Ascites fluid still draining hours after needle removed

[DonyaQuick]

One of my hens developed ascites / water belly. I attempted to drain with a 20 gauge needle today. The needle only barely needed to go in and fluid dripped out at a rate of 1-2 drops per second. This lasted for about 2min and then it seemed to stop, but I clearly misjudged the degree of drainage, since it resumed dripping as soon as I removed the needle. It has now been draining through the puncture at a rate of one drop every few seconds for about 6 hours now. I have seen various other post and sources saying post-drain leaking is somewhat normal and can last for vague lengths like "a while" - but I don't know what that means in actual time ranges that are safe for chickens. Hours? A day? Her abdomen is still slowly shrinking with the post-needle drainage and she seems to have some relief. I just don't know if the puncture leaking for this long means I screwed up and if I should be trying to use medical superglue at this point.

I am aware the condition is ultimately terminal and all I can do is buy time. Right now I'm hoping I bought some weeks and not just hours, but it's also my first time seeing this in one of my birds so I'm trying not to get my hopes up.

EDIT/UPDATE: I may have answered my own question today (Mar 16 now, originally posted Mar 15)...in short, I definitely should have used an 18ga needle instead of 20. The original puncture was still leaking early this morning, so I drained her again with 18ga and it actually went like it does in the various videos I've seen on how to do it. More of a proper flow, no false stops. The newer puncture leaked rather profusely for about 2hr but may have fully stopped and closed by now, which is about 5h after the 18ga drain. It looks like it has kind of a clear scab now. I realize it may pop open and drain more if she moves around a lot but so far this is progressing very differently from the previous drain. Her overall condition isn't great so I'm still not optimistic about how this will turn out overall, but wanted to update here for any future google searchers who might be dealing with this condition for the first time like I am.

 

[Wyorp Rock]

One of my hens developed ascites / water belly. I attempted to drain with a 20 gauge needle today. The needle only barely needed to go in and fluid dripped out at a rate of 1-2 drops per second. This lasted for about 2min and then it seemed to stop, but I clearly misjudged the degree of drainage, since it resumed dripping as soon as I removed the needle. It has now been draining through the puncture at a rate of one drop every few seconds for about 6 hours now. I have seen various other post and sources saying post-drain leaking is somewhat normal and can last for vague lengths like "a while" - but I don't know what that means in actual time ranges that are safe for chickens. Hours? A day? Her abdomen is still slowly shrinking with the post-needle drainage and she seems to have some relief. I just don't know if the puncture leaking for this long means I screwed up and if I should be trying to use medical superglue at this point.

I am aware the condition is ultimately terminal and all I can do is buy time. Right now I'm hoping I bought some weeks and not just hours, but it's also my first time seeing this in one of my birds so I'm trying not to get my hopes up.

EDIT/UPDATE: I may have answered my own question today (Mar 16 now, originally posted Mar 15)...in short, I definitely should have used an 18ga needle instead of 20. The original puncture was still leaking early this morning, so I drained her again with 18ga and it actually went like it does in the various videos I've seen on how to do it. More of a proper flow, no false stops. The newer puncture leaked rather profusely for about 2hr but may have fully stopped and closed by now, which is about 5h after the 18ga drain. It looks like it has kind of a clear scab now. I realize it may pop open and drain more if she moves around a lot but so far this is progressing very differently from the previous drain. Her overall condition isn't great so I'm still not optimistic about how this will turn out overall, but wanted to update here for any future google searchers who might be dealing with this condition for the first time like I am.

How is she doing now?

I see you gave an update, did she perk up a little after draining?

 

[fldiver97]

One of my hens developed ascites / water belly. I attempted to drain with a 20 gauge needle today. The needle only barely needed to go in and fluid dripped out at a rate of 1-2 drops per second. This lasted for about 2min and then it seemed to stop, but I clearly misjudged the degree of drainage, since it resumed dripping as soon as I removed the needle. It has now been draining through the puncture at a rate of one drop every few seconds for about 6 hours now. I have seen various other post and sources saying post-drain leaking is somewhat normal and can last for vague lengths like "a while" - but I don't know what that means in actual time ranges that are safe for chickens. Hours? A day? Her abdomen is still slowly shrinking with the post-needle drainage and she seems to have some relief. I just don't know if the puncture leaking for this long means I screwed up and if I should be trying to use medical superglue at this point.

