Turkeys, Goats, Donkey...Flock Guardians?

[Liz Birdlover]

I'd like to gain some of your wisdom regarding Flock Guardians, as so many on this site share similar predator dilemmas.

How do you deal with predators? I currently have predator proof pens for my chickens. I'd like to free range more often. I ended up with 2 pairs of Guineas right when migratory hawk season kicked in here, so they're in predator proof pen & coop, too, but I want to let them out during the days when it's safer here, usually April unless Spring comes early. Right now, they only free range when I am outside with them & I have to chase hawks off every hour. There are many different types of hawks, & constant foxes as well as neighbor's cats here...also roaming groundhogs, skunks & opossums, occasionally raccoons, but they usually pass through.

Some neighbors feed the foxes. They actually lay down by me when I'm at my firepit, they're so tame. They've never gone after my flock or the few huge wild rabbits here...weird right? The biggest hassle are hawks & neighbor's cats.

My husband wants to fence the 2 acre property, & electric fence about 1 acre of it for the flock, but we all know if a critter wants in bad enough, they'll just go over or under fencing. Guineas will make a loud racket but they're jyst as vulnerable & i already know they'll stray over to neighbor's trees & yards (yeah, cant wait to hear complaints abit them but we've got deer & deer ticks, Hobo, Recluse & Black Widow spiders & major lone star & brown ticks, so Guineas got a purpose. Hubby said we can get a Maine Coon cat male to chase off the other cats, but I don't know about that. I also have Homing Pigeons & flying white ones does help pay the bills. If Maine Coon developed a taste for pigeon lunch, that would Not work. He says they're a large cat, probably won't go for pigeons...yeah, I don't know, all cats share similar behaviors & hunting, stalking methods.

So...some friends have goats, donkeys & turkeys. I love visiting & caring for them when they go on vacation. I've actually seen their turkeys chase off hawks & cats. Their goats & donkeys have chased off cats & foxes.

So what I'm trying to do is determine what would be the best flock guardian here, for Chickens, Guineas and Pigeons. Obviously, dogs have been suggested. I'm open to a pair of dogs, but prefer a livestock guardian that lives in the barn, closer to who is being guarded.

Could a pair of turkeys work?
Bourbons, Bronze or Royal Palm? I'm open to suggestions on breed. Just definitely Not ones bred for slaughter that get too heavy too fast, my pair would be guardians but also pets...kinda like my chickens are, they lay eggs, then when older, no longer laying, just join the Guineas on insect patrol, my flock will live ripe old ages.

How about goats or a donkey? I could get 2 goats, but only 1 donkey here, a smaller type.

Another friend suggested a pair of Sebastopol geese, she raises them, but I don't have a pond here for ducks & geese. I know she uses kiddie pools. I'd rather have a deep pond for geese, though, doesn't seem fair not to...but after seeing this video, I'm considering 2 Geese.

Please share any opinions, experiences, stories & suggestions, I value your insight greatly!

Thank you, Liz

 

[ExoticPetOwner]

You'll need to predator proof the area. Here are some ways to predator proof the coop and surrounding area the animals roam:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1. Use hardware cloth on the sides and bottom to prevent animals from getting loose and to get predators to not attack through the openings.
2. Raise the coop. This helps rats to not burrow under and to prevent predators from being able to dig under and into the animals home.
3. Use a solid floor on the coop/run. This also helps with predators not being able to dig under.
4. Cover the chicken's run so flight predators cannot enter.
5. If you have any windows in the coop, secure them where predators cannot enter.
6. Don't leave food/water out or discard animal remains around your house so it doesn't attract pests and predators. Fertilizer is fine to use but just know that keeping it around will attract pests. Those pests do feed your chickens though. Make sure it doesn't get out of hand so something like fly strike doesn't happen.
7. Lock the animals up before it's dark out. Night time is a perfect time most predators come out.
8. Acquire a livestock guardian dog. LSGD's are the best choice for keeping predators away. Although geese are loud, turkeys are big, and roosters can pick a fight, they're not as reliable as a larger breed of dog is. Sebastopol geese are a more expensive/show breed and still aren't as reliable.
9. Set up traps around the animals to trap any unwanted predators. * Make sure your animals are not able to get into any of these traps. Do not use pesticides or poison! *
10. Keep cameras around you animals to see what goes on at night and what might've attacked/killed your animals if that ever happens.

