100 percent failure

[Gypsy07]

Quote:
In that scenario, I'd say the 50% humidity on days 1-18 was the culprit, not the 70% humidity on days 18-21.

If an egg has lost the correct amount of liquid by day 18, it is not going to regain that liquid in lockdown even at humidities of 80%+. And if an egg has lost the correct amount of liquid, the chick will not drown. It isn't high lockdown humidity that causes chicks to drown, it is an overall too-high humidity right from day 1. The chick cannot drown until it internally pips and starts breathing inside the air sac, but it's the early humidity that causes the drowning.

no I use 50% all the way through, i have never had drowned chicks, but as I've responded before, my incubator in in a shed that is heated to 50 degrees, by a kerosene bullet heater, so 50% works, its a dry place, there are to many variables to say its the 50% humidity that caused the problem, or even the 70%

Well, I thought it would be clear I wasn't referring to you. You're not having problems. What you are doing obviously works great for you.

You said 'most who are having problems...', the discussion was specifically about drowned chicks, and that was what I was referring to. People with drowned chicks. Nobody else. If a person incubated at 50%, went up to 70% for lockdown, and the chick drowned, I would be almost certain it was caused by the 50% on days 1-18 and not the 70% on days 18-21.

 

[Ridgerunner]

Yeah, common sense. We all have different conditions. Different things work for different ones of us. Just because one method works for one person in one set of conditions does not mean that works for all of us under different conditions. To me, that thinking defies common sense. Some people fail at the exact same humidities that work great for other people. Humidity seems to be the perfect example that there is usually no one right anwer for all of us on any issue. The right answer varies depending on our individual conditions.

I suggest you determine a humidity to use for incubation and a humidity for lockdown and go with that. Be consistent. Keep records. If you want, you can weigh them during incubation to determine moisture loss or candle them and see how much the air sac has shrunk. You can find information on what those rates should be, but remember to do enough to get an average, don't depend on analyzing only one egg. Or you can analyze your eggs after hatch and make adjustments based on that. Or do both. These links may help with your incubation analysis.

Mississippi State Incubation Troubleshooting
http://www.poultry.msstate.edu/extension/pdf/troubleshooting_incubation.pdf

Florida Incubation Troubleshooting
http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/aa204

 

[halo]

This was the best lesson I ever had about humidity and hatching. I incubate in my Genesis 1588 and hatch in an Brinsea Eco. For the first 18 days, I dont even hardly worry about humidity. If I think about it, Ill had some water every 4th or 5th day. Then on day 18, I transfer the eggs to the Eco, fill the water trays up, and hatch.

For one of my batches, I must have mis counted days, or forgot to mark they days on the calendar. I woke up one morning to a racket in my Genesis. I looked in and there were a bunch of chicks scrambling around, jumping around, broken egg shells still in the turner, which was still plugged in. So that taught me that too much humidity is far worse than not enough. Once chicks start hatching, the humidity automatically goes up just because of the wet chicks.

After I found all those chicks in the Genesis, I threw away my hygrometers. Never used them again.

 

[aveca]

Quote:
See my other post to you.... You poor thing. You didn't do it on purpose!!!!

I live in a dry climate and I keep my humidity at 10-35% on days 1-18 (I say 10% because quite often it dips before I get home from work), and I raise it to 50-55% during lockdown.

I just read an srticle that somone posted in here just a few days ago from 2 different unversities..the one article said if using a still air incubator you want to run your temps just a little higher up to 102 101 being best..it also said embryos that develop well and delay in hatch or die at the end are a sign that temps were too low ..afan model keeps more regular underneath the egg...still air temps below the eggs is around 80 while top is reading 99..it was interesting article..

 

[kandooshe]

Quote:
In the last spring I made a % 100 failure with 120 eggs none of them hatched !!!
my problem was with the temperature ,,

Good luck

 

[bakerjw]

This makes me appreciate my broody hens even more than before. I'm trying to work a hatch with a POS incubator and I;ve got a feeling that I'll get a 100% failure out of it as well.

 

[Buck Creek Chickens]

Quote:
that is what I was refering to, with me as an example, how can you say that the 50% was the problem, high humidty on the finaly day can cause trouble too

 

[Gypsy07]

Quote:
that is what I was refering to, with me as an example, how can you say that the 50% was the problem, high humidty on the finaly day can cause trouble too

But I specifically said I wasn't using you as an example. Why would I? If you're having successful hatches at 50% throughout, then obviously 50% throughout is a perfectly suitable humidity, FOR YOU. It may or may not be suitable for other people, depending on what eggs they are incubating, whether they were shipped, what incubator they are using, the temperature of the room the bator is in, whether it is air conditioned, what their local weather conditions are, what their altitude is, and probably another dozen or so things I haven't thought of. Likewise, the person who mentioned earlier that they run their hatches at 50% and 70% has obviously found THEIR ideal humidity, and so this doesn't refer to them either.

