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Allie & Bino, the albino orpington chicks
- Thread starter chippysmom327
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I was meaning even in full grown chickens I'm assuming the sun hurts them lol excuse me if I'm way off
The adults are kept in a barn with West Windows, muted light.
Light is the big question. I don't know it's effects. I can make someone, but there isn't a lot of information about albinism in poultry out there. @chippysmom and I are basically learning as we go. Generally, I'm told, albinos are not kept. I'm the last person to say yes or no, this was an accident. I don't know. I'll hopefully get some pictures in a week or so of the survivors.
Light is the big question. I don't know it's effects. I can make someone, but there isn't a lot of information about albinism in poultry out there. @chippysmom and I are basically learning as we go. Generally, I'm told, albinos are not kept. I'm the last person to say yes or no, this was an accident. I don't know. I'll hopefully get some pictures in a week or so of the survivors.
This is interesting. I have not read the entire thread but thought I would post, it may have already been said and apologies if so.
In ornamental birds, cockatiels and English budgies, my experience says albino is sex linked. If you use a albino male with any, non albino female you will get ALL female albino chicks. Any other color are males which will carry the albino gene and pass it to their daughters 50% of the time(on non albino hens) and their son's 50% of the time will be split to albino, meaning you can't see it, but it's there and will express itself in their female offspring. It's only through breeding you can figure out which males are carrying the albino gene.
If birds used the same letters as humans, although birds are opposite of human..
Male birds are XX and females would be XY. This means a female can not carry a sex linked gene but can only express(show) it. So there would be no split to albino hens, they either are or are not albino. Only males can carry the hidden gene.
This would be a very easy way to sex the chicks right at hatch if it is sex linked as I suspect
Now I'll go read the rest of the thread and see how much I put my foot in my mouth haha.
ah one other thing. I've noticed with my cockatiels and English budgies, that albino (or white faced lutino) are slower to develop than non albino birds. They feather slower and if not bred properly can have a HUGE bald spot on the top of their heads, which might not affect chickens much since they have combs, but something to look out for. The bald spot is one reason it's never advised to breed albino x albino in cockatiels. I have also seen eye issues in albino x albino that other breeders have done. Where chicks have eye deformities or fail to ever open their eyes, which again may not affect chickens since their eyes are open at birth.
Beautiful chickens!!
I'm going to have to sit down after work tonight and absorb this!
Thank you for the insights!
I hope it helps in your albino project!
I'll attempt a chart below which may help in understanding the sex linked albino as I understand it. I'm human and do make mistakes though haha.
Albino male x non albino female = 100% albino female, 100% non albino male split or carrying albino.
Using the chicks above..
Albino female x non albino male = 100% non albino females, 100% non albino males split to or carrying the albino gene.
NON albino male(carrying or split to albino) x non albino female = 50%(25%) female chicks are albino, 50% female chicks are non albino, 50%(25%) male chicks carry or are split for albino and 50%(25%) male non albino carriers.
The 25%'s are over all clutch sizes. so if you had 4 chicks, 1/4 is 25% on average. This also assumes a 50/50 split on male to female ratio's.
Taking a male who carries albino(he will show a normal color but carry this albino gene) and breeding to a albino hen is the best way to get a high percentage of albino chicks of both sexes with less abnormalities if they prove to have them.
so...
Male non albino (split or carrying albino) x Albino hen = 50%(25%) albino female chicks, 50%(25%)non albino female chicks. 50%(25%) Albino male, 50%(25%) non albino male who carries or is split to albino.
Albino x albino is 100% of all chicks of both sexes being albino as you know. This pairing could tell you what abnormalities to expect and how over all weak this gene causes chicks to be. I'd expect high mortality, birth defects, early death in shell or even failure to develop.
So using that info, any chick Bino has that is albino is most likely a female unless it's mother is albino. All of Bino's boy chicks will look like normal dark eyed chicks but carry the albino gene and will pass it to 50% of their daughters.
The father (xx) gives one of his X's to the girl offspring and since he's albino on both X's, the girl IS albino (she receives the Y from her mother and it's not a color gene).
The father gives one of his X genes to his son. This X gene will be albino since that's all the father has. if the son gets a normal X from his mother he's a normal color but carries albino on the other X he got from dad. If his father gives him a albino X gene and his mother gives him the 2nd albino X gene, the son is albino.
the mother(xy) gives her X, think of this gene as the one which shows mother's color, she gives this X to her son. So if mom is albino her son will have albino on one of his X's. This means he will hide that color if the color of his other X received from dad is dominate like a normal color.
The mother will give her Y gene to her daughters. It has no bearing on daughter's color. Only the father's X gene will determine daughter color.
Don't disregard your dark eyed chicks from Bino's first hatch. They are most likely boys who carry that albino and will produce a lot of hens who are albino! I would use Bino's sons to albino hens. That gives you the highest safe percentage of albino chicks in both sexes.
If this albino gene is not sex linked my little biology lesson is useless. BUT albino is a sex linked gene in other birds.