Here are some articles to read for more info! Do more research and ask more questions other than what I give you here! Going onto BackYard Chicken's Facebook page and asking questions there will help you more!
1. Predator Proofing #1
2. Predator Proofing #2
3. Predator Proofing #3
4. Predator Proofing #4

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Cat's aren't a huge threat to poultry unless you have chicks. The chicks could be kept inside until fully feathered which helps solve that problem. Groundhogs are safe to keep around. They don't really bother the poultry. A groundhog is around my house and just eats grass with them. Skunks are definitely a problem when it comes to eating eggs and spraying. There has been some instances where they have attacked chickens before, so keep them away. Possums will only attack if they feel threatened, other than that, they'll probably just go after any eggs that are around. Raccoons are known to climb fences and get through chicken houses ( They can get onto the roof. Make sure that is secure. Metal roofs are a great way to ensure they won't get in. ) and attack poultry. They're not good to keep around chickens. Lots of people recommend keeping crows around. They do eat the eggs but as long as you collect them every morning, they're good for keeping hawks away. Getting a cat like a Maincoon won't help. They do stand their ground, ( trust me, I had one. We adopted him when he was 15, but he sadly passed away 2 weeks ago, 2 weeks before he turned 16, his gotcha day. ) but a cat like that would probably not benefit with all that hair and the ticks around. People do recommend them because of their size, but sticking to the regular barn cats is better, in my opinion. Cats are a good addition for keeping rodents away, but they are predators so they probably will attack the birds if they're not kept away. Goats and Donkeys are actually great for keeping some predators away so as long as you have the space, money, time, and heart attitude, they're a great choice!
It is very odd that the foxes will hang around. Especially if people are feeding the foxes, there's less of a chance for them to go an attack your livestock, however, it doesn't stop them from doing it and only attracts them closer to your animals.


* I do suggest asking more questions and even going on @BYC's Facebook page to ask more questions. You'll get more answers on there and get some extra tips!

 

[JacinLarkwell]

Turkeys will absolutely not make guardian animals. Best case scenario, they ignore the birds. Worst case scenario, they decide the birds must sie for harmony to be achieved

 

[Geena]

I would not mix turkeys and chickens. I love my turkeys but they are relentless when they get a bug up their bum about something or someone.

 

[Liz Birdlover]

You'll need to predator proof the area. Here are some ways to predator proof the coop and surrounding area the animals roam:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1. Use hardware cloth on the sides and bottom to prevent animals from getting loose and to get predators to not attack through the openings.
2. Raise the coop. This helps rats to not burrow under and to prevent predators from being able to dig under and into the animals home.
3. Use a solid floor on the coop/run. This also helps with predators not being able to dig under.
4. Cover the chicken's run so flight predators cannot enter.
5. If you have any windows in the coop, secure them where predators cannot enter.
6. Don't leave food/water out or discard animal remains around your house so it doesn't attract pests and predators. Fertilizer is fine to use but just know that keeping it around will attract pests. Those pests do feed your chickens though. Make sure it doesn't get out of hand so something like fly strike doesn't happen.
7. Lock the animals up before it's dark out. Night time is a perfect time most predators come out.
8. Acquire a livestock guardian dog. LSGD's are the best choice for keeping predators away. Although geese are loud, turkeys are big, and roosters can pick a fight, they're not as reliable as a larger breed of dog is. Sebastopol geese are a more expensive/show breed and still aren't as reliable.
9. Set up traps around the animals to trap any unwanted predators. * Make sure your animals are not able to get into any of these traps. Do not use pesticides or poison! *
10. Keep cameras around you animals to see what goes on at night and what might've attacked/killed your animals if that ever happens.

