Anty relation between other animals and lack of predators?

[rbruno]

This might be an odd question, but I thought I would ask. I will preface it by saying I plan to make my coop and run as predator proof as possible and not looking for an answer that will allow me to cut back on my plan to house the chickens safely. So here is my question. Has any seen connection between having plenty of other prey animals (rabbits, mice, etc) around and the lack of predetors in their area? My yard has it seems tons of rabbits. My old dog unfortunately does not do the same job she did 10 years ago in keeping the rabbits out of the yard and my garden has not been the same. I have barns that every once in a while I will see a mouse, but not often. With the number of rabbits though, I am surprise I don't see a fox or other predators to keep the population down. I do have a Cooper Hawk who makes regular visits and have seen two at one time in one of my trees. But even the hawks have not kept down the rabbits. So, that is my situation and wondering how many predators I have around and if they will make trouble for my chickens. I am building my coop now, so I am thinking of ways to make it predator proof.
Rob

 

[chiques chicks]

I live in the country surrounded by fields and woods. I have very limited predator problems. My coops and runs would be considered insecure, there are even a couple chickens that are essentially feral.

I attribute much of it to the diversity of wildlife and presence of prey species. I have a game cam photo of a fox 15 feet from my coop last winter. The pop door was open. No loss, it wasn't worth scaling my wobbly fence.

Hawks have had nests within 75 yards, yet rarely if ever attack, the field provides mice and rabbits closer to them.

So yes, I believe, in my case, abundance of prey species can be advantageous. Many of the major predator problems seem to occur in more densely populated areas.

Just my $.03 ($.02, adjusted for inflation)

 

[abenardini]

Hi there,

I live in a very, very rural area myself. There is definitely an abundance of prey species on my 40 acres (from mice, rats, frogs, lizards, bugs, you name it...we've got it in FL). The trouble I've run into is not related to flying animals, but ground animals such as raccoons and opossums. I attempted to let my birds free range during the day wherever their little bird hearts desired but lost nearly all of them in a few months. They were secure at night and only eaten during the day.

Now, I have an electric poultry fence up, but I don't close the coop at night, so far no losses for more than a month. In the past, it was not unheard of to lose two birds in one afternoon.

 

[Egghead_Jr]

It's the ease of food that predators concern themselves with. A chicken will be easier to catch than a rabbit but moderate security or electric poultry netting will put rabbit back on the menu.

Aerial predators are adept at catching field mice, snakes and even rabbits. Personally I've only seen Red Tails clutching a rabbit in a tree and feel full grown chickens would not be looked at fondly by most hawks if plenty of fields are nearby. Certainly goshawk, marsh hawks and cooper's hawks are capable of killing and eating in place but hawks stay away from potentially getting injured if they can help it.

There are a few people here who when reading peoples very shoddy protection systems say "they'd be safer free ranging, all you've done is collect the birds in a small space to make it easier for predators to catch." Cracks me up because it's all to often true. Non electric 4ft fences are basically presenting a free buffet.

 

[abenardini]

Agree...it is a fine line. I did attempt to free range without limits...but like I said, they got themselves eaten in a matter of months (around 10 birds).

 

[chiques chicks]

There are a few people here who when reading peoples very shoddy protection systems say "they'd be safer free ranging, all you've done is collect the birds in a small space to make it easier for  predators to catch." Cracks me up because it's all to often true. Non electric 4ft fences are basically presenting a free buffet.

Ah, but a five foot fence on four foot posts...

It was an laziness when I did it, but the floppiness of the fence is actually a deterrent. Animals don't like the unsteadiness near the top.

It's just what has worked for me. My run area is rather large, around thirty by fifty, so enclosing the top and building fort Knox was financially prohibitive. I built what I could afford and it has worked for my location.

I built a hoop house and run out of PVC pipe for my turkey. By far my preferred method of building now. Excess wire lays on the ground to deter digging, 12x30 feet for around $200, using some on hand scraps, can build in a day or two. By far my sturdiest setup.

A lot depends on what predators you have in a given location, as well as food supply at different times of year. When the wild animals have young to feed or food supplies are low in winter seems to be when the most problems occur.

 

[Egghead_Jr]

Ah, but a five foot fence on four foot posts...

LMAO.

My full grown birds are in 164' electric net. If you've ever seen how flimsy those posts are it's the same idea as for any animal trying to climb. Of course the 4000 volts aids in deterring too.

I built a hoop house and run out of PVC pipe for my turkey. By far my preferred method of building now. Excess wire lays on the ground to deter digging, 12x30 feet for around $200, using some on hand scraps, can build in a day or two. By far my sturdiest setup.

I too do this type system for my grow out pen/ breeder pen. Built mine with 2x2 stick lumber. Bottom 4' is 14 ga 2x4 welded wire and excess was cut into 2' strips for ground protection. The top half and roof is a shameful cheap garden fencing. Works like a charm and portable. Well, slidable.

I should add that besides bear my big concern predator are coy-wolf. If I used a normal 4' barrier they'd learn to jump it. Once they start doing that a more expensive electric netting would be useless. Highly recommend starting with electric so curious animals are trained to stay away not how to defeat the barrier. I'm in the wild here and wild animals are super curious about unnatural things. As they sniff and start to paw about ZAP! Instant trianing session to keep away.

 

[JadedPhoenix]

Quote:

It was an laziness when I did it, but the floppiness of the fence is actually a deterrent. Animals don't like the unsteadiness near the top.

It's just what has worked for me. My run area is rather large, around thirty by fifty, so enclosing the top and building fort Knox was financially prohibitive. I built what I could afford and it has worked for my location.

My run is about the same size as yours and I put a netting across the top since I've had hawks try to take off with my hens and even a roo in the past. So far so good. My main predator is my current dog. We made sure that he couldn't get in and if he couldn't then we were sure that most others couldn't. Only lost a couple of chicks to black snakes in the past now as well as one hen whose head was bitten off by a coon through the fence. Other than that I've had no issues. I've even put a lock on to keep out the two legged predators after one took off about a dozen chicks one time.

I do think that having an over abundance of food available without having to resort to feeding on your chickens helps. I live out in the country with all sorts of animals, both prey and predator. And the hawks in the area are not above flying off with someone's pet dog or cat if it is small enough. I've seen it.