This also gives you a easy way of adding new blood or diluting without loosing the albino gene. You can add a unrelated hen to Bino. this makes 100% albino females and 100% male normal color (albino carriers) who are only 1/2 related to your current bloodlines. This can dilute your blood lines so less recessive abnormalities show up. It is also a way to get the albino into different chicken breeds although some inbreeding will have to be done to get back to the standard of a different chicken type.
I'll attempt a chart below which may help in understanding the sex linked albino as I understand it. I'm human and do make mistakes though haha.
Albino male x non albino female = 100% albino female, 100% non albino male split or carrying albino.
Using the chicks above..
Albino female x non albino male = 100% non albino females, 100% non albino males split to or carrying the albino gene.
NON albino male(carrying or split to albino) x non albino female = 50%(25%) female chicks are albino, 50% female chicks are non albino, 50%(25%) male chicks carry or are split for albino and 50%(25%) male non albino carriers.
The 25%'s are over all clutch sizes. so if you had 4 chicks, 1/4 is 25% on average. This also assumes a 50/50 split on male to female ratio's.
Taking a male who carries albino(he will show a normal color but carry this albino gene) and breeding to a albino hen is the best way to get a high percentage of albino chicks of both sexes with less abnormalities if they prove to have them.
so...
Male non albino (split or carrying albino) x Albino hen = 50%(25%) albino female chicks, 50%(25%)non albino female chicks. 50%(25%) Albino male, 50%(25%) non albino male who carries or is split to albino.
Albino x albino is 100% of all chicks of both sexes being albino as you know. This pairing could tell you what abnormalities to expect and how over all weak this gene causes chicks to be. I'd expect high mortality, birth defects, early death in shell or even failure to develop.
So using that info, any chick Bino has that is albino is most likely a female unless it's mother is albino. All of Bino's boy chicks will look like normal dark eyed chicks but carry the albino gene and will pass it to 50% of their daughters.
The father (xx) gives one of his X's to the girl offspring and since he's albino on both X's, the girl IS albino (she receives the Y from her mother and it's not a color gene).
The father gives one of his X genes to his son. This X gene will be albino since that's all the father has. if the son gets a normal X from his mother he's a normal color but carries albino on the other X he got from dad. If his father gives him a albino X gene and his mother gives him the 2nd albino X gene, the son is albino.
the mother(xy) gives her X, think of this gene as the one which shows mother's color, she gives this X to her son. So if mom is albino her son will have albino on one of his X's. This means he will hide that color if the color of his other X received from dad is dominate like a normal color.
The mother will give her Y gene to her daughters. It has no bearing on daughter's color. Only the father's X gene will determine daughter color.
Don't disregard your dark eyed chicks from Bino's first hatch. They are most likely boys who carry that albino and will produce a lot of hens who are albino!
I would use Bino's sons to albino hens. That gives you the highest safe percentage of albino chicks in both sexes.If this albino gene is not sex linked my little biology lesson is useless. BUT albino is a sex linked gene in other birds.
This also gives you a easy way of adding new blood or diluting without loosing the albino gene. You can add a unrelated hen to Bino. this makes 100% albino females and 100% male normal color (albino carriers) who are only 1/2 related to your current bloodlines. This can dilute your blood lines so less recessive abnormalities show up. It is also a way to get the albino into different chicken breeds although some inbreeding will have to be done to get back to the standard of a different chicken type.
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Using the info above with Allie.
Allie is XY, her X contains the albino gene and is the gene she will give to her sons.
Allie will not produce any albino offspring herself unless her mate carries a hidden albino gene on one of his X's. It's HER male offspring which will produce the albino's. Allie would be a grandmother when you see the albino color come back.
If Allie is bred to a normal rooster she will have all normal colored offspring but her sons will be carriers 100% of the hidden albino gene. Her hen chicks will not be carriers since they get their color X gene from their normal colored father.
Normal rooster x Allie (albino) = 100% male normal color carrying the hidden albino. 100% normal female offspring.
IF you breed one of Allie's sons (or Bino's sons) back to her(Allie), then you start seeing the albino show up in both sexes or if using Allie's son and a unrelated female, you see albino female chicks. I would not use Allie's daughters and it's explained later why.
Allie's son(or one of Bino's) (XX, one of his X's is albino the other is his dominate color) x Allie (XalbinoY) = 25% Male albino, 25% male non albino who carry albino on one X, 25% albino female, 25% normal non albino female.
Allie's eggs contain male's who do carry albino. Using Allie's eggs(males) to unrelated females will produce 50% of female chicks with albino coloring (little Allies). 50% of female chicks is only 25% of overall clutch using a 50/50 ratio of males to females born.
Allie's female chicks from a normal rooster father do not carry albino and should be disregarded for the albino project. At this point it would be better to use unrelated females to dilute possible recessive abnormalities. Allie's sons are the albino carriers and will get just as many albino hen chicks off a unrelated hen as they would from a sister. They would produce a higher percentage of albino chicks with Allie herself being both mom and grandmom.
Both Allie and Bino have a bright future for anyone who wants to work with Albino's
Allie is XY, her X contains the albino gene and is the gene she will give to her sons.