Here are some articles to read for more info! Do more research and ask more questions other than what I give you here! Going onto BackYard Chicken's Facebook page and asking questions there will help you more!
1. Predator Proofing #1
2. Predator Proofing #2
3. Predator Proofing #3
4. Predator Proofing #4

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Cat's aren't a huge threat to poultry unless you have chicks. The chicks could be kept inside until fully feathered which helps solve that problem. Groundhogs are safe to keep around. They don't really bother the poultry. A groundhog is around my house and just eats grass with them. Skunks are definitely a problem when it comes to eating eggs and spraying. There has been some instances where they have attacked chickens before, so keep them away. Possums will only attack if they feel threatened, other than that, they'll probably just go after any eggs that are around. Raccoons are known to climb fences and get through chicken houses ( They can get onto the roof. Make sure that is secure. Metal roofs are a great way to ensure they won't get in. ) and attack poultry. They're not good to keep around chickens. Lots of people recommend keeping crows around. They do eat the eggs but as long as you collect them every morning, they're good for keeping hawks away. Getting a cat like a Maincoon won't help. They do stand their ground, ( trust me, I had one. We adopted him when he was 15, but he sadly passed away 2 weeks ago, 2 weeks before he turned 16, his gotcha day. ) but a cat like that would probably not benefit with all that hair and the ticks around. People do recommend them because of their size, but sticking to the regular barn cats is better, in my opinion. Cats are a good addition for keeping rodents away, but they are predators so they probably will attack the birds if they're not kept away. Goats and Donkeys are actually great for keeping some predators away so as long as you have the space, money, time, and heart attitude, they're a great choice!
It is very odd that the foxes will hang around. Especially if people are feeding the foxes, there's less of a chance for them to go an attack your livestock, however, it doesn't stop them from doing it and only attracts them closer to your animals.


* I do suggest asking more questions and even going on @BYC's Facebook page to ask more questions. You'll get more answers on there and get some extra tips!

Thank you! I've got 8 out of 10 of those suggestions going on already, thank goodness...just not #8 dog & not #10 cameras...yet anyway.
I've been really fortunate and haven't lost a single bird at this point, but when my Pigeons fly, I worry about the hawks, and now I'm going to be worried about the Guineas, because I've never had Guineas before. I already know they're going to be roaming around eating bugs, they fly and love to be up high, and right next door is a neighbor's lot, full of trees...that's where the hawks land and hang out to watch my flock. I know there is risk to having any animals in our lives, I'm just trying to address as many as possible, take necessary precautions and make preparations. I'm worried about the Guineas most.

 

[Liz Birdlover]

Pens, Chickens, Pigeons & Guineas









Local "visitors"

 

[GravityWaves]

Some neighbors feed the foxes. They actually lay down by me when I'm at my firepit, they're so tame. They've never gone after my flock or the few huge wild rabbits here...

I would personally be very wary of the foxes getting that close to me. Several years ago my cousin got attacked in her backyard by a red fox that tested positive for rabies and she had to get the shots and everything. Also, I don't think it's a very good idea that your neighbors are feeding the foxes.

Aside from that, good luck in finding a flock guardian. I can't free range at all without being willing to take high losses so my chickens stay in the coop and secure run.

 

[Liz Birdlover]

I would personally be very wary of the foxes getting that close to me. Several years ago my cousin got attacked in her backyard by a red fox that tested positive for rabies and she had to get the shots and everything. Also, I don't think it's a very good idea that your neighbors are feeding the foxes.

Aside from that, good luck in finding a flock guardian. I can't free range at all without being willing to take high losses so my chickens stay in the coop and secure run.

