Topic of the Week - Dogs and Chickens

[Glennlarch]

Our dog is an English Springer Spaniel. We got her as puppy from a well known good breeder. We have always taken the time and effort to obedience train our dogs. We lived in the city till 6 years ago when we moved to our acreage and started our chicken adventures. Our first birds were 7 hens and a rooster about 1 yr old. Springers are bred as upland game bird dogs which concerned me. The first time the birds free ranged I had the dog on a lead, and spent the time training here that the birds were part of our " pack" or family and they were not toys or food. Once I was confident she would listen to me and not let her instincts take over it was off leash training. Now I can leave her out there with the birds and not worry at all. The birds are part of the family. I believe the time it takes to train your dog is well worth it. It pays off many times over.

 

[Blooie]

We had a much beloved English Setter who trained herself to respect the chickens. She was an active hunting dog, and a superb pointer and flusher. I've posted about this before on other threads. When we got our first chicks, she shared the "office" space with their brooder and paid no attention to them.


Our first batch of chicks....Molly didn't even notice they were in there. Oh,and as an aside, I no longer raise chicks in the house under a heat lamp..ever!


The first day the run was completed...oh, she went crazy....as if she'd never seen them before. Of course they were running around, squawking and flapping in their new larger space. At first she stood stock still, then her leg came up and she pointed them until she quivered. Then she paced the full length of the run and tried jumping on it. It held firm. So she tried digging under it and hit the hardware cloth apron. She broke and bloodied a toenail for her trouble. She yelped, she limped away, looking back at the chickens like it was all their fault, and never ever bothered them again, not even when they were free ranging. Do I recommend this as a way to train a dog to be safe around chickens? Nope! I ain't that stupid. But for us that was all it took and she was 100% reliable around them from that day on. It wasn't unusual to see her and few chickens getting a drink of water, side by side, out of the pan in the yard when they were free ranging. I guess it's true that sometimes the lessons dogs learn themselves are the ones that stick, whether it's a good habit or a bad one. If there's a savory roast on the counter and Dog steals it, it's an instant reward. He's learned to look for food on the counter and you're going to have to train that out of him. Barking at the mailman or the garbage truck? Well, they went away, didn't they? So Dog has learned that he's a protector. We had a Golden Retriever, Captain, who made the mistake as a puppy of lifting his leg against a tree at the top of a large hill. He lost his balance and tumbled down the hill. Until the day he died, that dog never lifted his leg again...he'd squat to pee because he decided it was safer! We are blessed that the lesson Molly learned was that chickens can hurt!


I loved this shot.....Mathilda was so NOT afraid of Molly that she'd run right under her legs. Look at the expression on Molly's face!


Laying in the run with a group of chicks behind her, waiting for me to finish up my chores. Totally relaxed, and the chicks didn't mind her a bit.


I call this shot "Bookends". This is Tank, the Light Brahma, and Miss Molly relaxing in the yard.

I'm afraid that not all dogs can ever be trusted around the chickens. That, in addition to our travel schedule, is one of the reasons we didn't get another dog after Molly died last fall. If you have a well trained dog who looks at the chickens as a treasure to be protected, know it for the value that it is! If you have one that you just don't trust 100% around the chickens, never let your guard down. And if you have one that you know will go after those birds every chance it gets, for the love of Mike keep them separated with solid barriers that cannot be breached.

RIP, Miss Molly.....we all miss you like crazy and so do your feathered friends!

 

[tfalls3]

I have a 75lb pittbull he showed interest in them while they were in the brooder, so I let him sniff and watch them (we had a screen on top) to his hearts content. It was love and first sight. We just told him to be easy they are babies, he knows both easy and baby as a command to be gentle around them. He's obsessed with them and their poop, the only time he charged through them was when they were killing a black snake and he loves chasing snakes, he just sent them running and complaining. He has to be outside with me when we put them up at night, if not he makes me open the side door and show him they are safe. He's a former bait dog rescued from a fighting ring so we were unsure at first with his animal reactions but he's turned out to love anything smaller than him. We just got hit by hurricane Matthew and he found and brought me 3 baby squirrel and has now claimed them as his.
Our new puppy is a pit/ English pointer mix and it was a challenge. Her favorite pastime was pouncing by the run and sending them scattering, she was scolded but didn't stop. Once they were big enough to free range we kept her on a leash and she didn't seem to care about them. After a week of doing this I thought ok let's try this off leash, she was good for about a minute and then bolted at them, she has a buzz collar (vibrating not shock) and we buzzed her and she stopped a few feet from them, after the startle of her charge the hens turned and attacked her. She's now very cautious around them when they are out of the run, she will stay on the other side of the yard and sneak by them, or hide behind us if they turn their attention to her. I don't trust her 100% to be alone, but I have no worries if she's supervised. I swear they can smell her fear and will follow her around just for fun.
I think it has made a huge difference by letting the dogs observe them as chicks in the brooder so the curiosity is taken back

 

[tmarsh83]

A dog that doesn't respect chickens are part of home has nothing to do with breed, it's a poorly trained dog.

We have a golden retriever and Rottweiler. One bird bred the other with a prey drive. Both have been trained to understand no, and conditioned to the birds to understand they are part of home.

I have no issues with our dogs and they are outside together for hours on end. Neither bothers the other. When the chickens are near the edge of the yard, the rott will occasionally herd them back towards a more central location.