I was specifically talking about the situation you had mentioned, where people are running at 50% then 70% and having drowned chicks. In that scenario ONLY, I said that I would be almost certain that the problem would be caused by the 50% during days 1-18, not the 70% during days 18-21, and I did give my reasons. If an egg loses enough moisture, the chick will not drown. If an egg loses enough moisture during days 1-18, it will not regain any of it during days 18-21, even in very high humidity. So if the humidity has been correct (i.e. such that the egg has lost the correct amount of moisture) days 1-18, the chick will not drown due to very high lockdown humidity. I would almost like to say it's just not possible, but that would be incorrect. It most likely IS possible, after all, given a large enough test number, almost anything is possible. But it is not probable. Overly high humidity specifically in lockdown can no doubt cause other problems, but drowning isn't one of them.

A chick cannot drown before it internally pips, as it isn't trying to breathe air until that point. So while a chick will never drown during days 1-18, that doesn't mean that the humidity during days 1-18 is not what eventually causes the chick to drown. It's just a delayed reaction. The chick drowns while in lockdown, so people's first thought tends to be that because the chick drowned after they raised the humidity, that's what is to blame for the drowning. But it's not.

 

[jvls1942]

time and again I see people refer to local conditions..

the conditions inside the incubator are what could be referred to as a mini climate.. If your guages inside the incubator read, 99.5F and 40% humidity, it does not matter what the conditions in the room or outside are.. Inside your incubator, the conditions are still 99,5F and 40% humidity..

when you light an oven to bake a cake, it is 375F inside the oven, it does not matter if it is -20F or +90F in the kitchen, the oven is still 375F........same principle in the incubator..

the drowning comes from a gradual build-up of water within the shell .. It is not going to happen in the last 3 days of incubation..

I even wonder how many casualties are blamed on drowning while it was something else that actually killed the chick..

for instance,, magic marker used to mark on the egg.. there are some inks in some markers that are very toxic.. when the chick pips through membrane inside, the first breath of air will kill it..

 

[Buck Creek Chickens]

Quote:
that is what I was refering to, with me as an example, how can you say that the 50% was the problem, high humidty on the finaly day can cause trouble too

But I specifically said I wasn't using you as an example. Why would I? If you're having successful hatches at 50% throughout, then obviously 50% throughout is a perfectly suitable humidity, FOR YOU. It may or may not be suitable for other people, depending on what eggs they are incubating, whether they were shipped, what incubator they are using, the temperature of the room the bator is in, whether it is air conditioned, what their local weather conditions are, what their altitude is, and probably another dozen or so things I haven't thought of. Likewise, the person who mentioned earlier that they run their hatches at 50% and 70% has obviously found THEIR ideal humidity, and so this doesn't refer to them either.

I was specifically talking about the situation you had mentioned, where people are running at 50% then 70% and having drowned chicks. In that scenario ONLY, I said that I would be almost certain that the problem would be caused by the 50% during days 1-18, not the 70% during days 18-21, and I did give my reasons. If an egg loses enough moisture, the chick will not drown. If an egg loses enough moisture during days 1-18, it will not regain any of it during days 18-21, even in very high humidity. So if the humidity has been correct (i.e. such that the egg has lost the correct amount of moisture) days 1-18, the chick will not drown due to very high lockdown humidity. I would almost like to say it's just not possible, but that would be incorrect. It most likely IS possible, after all, given a large enough test number, almost anything is possible. But it is not probable. Overly high humidity specifically in lockdown can no doubt cause other problems, but drowning isn't one of them.

A chick cannot drown before it internally pips, as it isn't trying to breathe air until that point. So while a chick will never drown during days 1-18, that doesn't mean that the humidity during days 1-18 is not what eventually causes the chick to drown. It's just a delayed reaction. The chick drowns while in lockdown, so people's first thought tends to be that because the chick drowned after they raised the humidity, that's what is to blame for the drowning. But it's not.

we where have a quit discussion, why are you getting nasty, what I have said is my opinion, I'm not yelling at you, (caps), why are you yelling at me, this is your opinion, please don't yell anymore its not nice