When I moved here Jan. 2006, I was going through chemo again, it was rough, so I was home a lot. I'd look outside that 1st winter here, I'd see the wild critters & I learned their routines. The flock of 20 buzzards held their morning meetings in the front, 2 leaders standing on posts, the rest on the ground, all spreading wings to greet the morning sun's warmth. The deer followed their typical path, from one batch of trees to the next, grazing the corn field on the way. The male fox would trot by on his path, same route daily, same times like clockwork, 10am, 1pm, 4pm or just before dusk. Sometimes he'd stop, sniffing around, or sit down & look around.
There were times all buzzards, deer & fox could've all been in 1 lovely photo...if only I'd had the darn camera ready.

There was a spot in my back yard by the cornfield, the grass was always cushy there, Foxy would lay down & bask in the sunshine, often his mate joined him, sometimes they'd nap. Whenever I went out the back door, he'd sit up & watch me, like a dog expecting a treat. I later found out that the people who lived here previously, sometimes put food out there. I guess the foxes never forgot. There are tons of wild berries there as well, so I only pick the high ones in summer, leaving the low ones for them. When the foxes have their kits, every Spring, they roll around playing on that patch of grass. When I was ill, it was like watching the nature Discover channel outside my window. I always loved wildlife, enjoyed sketching, as where I lived as a teen was also full of farmland, protected woods & wildlife.

Anyway, when a person is fighting cancer repeatedly, the prognosis isn't so great, therefore, the appreciation of the little things in life can become very dear. I've been blessed to have close encounters, always calm & peaceful, with Deer, Crows, Buzzards, Gold Finches, Robins, Turkeys, Geese, Ducks, Hawks, Eagles, occasional Falcons, Raccoons, Opossums, Turtles, Toads, Snakes, Lizards, even swam with a Sea Turtle, a mama Whale & her calf & Hammerheads...not that I went looking for any of them, they just showed up & we hung out a bit...just glad they weren't hungry or thinking of me as an appetizer. It's interesting, when you talk to them, they look you in the eye, tilt their head & seem to listen...perhaps they're so used to jackasses screaming at them, that kind words or just my tone of voice may calm them.

The foxes, when they raise their kits, sometimes there are 2 or 3 adult pairs with their kits, about 20 to 24, who gather for Spring family reunions, on that nice patch of grass. They hang for about a week, then they venture off, going to their own territories I guess. There's always 1 pair that will stay here, they have 2 dens at all times, in the 80 acre corn field next to my 2 acre parcel. I can't say if it's the same pair all these years, or their descendants taking over, but they are quite at home & I believe they think they are dogs, or perhaps learned by watching dogs.

I know the dangers of rabies, but fortunately that's been very rare in this neck of the woods.
There's been a sort of synergy here, I can't explain it, I know it may not last & could change at any given moment as wildlife is wild after all, but I cherish it while it lasts. The consistent wildlife residents here have their routines, but the migratory hawks & falcons, they are the ones to fear, because they show up hungry & fierce, not caring about routines or balance. It's pretty crazy to see several different types of hawks show up in 1 day, and the resident hawks & crows go nuts screeching & dive bombing them. That's why I'm worried about letting the Guineas free range & every April when Pigeon flying season begins. I realize there's not much I can do about aerial attacks, but often dive bombing happens at the most vulnerable time & spot...the Guinea or Pigeon trying to land & scoot inside the loft to safety, that's where 99% of attacks occur. Me running, yelling & waving a broom has distracted & saved many pigeons, but I can't be here 24/7.

I just saw a Great Pyrenees mix puppy yesterday at the store...what a soft precious puppy. It's been awhile since I had dogs, breaks your heart when they pass. I'm thinking a dog might be joining my family. Doing the research now. Well, I'm pretty sure my sweetheart would rather fence the property than build coop #4 .

Look at this little guy!

 

[Florida Bullfrog]

I have a heritage turkey hen that paralyzed a hawk.

 

[Liz Birdlover]

I have a heritage turkey hen that paralyzed a hawk.

Wow, brave turkey