I am aware the condition is ultimately terminal and all I can do is buy time. Right now I'm hoping I bought some weeks and not just hours, but it's also my first time seeing this in one of my birds so I'm trying not to get my hopes up.

EDIT/UPDATE: I may have answered my own question today (Mar 16 now, originally posted Mar 15)...in short, I definitely should have used an 18ga needle instead of 20. The original puncture was still leaking early this morning, so I drained her again with 18ga and it actually went like it does in the various videos I've seen on how to do it. More of a proper flow, no false stops. The newer puncture leaked rather profusely for about 2hr but may have fully stopped and closed by now, which is about 5h after the 18ga drain. It looks like it has kind of a clear scab now. I realize it may pop open and drain more if she moves around a lot but so far this is progressing very differently from the previous drain. Her overall condition isn't great so I'm still not optimistic about how this will turn out overall, but wanted to update here for any future google searchers who might be dealing with this condition for the first time like I am.

I also did my first drain with a 20 ga needle, slow drain as you described and some leakage after removal of needle. I had to stop draining as she was getting increasingly squirmy and distressed. I didn’t drain sufficient amount of ascites and had some leakage after removal but it was not as pronounced as your situation. The fluid accumulated rather quickly and Eadie ( black Australorp) was getting worse, barely moved, weight loss and her comb was turning purplish grey. I drained her again (2 days after initial drainage), this time with 18 ga needle and ascites was flowing out. She tolerated it better this time and her color and breathing improved quickly. Not much leaking after needle removal and her belly was greatly reduced. I kept her on Nutri drench for a while and fed her wet mash with smushed up sardines, scrambled eggs, yogurt etc for a couple of days while I had her inside and figured she would get more fluid in her belly again after a while and eventually pass away. That was almost a year ago. She gained weight, was able to be reintegrated with the flock once she was eating well and looks like she never had a problem. She never laid an egg again but she is happy and healthy, at least for now

 

[DonyaQuick]

How is she doing now?

I see you gave an update, did she perk up a little after draining?

She's still in rough shape, but at least the 18ga puncture sealed up solidly within 12h (it did intermittenly leak if she wiggled a lot but was definitely trying to seal up after just a couple hours). I think it hurts a lot to try to use the muscles on her abdomen and inner upper leg. Putting her tail up definitely hurts - she winces if I even gently lift it when I'm trying to inspect her backside. She can move fairly normally if she really gets a bee in her bonet about something, but after a short stint of movement she winces and sits back down. She's eating and drinking well with a preference for soft foods and getting periodic electrolyte water. Her comb and face have remained pink/red depending on temperature. She had some bad, dark brusing fanning out around the 20ga puncture that is mostly gone now. The 18ga puncture never had bruising. Her abdomen was initially quite red after that drain but is returning to pink. She is on a medication to prevent infections. The past couple of days she was completely flopped on my lap a lot. Today she is being more inclined to sit up a bit and use her legs to hold herself steady, although still on her hocks.

For additional context, this hen has unfortunatley been a bird of many health issues for well over a year now. She's been a fighter through it every time so I've been trying to manage each situation as it arises as long as she shows the will, but it's been one curve ball after another. She is Raven described in this thread: https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/skipped-molts-trying-to-figure-out-why.1665137/ She and her sister skipped what should have been their first molts, got tapeworms (twice), had some inexplicable gut impactions, and the past few months have been developing more obviously metabolic issues with temperature regulation and reproductive problems. It's been a persistent and rough path unlike anything else I've had to deal with in any of my other 30+ birds.

 

[DonyaQuick]

I also did my first drain with a 20 ga needle, slow drain as you described and some leakage after removal of needle. I had to stop draining as she was getting increasingly squirmy and distressed. I didn’t drain sufficient amount of ascites and had some leakage after removal but it was not as pronounced as your situation. The fluid accumulated rather quickly and Eadie ( black Australorp) was getting worse, barely moved, weight loss and her comb was turning purplish grey. I drained her again (2 days after initial drainage), this time with 18 ga needle and ascites was flowing out. She tolerated it better this time and her color and breathing improved quickly. Not much leaking after needle removal and her belly was greatly reduced.

I also saw singificantly more wiggle and distress with the 20ga needle. That's probably what faked me out thinking the flow was stopping and probalby also why that puncture bruised so badly. I think it was the viscocity of the fluid that made the 20ga go so poorly in my case at least compared to the 18ga one. I gather the viscocity can vary depending on what exactly is causing the fluid. I still dont know the exact cause for my hen.