakg if you haven’t seen her article yet, you might like it. https://www.backyardchickens.com/articles/mallard-derived-duck-color-genetics-basics.74277/

 

[Asiakg]

Outside on my phone, I do see more of the brown coloring in the duckling that I thought was blue fawn. @Pyxis is great with genetics!

@Asiakg if you haven’t seen her article yet, you might like it. https://www.backyardchickens.com/articles/mallard-derived-duck-color-genetics-basics.74277/

You know something crazy? I just read and bookmarked this article the other day when I was searching for info on duck color genetics! It’s the reason I joined this website small world! How cool that the article that brought me to this website is written by someone who responded to my first post she is definitely very smart with genetics, and I have learned a ton from reading her post, although I’ll have to keep referring back to it for awhile till I’ve Read it enough times to remember it