Black Copper Marans discussion thread

[pinkchick]

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BASICS at the tiny, tiny, tiny size .. . .

Check the feet - - - The legs ( shanks) should be Grey / slate. If they are green, yellow, or white. . . . you got trouble.
Check the toes - - - The toes are pinkish.


LATER - - - as they grow LOOK at the
combs - - A 5 point comb is the goal, BUT DO NOT CULL BECAUSE OF POINTS. A bad comb is not too hard to fix.
Cull for things like side sprigs.

Color - - As the chicks start to feather in, watch for color.
HENS - - should be ALL BLACK except for copper in the neck.
ROOS - - All Black except in the hackle and saddle area which should be anywhere in the copper to mahgony color range.

EYE COLOR - - - will change as they grow . . . The eyes should eventually be an orangey color described as "BAY"


BODY shape - - - THESE SHOULD be BIG, CHUNKY birds. They were originally DUAL PURPOSE.
They should have a rectangular shape to the body.
Chests should be WIDE.
The width of the Back should be wide.

These are the basics. There is very little you can cull for at an early age. I would not plan on doing any culling before 16 weeks. A roo that is over colored works well with a hen that is under colored. The opposite is true too. So, it is not a case of picking the very best individuals. It is a case of picking the couple or trio that complements each other the best. With the hens, you don't even want to choose them until you find out what color egg they lay. So, most decisions are not going to be made until 6 months of age - - - at the earliest.


This is my strategy. I am sure others do it different.
Hope this helps you out. . . Sit back and enjoy the babies.

By the way, the roo's attitude comes into play too. IF he is PERFECT, but is attacking you . . .. then soup pot time. Marans should be nice birds. I have 2 youth that I am growing out now. The one has too much copper in his chest for my girls. . .. . He is showing signs of being nasty too. He will be gone in one more month - - - at that 16 week mark. The other one has better coloring for my girls. He has a longer back and better body too. HOWEVER, if he gets nasty after his brother is removed . . . I will not use him. His daddy has been a darling, so there is no reason to have a JERK for a son. . . . .

All Black except in the head, hackle, shoulders, back, wing bow, and saddle. Breast can be black or black with slight copper marks.

Excellent little check off list you got goin' on there too Ms. Lisa! Nice Job Girl!

 

[math ace]

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WELCOME rottnjen. . . Let me see if I can help you out

How old is your hen that is PURE black? On some lines that copper pops almost immediately with the first set of real feathers. On other lines, the copped does not show up until the pullets are much older, like 20 - 30 weeks old. From what I have seen on the Wade Jeane line - - - - they tend to copper later and not as much as other lines.

I would not assume that you received BLACKS. They are much rarer to come by than BCMs.

If your girls are lacking copper, then you want the male to be heavy in copper coloring. This is a case where if the roo has a FEW spots of coppering in his chest . . . then you have made an even better love connection.

It is possible to candle a marans egg, but you need a super bright flashlight.
There are a few on here who can tell you where to get and which model to get for the flashlight.

I recently had GREAT success using a heat lamp reflector with another heat lamp reflector taped to it. That way the light from the one lamp was FUNNELED through the other hole in the other reflector. . . I candled my marans eggs through day 14 without any trouble. I had to move quickly when I was candling them BECAUSE there was some major heat come through that set-up.

 

[Mrs MIA]

I use a 2M candlepower spotlight modified with a metal coffee can with a hole in it to candle the eggs.

Hubby's upset because I commandeered the thing...

 

[math ace]

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Thanks Pink for correcting me. . .


ADozenGirlz - - -
What Pink is saying is when you look at your roo from the top ( not the sides or front - - stand over him and Look DOWN) you should see color from the top of his head, down his neck, across his shoulders and back. The copper / mahagony should STOP at the tail.

When you look at a mature roo from the front - - His chest should be BLACK with a 10 % or so allowance for additional coppering . mahagony.

Keep watching the thread and you will see more pictures posted of roos. It seems harder to get a good roo than a good hen. . .

 

[pinkchick]

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Welcome!

If your roo is a Black Copper, so is your girl, she just isn't showing any copper that you can see. She has other genes going on that can cover the copper or severly darken it, but it is still there.
Solid pure Black Marans are rare and hard to come by, they are not based on the ER (Birchen) gene that the Black Coppers are, but rather the E (Extended Black). Yes, you could still breed them, the roo that you put over them needs to counter what she does not have. i.e., use a male that shows more color.
I have 4 pullets that are very dark, maybe one or two copper feathers in the hackle and a couple others have none, I will breed them to a male that shows nice copper in the head, hackles, back, shoulders, wing bow and saddles and a couple of copper flecks in his chest in hopes of improving the female offsprings hackle color. If I didn't have a rooster like said rooster above, then I would look for the next best rooster that atleast has a representation of copper in the appropriate places on the body....they don't have to have full amounts of copper, but atleast show some signs of it in it respective areas (this tells me that he has the genes to give to his kids that tells the other genes to allow copper to go to that place on the body with any luck

)
eta: It is said that the slight coppering in the males chest helps with hackle color in the next generation females, I find this very true with my Welsummers, which the males also can have the red mottling in the chest and it is sought for this particular breed and used specifically for improving characteristics and traits in the females.
Hope this helps!

BTW: Some Marans eggs may be so hard to see into, you may only be able to see the air cell developing to some slight veining.

 

[geebs]

Well Pink and Lisa... Looks like you guys covered it!!! You go Girls...

The only difference I will point out that is a fly in the milk is the difference between the suggested SOP (standard of Perfection) and the French.... The LEG COLOR... The french favor the light leg and the Americans favor the dark leg. If you are just breeding backyard birds you will find the French with a balanced amount of melaniser is achievable linebreeding. I don't know if you can linebreed and get a balance using that much black... That seems to be the big difference.. So breed what YOU like.

Oh and someone way back posted some amazing babies with the little americauna things.. I have to go back and look... Oh so cute!!! Please jump in with a particular baby that we could watch to adulthood... I posted one this morning.. I haven't heard any comments from any of you guys on her/him... So lets have it... Everyones opinion counts... all of you.... Pre K to Finishing School..

Let's hear what you think of my birdies and Please make a post like it.. you could be making history right here on BYC!!!

 

[ADozenGirlz]

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Thanks Pink for correcting me. . .


ADozenGirlz - - -
What Pink is saying is when you look at your roo from the top ( not the sides or front - - stand over him and Look DOWN) you should see color from the top of his head, down his neck, across his shoulders and back. The copper / mahagony should STOP at the tail.

When you look at a mature roo from the front - - His chest should be BLACK with a 10 % or so allowance for additional coppering . mahagony.

Keep watching the thread and you will see more pictures posted of roos. It seems harder to get a good roo than a good hen. . .

Got it. Thanks for the translation.

I'm staying tuned...

 

[geebs]

someone go snatch a pic off the web of 10 percent in the chest...Let's get visual!!!

 

[ADozenGirlz]

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That was me.

I'll band one of them and we can follow him/her to adulthood. That'll be fun!

 

[geebs]

Awesome... I am going back and see if I can "pick out a girl" and a boy..

One to the far left... Tag it and name it.. I don't know whether it is boy or girl.. Your are pretty uniform looking... the one to the far right is a good choice also.. The one in the corner could be a girl...