Black Copper Marans discussion thread

[Wynette]

So good to see you! Math Ace posted a real nice comment in the Marans thread about you.

I hope you stick around....

 

[BarnGoddess01]

Lonnyandrinda:

Just one person's opinion here:

I would use a more correct female in both type and color... The eyes are not acceptable if you are trying to breed forward to standard... She is less than a substantial bird for substance and she carries not enough melaniser in the chest to make good males. You may see female that look ok from this crop but it would be difficult to breed forward witht he pair. The sickle tail on the male is a less desireable trait, however he looks acceptable in general. You will likely not produce better than him in male offspring. I cannot see the females comb from these but it is really important on the females as they have a lot to say for the future offspring.

I am curious about the "not enough melaniser in the chest" comment. Will you elaborate on that? I haven't heard that comment before. Is it because the chest appears to be a dull black?

 

[geebs]

Not enough black in the chest... The females need to be nice and black.. they carry twice as much of black melaniser.. If they are not carrying a "hard" color meaning the bird is VERY black all over then they will not have enough to cross with a male that only carries half the amount of black...Just saying... This explains why the birds legs are black and her eye color is acceptable at bay... She carries more genetically and can hide more gene.. when you see a weakness in the black where there shouldn't be one... it will not carry enough to breed on a SOP standard male to make anything worthwhile in the next male generation... However she is likely to reproduce herself just fine....This is the results I have had.

However this being said... It is possible to take an overmelanised male and see what ya get.. but then you have to ask yourself..... why?

 

[lonnyandrinda]

Lonnyandrinda:

Just one person's opinion here:

I would use a more correct female in both type and color... The eyes are not acceptable if you are trying to breed forward to standard... She is less than a substantial bird for substance and she carries not enough melaniser in the chest to make good males. You may see female that look ok from this crop but it would be difficult to breed forward witht he pair. The sickle tail on the male is a less desireable trait, however he looks acceptable in general. You will likely not produce better than him in male offspring. I cannot see the females comb from these but it is really important on the females as they have a lot to say for the future offspring.

Thank you I really appreciate you taking the time to educate me on this. One further question on the type issue- is it simply size you are going by? She is quite young (about 30 weeks), should she be larger at this age? Here's one more picture of her. Her comb does look a little off to me. It also shows her chest better. She looks pretty solidly black to me... also this was a super bright morning so that's washing out her feather color in the photo (not the greatest camera). Not trying to beg the point, I have what I have but I do want to aim for better.



I will get some pictures of my other two in quarantine to ask a few more questions on.

 

[geebs]

Might be the angle... but the center shafts on the bird... spine of the feather looks light... could be bad pic...I think Don refers to it as "shafting". I am not fond of the eye color, however she has a lovely hackle and nice legs/feet. They eye color is acceptable to to bay but these look a little too dark.. when the eyes are too dark I haven't had good luck with the hens... all kinds of wierd "skittles" pop up (skittle....colored offspring not conforming to the desired achievement)

She looks small and refined... the breed standard states dual purpose.. that means meaty... and lots of eggs. Marans are not the incredible production birds if they are laying thier super darkies so they better carry their weight in the wieght carrying department if ya know what I mean

 

[Jenikate]

Havent been posting here since I dont breed, but I love getting info from you all regarding this breed.
Looking for some hatching eggs or chicks and wondering if anyone recommends a breeder? I feel like doing the random internet search makes me feel like I get no where...everyone claims to have dark eggs and perfect lines.
Really, the only thing that is important to me is egg color. I have 2 girls now that lay solid 5's .... Hoping to get some girls that will lay darker.
Any recommendations are appreciated.
Thank you!

 

[geebs]

There is no perfect egg or perfect bird... those two things do NOT belong in the marans thread... The most perfected egg color to date for me has come from the genetic messes and conformation defects. These birds laid about 4 to 5 eggs a week at peak lay... The prettier birds suffered some egg color loss as I weeded out genetic defect... So pick your poison IMHO. I don't know anyone near you... The best way...Cash and Carry.... at least see the eggs.. that will at least give you 1/2 the scenario... Hopefully they weren't fertized by a leghorn!!!

 

[Jenikate]

There is no perfect egg or perfect bird... those two things do NOT belong in the marans thread... The most perfected egg color to date for me has come from the genetic messes and conformation defects. These birds laid about 4 to 5 eggs a week at peak lay... The prettier birds suffered some egg color loss as I weeded out genetic defect... So pick your poison IMHO. I don't know anyone near you... The best way...Cash and Carry.... at least see the eggs.. that will at least give you 1/2 the scenario... Hopefully they weren't fertized by a leghorn!!!

I know there is no "perfect". I do have 2 FBCM hens now that are giving me some nice eggs. Just looking for some more dark egg layers and thought someone in this forum might point me in the right direction of an honest seller. FBCM breeders or sellers are few and far between locally for me. The one I bought my 2 from doesnt sell anymore. I am just a back yard hobbyist, with no roos, so I dont breed my own.

 

[geebs]

FYI even the most "honest seller" cannot guarantee the result in any cross..... and a good qualified layer one year will have lighter eggs the next... Just as the melanistics of the bird age on the outside... the color wains on the egg over time... Just saying.... Understand the dynamics of the breed and then rely on the most credible and deal with dissappointment accordingly.... It is a way less perfect world in the Maransland. I haven't been on here for a while but if you go to the sales of eggs section.. find someone who has been here a looooong time and has good history.. It is worth the homework... If you go short on the homework you are less likely to be satified with the result of the purchase. Good luck!!!

 

[ashandvine]

Regarding the melanizing genes... is the lighter legs a sign of low melanizers? I have a male here whose legs are so light. He is also very straw/gold colored in his hackles and saddle that it seems like a good explanation.