As a puppy, on our potty walks we would walk by the run, anything other than a passing glance got him a verbal reprimand. Once he could walk by without issue I would feed the chickens scratch while he sat quietly next to me.

By six months he was oblivious to the birds.

 

[AmieD]

I have 5 dogs. Four don't give the chickens any problems, but our youngest dog has killed 2 chickens. The first chicken went under the fence and she tossed it and killed it. The second time, she got into their area and killed one. No blood or bites, she again shook it to death. I really think she intends to play. We are installing an inground fence with a receiver collar to train her to stay out of their area.

 

[Little Fuzzy]

Let my one yr old Great Dane watch my chicks in the brooder , let her smell them while holding them in my hand. I raised my chicks in the garage, so she learned they were part of the family pack. Now she watches over them while they free range. She drives off our local Hawk. She loves our chickies!

 

[Little Fuzzy]

Great post, love that training technique.

 

[tmelber]

I'm pulling from about 15 years of experience working with dogs (at a vet clinic and as a trainer and behaviorist- but focused on pet dogs rather than working dogs):

-How do you/did you train your dog(s) not to kill or mess with your chickens?
You could do this a few ways- if you have a young puppy, socializing them to chickens will be your best bet. With older dogs, introduce them slowly. Some dogs have a stronger prey drive than others (e.g. herding dogs). Be especially cautious when introducing them to chickens.


- What is the best/most effective way to deal with/retrain a dog that killed birds already? (No cruel or inappropriate suggestions, please… Let's keep this thread friendly and informative)

Number one: You can manage the situation (meaning don't allow the dog access to chickens in the future). Number two: Retraining in this case would mean counterconditioning. You would also want to teach a strong "leave it" and a strong "come". Learn about canine body language, sit with your dog at a distance from your chickens and reward her when she's ignoring the chickens and calm. Then do it again, but slightly closer. You can look for an animal behaviorist for help (this is not the same as a dog trainer- review www.apdt.com for help finding someone that is actually qualified- unfortunately there are no restrictions on who can say they're a dog trainer).


- Are some dog breeds more or less prone to be a problem around the flock?
Any breed with a strong prey drive will be more likely to be problematic with poultry. That said, dogs are still individuals and they conform to breed standards to varying degrees. Most dogs do not come from breeders with long histories and therefore may not behaviorally conform to those standards. If you're wanting a purebred look for AKC breeders and ask questions about the traits they breed in/out of their dogs. But, also realize that genetics will only take you so far. Social environment is also really important (hence, socialize young puppies to chickens if you can).

Your best bet is to adopt a puppy (preferably from a shelter- so many dogs are euthanized because there just aren't enough homes for them) between 8-12 weeks old, and introduce them to your chickens, making sure it's a positive experience for the puppy.

 

[chickens really]

What a great thread to start...
First two pictures are of my Maremma LGD. His name is Finn...No real training was needed...He loves his birds. He totally stays and protects the flock..The last two pictures are of my Golden Retriever/Aussie cross. Her name is Bindi.
Bindi runs off anything that comes into my yard, Coyotes, Fox and other dogs...She did take a bit of training to get to where we are today..A month ago I really did not trust her alone with the birds...My training methods were easy. First she had to know basic commands, sit, stay, lay down and come..She is fantastic.. I taught a key word for leave it from the age of 8 weeks.I use the word OFF...She is now on payroll and I have no concerns for my Birds with my two fantastic Chicken and Duck protectors....


Cheers!.

 

[centrarchid]

I have had free-range dogs around free-range chickens for a long time. Most of the dogs functioned as guardians even though that was not intended purpose (most were hounds with a few farm / companion dogs). During pup phase (until about 2 years of age) they would almost at least periodically be a threat to poultry. The hunting dogs were not free-range during that interval and generally were not until several years of age when past prime hunting age. Companion / farm dogs were typically very well trained.

The concern of being LGD is hot dogs and spam when it comes to poultry. LGD's where developed for working with larger groups of mobile sheep and goats where dogs territory was defined by location of herd. Guarding poultry is based on location of flock that occupies a fixed geographic location and where birds, unless certain types of geese, are not unlined to flock tight or otherwise facilitate a dog's defense efforts. The ideal poultry guardian will defend territory, patrol throughout range, and respond to poultry alarm calls. The any breed of dog can kill a predator and some more qualified than LGD's depending on setting and predator.

In most settings, at least dogs are confined by some sort of perimeter fence. Thus excluding larger predators requiring larger dogs. Then other characteristics of dogs can be taken into account. Most poultry keepers are also in locations where wild predators are coyotes or smaller. For that smaller percentage that does not have the easier life, then LGD's can be pressed into service as poultry guardian dogs (PGD's).

If serious about this, then two or more dogs needed. Fox can otherwise beat all but fastest dogs and will often use your fence against dog.

Dogs are handily the most expensive part of keeping chickens free-range for me. It is mostly feed. Even LGD's that are often reported here and elsewhere are cheap to maintain are not. Where I work where several LGD's have been kept protecting multiple herds of sheep and goats, feed bills are proportional to size of dogs. They appear to have low metabolisms during the day but at night they more than make up for it.

My rule of thumb is dogs need to be at least 50% larger than the largest predator they must fight. Keep them up on shots. You dog will get bit a lot of kill a sick predator only to become infected itself. Not everyone keeps up on vet side.