Black Copper Marans discussion thread

[VillageChicken]

If your "orange" BC has very pale shanks, he could be BTB. They are wheaten based, and wheaten shanks clear up really well with the ID gene compared to ER based birds.
But you'd have to have a BC hen and roo that carry wheaten and one of them has to have Db.
I doubt that's the case if you've never had any wheatens.

Don - in your dark to dark matings were you targeting hens or roos, or just hoping to get anything decent from it - something without white in wing/hackle?
- And as far as your roo that you'd hoped would put more color into his offspring - did he have good color balance or was he himself over coppered? Were you looking for him to put more color on the hens?


Isn't there a camp out there that says some of their juvies with brown feathers molted out to be clear black? Do both exist out there - lines that are "once brown always brown" and also lines that can start brown but end up with good solid black?

just trying to take some notes here and learn from what everyone's doing.

 

[snowbird]

Quote:
VC, In these dark to Dark matings I was only using what I had with no white or visible faults. The second male had exra copper and was looking for female color. I can say without a doubt if you keep the brown tinted chicks you will have brown soft feathering below the vent, and this is something I just will not accept in my Marans.

The Wade Jeane special chick that was brown hatched, started feathering in brown and now is dark with extra copper on the breast.

 

[Debbi]

Quote:
No clue. That's what dh said when we went to the Newnan show and he saw a real black tailed buff there, "hey its Agent Orange" haha but then again he doesn't know anything about them either. I saw on one website if you spread thier wings they should have certain black markings in them. I have been meaning to catch him and spread his wings and look but haven't gotten around to it. He is a nice boy but just haven't done it. The guineas pulled most his tail feathers out now so I should prob take him out of there anyways. We were planning to put him in freezer camp on the next cull. He still kicks the male guineas butts and tries to mate the females. What a horrid combo that would make.

Does BHB line throw black tailed buffs? I just read that some BCM lines can throw BTBs. I haven't gotten any wheatie chicks from her line yet from the others I bred but I haven't bred Agent Orange and wasn't planning to. Even his legs are orangy colored feathered arrgg. They were more tiger striped looking when he was younger but now they look more of a solid orangy whatever you call it.

Here is a pic of a BTB from the Newnan show. Does anyone else think he looks like Agent Orange? AO's feathers are much darker now than when he was younger (in that old pic) they are closer to this color now. I need to get an updated photo.
http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b134/sultry_jasmine_nights/Bird Shows/Newnan GA/IMGP0988.jpg

Boy, if AO isn't a BTB, he sure could fake someone! He looks like the one pictured to me. I still feel my teeth curl every time I see one of those cage cards from the Newnan show, stating the breed "MARAN".

Sheesh, whose bad was that?!

 

[Debbi]

Quote:
Debbi, I do not get any spotted young, some may have some white around the head and the chest. The pictures I posted earlier are about the norm for my chicks. The brown chick in the first hatch now just has some extra copper in the chest.

Man, I'd sure like to know where and why I'm getting all these weirdo colored chicks from! Some of these also have the spotting/barring on their breasts, although now it is starting to fade out. The lone Clyde chick was a more normal, penguin colored baby, so maybe I'm getting luckier?

 

[flgardengirl]

If your "orange" BC has very pale shanks, he could be BTB. They are wheaten based, and wheaten shanks clear up really well with the ID gene compared to ER based birds.
But you'd have to have a BC hen and roo that carry wheaten and one of them has to have Db.
I doubt that's the case if you've never had any wheatens.

I will have to go look at his shanks tomorrow. I had some good shank pics on my laptop but the hard drive messed up a few days ago and I have to order a recovery disk from Dell now, since it didn't come with one grrrrr. If that doesn't work I will have to set it up my hd as a slave to another puter and see if can get my stuff off or not. Darn I should of backed things up better!
I haven't bred that many since I just got this line last summer so there may be some wheaten in there....I was mostly just planning on using the girls with other males since I didn't like a few traits in the bhb males but the females are real nice and a bigger size than some of my others and lay huge eggs.

I wonder if anyone else with the BHB line of black coppers has any wheaten or BTB popping up? I need to figure out if I should keep Agent Orange or not because dh wants to cull as in freezer camp a bunch of roos next weekend.

Debbie I wish you were at the show with me LOL! I can just see you sneaking by the cages with your little pen scribbling an S on the end of all the Maran signs

 

[geebs]

BHB carries wheaton... YEP... you have to test mate everything to eliminate it. It wouldn't surprise me to find out the Carrie BTB also... A treasure trove of color the BHB's are.... and the eggs!!!

 

[math ace]

Quote:
At some point, we may be able to state things for certain. .. .

Perhaps, most of what is stated is THEORY. However, I would think once someone has hatch the LARGE numbers that you have . . . .it becomes more than THEORY and should be stated in the internet. .. . .

I am wondering how much of our observations and Theorys are limited to the lines or specific genes in our own birds .. . .
In other words, what one person knows for a FACT in their flock may not be a FACT in someone elses flock.

Take PINK for example, she can feather sex her marans with a pretty high success rate.
My marans do not feather sex....

We may find some ABSOLUTE truths with the marans, but we may find a lot of things that are true only within a limited spectrum.

Just thinking and I LOVE the ideas that do bounce around on this forum!
Even if we are just discussing THERORIES, it get the brain working and considering options.

 

[math ace]

I know it is a pain. . . SNOWBIRD . . .but I would love to see

1.) a picture of the mating pair
2.) a picture of the resulting chick.

I want to see how dark the dark on dark mating was . ..

Then I want to see what the chicks are looking at that you thinking are looking real good. I ask for this so that I can see what "looks good" looks like

THANK you

 

[snowbird]

Quote:
Lisa, Not a Dark pair, I had four dark males and 28 dark females running together . these are very close related but the only males I had left after culling. Some of these female are mostly black. All the chick photo are mostly out of this dark mating. Today is culling day so no pictures today. I will wait a couple of weeks on these young. The only thing left to wait on is see if they have white feathers after the juve molt.

This is the main reason I always say single mate if at all possible. From now on everything I hatch will be single mated. I finally have some nice young males growing.

 

[flgardengirl]

Quote:
Thank you geebs

Good thing I still have my entire flock of bhb. I was gonna cull out a couple males and only keep one male. I guess I will do some more test matings. From my bhb females, I have one that has way more copper (mossy on the chest area) than the others. Maybe I will put her with AO and see what happens. Most of the other females are pretty dark.

Snowbird you should set up a website with all this precious information and research that you have done on your Marans or even write a book or e-book...