Barred Chicken Genetics

[Matilda Belle]

I’ve recently started a barred silkie/satin (cuckoo) pen and am looking for some general advice on how to breed correctly. From what I hear, sometimes the barring fades and you will need to add black to the pen to keep the nice barring contrast. Is this true?

Right now I have one double barred satin cockerel, two cuckoo silkie hens and one black satin hen. Do you think one black hen is enough?
Any advice is appreciated

 

[Lady of McCamley]

Someone more knowledgeable with Silkie breeding will likely correct me, but I'm curious what your goals are. Barring or cuckooing?

Barring is crisp because the feathers grow at the same rate. Cuckoo is diffused as the feather rate is faster causing an "offset" in the feathering and thus barring.

I'm not sure how clean you'll get any barring by mixing barred with cuckoo...you'll get a mix in your generations that I think would be a headache for awhile...but I'm used to using layer type breeds and not Silkie feathering.

Wouldn't it be better to take the barred roo and simply breed over your black hen? Then all babes would be barred and not cuckooed.

F1 barred roo over black hen will produce 100% single gene barring, both sexes. Take the best of that progeny and breed back to the barred father to produce double barred males and single barred females. Continue to select the best barred for breedbacks to the father to keep double barred males and single barred females. About F5, begin to cross breed between generations of best such as F4 roo over F5 female.

Personally I'd skip the cuckoo birds altogether if barring is what you want...but again I don't work with Silkies.

My opinion.
LofMc

 

[Matilda Belle]

I’m going to sound really dumb, but I thought cuckoo and barred were the same thing. The actual breeds I have are cuckoo silkies and cuckoo satins.

Thanks for sharing your knowledge. Maybe it will be a bit of trial and error for awhile.

 

[Matilda Belle]

Here are some pics of what I have for cuckoos right now.

 

[The Moonshiner]

Cuckoo and barred are the same thing.
When on a slow feathering breed its called barred. When it's a fast feathering breed its called cuckoo.

 

[Lady of McCamley]

Barred is crisp (mostly even) lines that come from slow feather allowing the barring (depigmented areas) to grow evenly.

Cuckoo is more diffuse and softer looking. Faster feathering causes the depigmented areas to offset producing a "cuckoo" instead of "barring."

If you are working with cuckoo rooster, cuckoo hens, and a black hen...it will be trial and error to see who produces the best cuckooing.

You can breed the cuckoo roo over the cuckoo hens and take the best. That actually may be your best plan as it will further double gene cuckoo roos and single gene cuckoo females.

I find the irregularities begin with hybrid colors...breeding a barred/cuckoo roo to a solid black, at least the first generation, as you then immediately go down to single cuckoo/barring.

However, I have heard the breed to black to crispen rule too...but I have not seen that thus far in my efforts working with barring...black just becomes dominant or my patterns diffuse.

So personally, my fastest route has been to breed pure cuckoo/barred roo to pure cuckoo/barred females. IF and when you begin to see poor coloring, you may decide to create a second, separate line of cuckoo roo over black hen, producing the single gene males and females, and then line breed back to the cuckoo roo to regain double gene males, single gene females.

I would avoid immediately mixing the lines of cuckoo/cuckoo to cuckoo/black as you will be fighting diluting your cuckoo genes.

Does that make sense? My experience again with non-Silkie breeds. (I keep lovely Silkie ladies as brooding hens, but I don't breed Silkies).

LofMc

FYI
Photo of barring:

Photo of cuckoo

 

[Lady of McCamley]

Cuckoo and barred are the same thing.
When on a slow feathering breed its called barred. When it's a fast feathering breed its called cuckoo.

Agreed. The gene causing the depigmentation is the same for cuckoo or barring, however they are not technically the same (edited to add results) as the fast feathering gene diffuses the pattern while slow feathering makes the pattern crisp.

Which is why I don't recommend breeding barring to cuckoo if you want to keep one or the other...that is just inviting headache if you want to set a line.

But fortunately the OP is just working with cuckoo.

LofMc

 

[Matilda Belle]

Good info. Thank you!!

 

[The Moonshiner]

Agreed. The gene causing the depigmentation is the same for cuckoo or barring, however they are not technically the same as the fast feathering gene diffuses the pattern while slow feathering makes the pattern crisp.

Which is why I don't recommend breeding barring to cuckoo if you want to keep one or the other...that is just inviting headache if you want to set a line.

But fortunately the OP is just working with cuckoo.

LofMc

But unless your crossing breeds you don't have to worry about it and if you are you're not setting a line.
I have leghorns so theyre cuckoo. I can't ever encounter barred as a pattern because theres no slow feathering genes in leghorns.
I don't see it as a gene being not technically the same.
Its the same gene just expressed differently.

 

[nicalandia]

Would this be Barred or Cuckoo?