Allie will not produce any albino offspring herself unless her mate carries a hidden albino gene on one of his X's. It's HER male offspring which will produce the albino's. Allie would be a grandmother when you see the albino color come back.
If Allie is bred to a normal rooster she will have all normal colored offspring but her sons will be carriers 100% of the hidden albino gene. Her hen chicks will not be carriers since they get their color X gene from their normal colored father.
Normal rooster x Allie (albino) = 100% male normal color carrying the hidden albino. 100% normal female offspring.
IF you breed one of Allie's sons (or Bino's sons) back to her(Allie), then you start seeing the albino show up in both sexes or if using Allie's son and a unrelated female, you see albino female chicks. I would not use Allie's daughters and it's explained later why.
Allie's son(or one of Bino's) (XX, one of his X's is albino the other is his dominate color) x Allie (XalbinoY) = 25% Male albino, 25% male non albino who carry albino on one X, 25% albino female, 25% normal non albino female.
Allie's eggs contain male's who do carry albino. Using Allie's eggs(males) to unrelated females will produce 50% of female chicks with albino coloring (little Allies). 50% of female chicks is only 25% of overall clutch using a 50/50 ratio of males to females born.
Allie's female chicks from a normal rooster father do not carry albino and should be disregarded for the albino project. At this point it would be better to use unrelated females to dilute possible recessive abnormalities. Allie's sons are the albino carriers and will get just as many albino hen chicks off a unrelated hen as they would from a sister. They would produce a higher percentage of albino chicks with Allie herself being both mom and grandmom.
Both Allie and Bino have a bright future for anyone who wants to work with Albino's
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@yellowherb
Thank you!
The third pure albino from this test hatch died, but this information is so useful. Now I just need to build and rearrange housing and get some unrelated birds so I am test this out in chickens. My overall gene pool is very small. I started with one rooster and six hens. Everything else drives from them.
I was aiming for this as my target when this gene showed up.
Thank you!
The third pure albino from this test hatch died, but this information is so useful. Now I just need to build and rearrange housing and get some unrelated birds so I am test this out in chickens. My overall gene pool is very small. I started with one rooster and six hens. Everything else drives from them.
I was aiming for this as my target when this gene showed up.
That's a beautiful bird and no one would ever guess albino in the bloodlines. Is this pattern your own creation? I'm not overly familiar with orpingtons other than buffs.
It's amazing what recessives can be hidden. I know nearly nothing about chicken genes and find them so confusing with feather color, patterns, diluting genes etc haha. Albino is a pretty simple one compared to everything else a chicken can give.
I'm hoping to learn more on my own little project of colorful patterned sultans.
If I recall your test hatch included albino x albino, it may be why you have had some chick deaths in what appear as otherwise somewhat healthy albinos. But then again, I guess everyone has some experience of chick death with no explainable reason behind it, just a failure to thrive as I think of it.
With chicks all over the place, now would be a good time to add unrelated orpingtons and since you are using those for the albino project color wouldn't really matter
I know you will anyway, but please keep us posted on if the albino is sex linked and works as it does in cockatiels.
It's amazing what recessives can be hidden. I know nearly nothing about chicken genes and find them so confusing with feather color, patterns, diluting genes etc haha. Albino is a pretty simple one compared to everything else a chicken can give.
I'm hoping to learn more on my own little project of colorful patterned sultans.
If I recall your test hatch included albino x albino, it may be why you have had some chick deaths in what appear as otherwise somewhat healthy albinos. But then again, I guess everyone has some experience of chick death with no explainable reason behind it, just a failure to thrive as I think of it.
With chicks all over the place, now would be a good time to add unrelated orpingtons and since you are using those for the albino project color wouldn't really matter
I know you will anyway, but please keep us posted on if the albino is sex linked and works as it does in cockatiels.
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- Thread starter
- #319
That genetic stuff is cool!
Extremely unfortunately, my flock was diagnosed with Mareks last summer. I can't hatch chickens ever again, which means Allie will never be a mother.
Light doesn't seem to affect her one bit. Her run is half shaded, and I let her out every day to get a change of scenery and to interact with my free range flock.
I've found that albino chicks need to be babied in order to survive. I hand fed and watered them several times a day for the first few weeks. I also used an ecoglow so they had to feel for the heat because they couldn't see.
Extremely unfortunately, my flock was diagnosed with Mareks last summer. I can't hatch chickens ever again, which means Allie will never be a mother.
Light doesn't seem to affect her one bit. Her run is half shaded, and I let her out every day to get a change of scenery and to interact with my free range flock.
I've found that albino chicks need to be babied in order to survive. I hand fed and watered them several times a day for the first few weeks. I also used an ecoglow so they had to feel for the heat because they couldn't see.
@chippysmom327
I'm so sorry to hear about your marek's. But I'm happy that Allie seems to have found herself a really nice life and it's good that she does not seem to have eye problems with light.
I'm so sorry to hear about your marek's. But I'm happy that Allie seems to have found herself a really nice life and it's good that she does not seem to have eye problems with light.
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